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08/22/2008 03:26:41 PM · #201 |
Originally posted by BeeCee:
Okay, I'm sorry now I asked ;) |
So you should be. What did you think was going to happen? ;) |
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08/22/2008 03:27:47 PM · #202 |
Originally posted by BeeCee:
Lol, sheesh, there's no such thing as prescience! |
How can you hold this view simultaneously with the view that there is an uncharted sixth sense impervious to science? |
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08/22/2008 03:28:18 PM · #203 |
Originally posted by Sam94720:
P.S.: My hamster died ten minutes ago. I think you cursed it. You can certainly not dismiss the possibility! I have been there. |
Uhhhhhmmmm. Sorry Sam. That was my bad. I didn't know he couldn't eat chocolate. ;) |
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08/22/2008 03:29:05 PM · #204 |
Originally posted by BeeCee:
Okay, I'm sorry now I asked ;) |
It's all good :) |
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08/22/2008 03:32:56 PM · #205 |
Originally posted by love32907:
Originally posted by BeeCee:
Okay, I'm sorry now I asked ;) |
It's all good :) |
According to you "It's all God" :-)) |
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08/22/2008 03:34:36 PM · #206 |
Originally posted by Sam94720:
Before we get too far off topic:  NikonJeb, would you mind coming back to this?
Originally posted by Sam94720:
So you saw a flying object you could not identify. There's a multitude of possible explanations. It might have been extraterrestrials. Or a weather balloon. Or a military aircraft. Or the Flying Spaghetti Monster. Or a flying teapot. Or a transmissible disease that made you hallucinate. Or a message from the other side. etc. etc.
I don't know what it was. Maybe one day we'll find out. Until then I can live with the uncertainty.
You, on the other hand, seem to prefer one explanation over all the others. Why?
About your ball lightning: Ehm, yes, you saw some ball lightning. The three paragraphs above apply.
P.S.: My hamster died ten minutes ago. I think you cursed it. You can certainly not dismiss the possibility! I have been there. |
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To what?
Your being a smartass about what I saw?
The curse on your hamster?
Your dismissal of my wife's and my ball lightning sighting?
No matter what I've said, you've either dismissed it out of hand, told me to prove it to your pal Randi, or just plain ridiculed it.
So yes, I mind, and I really have nothing further for you.
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08/22/2008 03:37:43 PM · #207 |
Originally posted by NikonJeb:
Originally posted by Sam94720:
Before we get too far off topic: NikonJeb, would you mind coming back to this?
Originally posted by Sam94720:
So you saw a flying object you could not identify. There's a multitude of possible explanations. It might have been extraterrestrials. Or a weather balloon. Or a military aircraft. Or the Flying Spaghetti Monster. Or a flying teapot. Or a transmissible disease that made you hallucinate. Or a message from the other side. etc. etc.
I don't know what it was. Maybe one day we'll find out. Until then I can live with the uncertainty.
You, on the other hand, seem to prefer one explanation over all the others. Why?
About your ball lightning: Ehm, yes, you saw some ball lightning. The three paragraphs above apply.
P.S.: My hamster died ten minutes ago. I think you cursed it. You can certainly not dismiss the possibility! I have been there. |
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To what?
Your being a smartass about what I saw?
The curse on your hamster?
Your dismissal of my wife's and my ball lightning sighting?
No matter what I've said, you've either dismissed it out of hand, told me to prove it to your pal Randi, or just plain ridiculed it.
So yes, I mind, and I really have nothing further for you. |
I have never dismissed any of your experiences. I merely asked why you prefer one of many possible explanations over all the others. A completely reasonable question in my opinion. |
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08/22/2008 03:49:46 PM · #208 |
(off-topic side question:  love32907, could you please let me know where I can read about this in the Bible? I'd like to read the whole story:
"God made the devil and all the angels before He made us. He made them with a free will, just like He did with us. He also created them to live forever, like He did us. The devil, who was an archangel, thought that he would rise above God so God decided to throw him down to earth. He has to spend eternity in hell because of his actions. He also took 1/3 of the angles with him because they all have a free will and they decided to follow the devil."
Thanks a lot!) |
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08/22/2008 04:30:18 PM · #209 |
Originally posted by Sam94720:
So you saw a flying object you could not identify. There's a multitude of possible explanations. It might have been extraterrestrials. Or a weather balloon. Or a military aircraft. Or the Flying Spaghetti Monster. Or a flying teapot. Or a transmissible disease that made you hallucinate. Or a message from the other side. etc. etc.
I don't know what it was. Maybe one day we'll find out. Until then I can live with the uncertainty.
You, on the other hand, seem to prefer one explanation over all the others. Why?
About your ball lightning: Ehm, yes, you saw some ball lightning. The three paragraphs above apply.
[quote=Sam94720] I have never dismissed any of your experiences. I merely asked why you prefer one of many possible explanations over all the others. A completely reasonable question in my opinion. |
This isn't a dismissal?
The three paragraphs above apply?
Extraterrestrials?
Spaghettin monster?
Flying teapot?
Give me a break!
Those are reasonable, rational explanations?
The reason why I settle on an explanation is a process.....I don't pick one at random, I have, REPEATEDLY mentioned that I'm not subject to whimsy.
You're the one who keeps saying that I don't have any rational or reasonable process.
As far as the lightning goes,what we saw over the course of an hour or so, two lucid, non-diseased, 30 something adults, who hadn't been drinking, etc., who were in a rather vigorous electrical storm.....pretty standard stuff, wind, rain, lightning......were those errant large balls that just kinda danced across the field of view with no apparent attachment, direction, origin.....
Yet somehow, you're going to tell me we're mistaken.
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08/22/2008 04:38:29 PM · #210 |
Originally posted by NikonJeb:
Originally posted by Sam94720:
So you saw a flying object you could not identify. There's a multitude of possible explanations. It might have been extraterrestrials. Or a weather balloon. Or a military aircraft. Or the Flying Spaghetti Monster. Or a flying teapot. Or a transmissible disease that made you hallucinate. Or a message from the other side. etc. etc.
I don't know what it was. Maybe one day we'll find out. Until then I can live with the uncertainty.
You, on the other hand, seem to prefer one explanation over all the others. Why?
About your ball lightning: Ehm, yes, you saw some ball lightning. The three paragraphs above apply.
[quote=Sam94720] I have never dismissed any of your experiences. I merely asked why you prefer one of many possible explanations over all the others. A completely reasonable question in my opinion. |
This isn't a dismissal?
The three paragraphs above apply?
Extraterrestrials?
Spaghettin monster?
Flying teapot?
Give me a break!
Those are reasonable, rational explanations?
The reason why I settle on an explanation is a process.....I don't pick one at random, I have, REPEATEDLY mentioned that I'm not subject to whimsy.
You're the one who keeps saying that I don't have any rational or reasonable process.
As far as the lightning goes,what we saw over the course of an hour or so, two lucid, non-diseased, 30 something adults, who hadn't been drinking, etc., who were in a rather vigorous electrical storm.....pretty standard stuff, wind, rain, lightning......were those errant large balls that just kinda danced across the field of view with no apparent attachment, direction, origin.....
Yet somehow, you're going to tell me we're mistaken. |
You wrote:
Originally posted by NikonJeb:
is it POSSIBLE that I have seen a UFO, something that may indicate inteligent life other than ours? |
In my understanding you were referring to the possibility that the UFO might have been of extraterrestrial origin. Or did I misunderstand you here?
What's the point of your UFO story with regard to the sixth sense or the paranormal? Either you don't think there was any paranormal activity. In this case, the story does not belong in this thread.
Or you think there was some paranormal activity. In this case I'd be interested in hearing what you think it was and why you consider such an explanation more likely than other possible explanations.
And again: I never questioned any of your experiences.
You accused me of not being willing to change my mind. I am. I am even eager to change my mind. But I would expect a good reason to do so. If you want me to understand your view, please give me some insight into your thinking and what conclusions you took away from your experiences and why. |
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08/22/2008 04:56:41 PM · #211 |
Originally posted by NikonJeb:
what we saw... were those errant large balls that just kinda danced across the field of view with no apparent attachment, direction, origin.....
Yet somehow, you're going to tell me we're mistaken. |
Not unless you assert those balls were caused by magic psychic energy, overcaffeinated fairies or a god playing video pong. What you experienced is not in question, only what you believe caused it. Cynthiann posted a story earlier about experiencing hot flashes at a bingo game while her daughter had a fever in Florida. While nobody can say she didn't experience that, I suspect the intent was to relay an example of "connected" symptoms, and that assumed connection is certainly questionable. Chances are, her daughter had fevers plenty of times without close family members feeling sick, too. A million other people probably had fevers that day, likely another friend or relative among them, but we're to assume this particular person caused someone else to feel sick from Florida? While it's a fascinating coincidence, there's no evidence that the events were related at all. You could just as well claim the daughter's fever was caused by mom playing bingo. |
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08/23/2008 05:08:24 AM · #212 |
Here you go Sam94720! I hope this helps :) There are many examples in the Bible of where to find what I said. I picked examples from the old and new testaments for you. I tried to break it down with what you quoted me saying :)
Creation of man and the angels and Satan:
Genesis 1:1-2
Jeremiah 4:23-26
Isaiah 45:18
Genesis 1:26-28 -- intreresting to note that God said to replenish the earth... when they were the first people on the earth :) Many Christians believe that the earth was void and without form because of Satan being cast to the earth. Also, the Bible suggests that there were people on the earth before the 6 day creation. If you can read a Dake Bible you should. He has good notes on the subject :)
In Genesis chapters 1, 2, and 3, God creates the earth and everything on it. Then Adam and Eve are decieved by the serpent. So, the serpent (also seen as the devil) had to be there in the garden to decieve them. So, he had already been thrown out of Heaven by God because of his sin.
The Fall of Satan (and the 1/3 of the angels):
Isaiah 14:12-15
Ezekiel 28:11-19-- another reference to Satan is the King of Tyrus.
Luke 10:18
Jude 1:6-7
2 Peter 2:4
Revelation 12:4 -- the stars refer to angels, and the dragon refers to Satan. The manchild is representing the 144,000 Jews during the tribulation, and the woman represents the Nation of Isreal.
Rev 12:7-12 -- This fall refers to when Satan tries to war against God and is thrown out of Heaven for a final time. After this, he can\'t enter heaven anymore. Right now he has acess to heaven to accuse the bretheren. (Job 1:6 and Revelation 12:10 are examples of this.)
Eternity in Hell:
Revelation 19:11-21
Revelation 20:1-3
Revelation 20:7-10-- After the 1,000 years of peace without Satan, God is going to let him out for a short time. He does this so people can choose to believe Him one last time, or be decieved into believing the devil. Then Satan and whoever he can decieve will be cast into the fire forever. This shows that God did give us a free will and He wants us to decide who we will serve. It\'s hard to believe that after 1,000 perfect years some will chose to turn away from Him.
Revelation 20:14-15
Matthew 25:31-46 (41 and 46 are the key verses)
Other good verses to look at:
John 3:16 (This shows free will)
1 Corinthians 4:9
Ephesians 2:1-3
Ephesians 6:10-12
James 2:19
1 Peter 5:8-9
2 Peter 3:4-8
1 John 3:8-10
Revelation 22:17
If you still want to know more, you can look up Perry Stone and Jesse Duplantis. They are both very good teachers about this subject. You should just be able to google their websites.
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08/23/2008 12:02:09 PM · #213 |
Originally posted by love32907:
This shows that God did give us a free will and He wants us to decide who we will serve. It's hard to believe that after 1,000 perfect years some will chose to turn away from Him. |
It's hard to believe anyone in the 21st century would think of servitude as free will. |
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08/23/2008 01:50:46 PM · #214 |
Originally posted by scalvert:
Originally posted by love32907:
This shows that God did give us a free will and He wants us to decide who we will serve. It's hard to believe that after 1,000 perfect years some will chose to turn away from Him. |
It's hard to believe anyone in the 21st century would think of servitude as free will. |
I choose to freely serve God (He doesn't make me :) If I didn't serve God, then I would be serving the devil. All I have to do is obey God's commandments (It's not that hard :) I think that serving God by living on what the Word of God says is a very small price to pay to go to heaven. It's a good life in my opinion :) |
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08/23/2008 02:11:42 PM · #215 |
Originally posted by love32907:
I choose to freely serve God (He doesn't make me)... living on what the Word of God says is a very small price to pay to go to heaven. It's a good life in my opinion :) |
Interesting. You believe an invisible deity doesn't make you serve... you merely "choose" to do exactly what ancient authors claim He wants you to do to avoid a promise of death, eternal torment and suffering. I wonder if a slave or prisoner of war would also consider willing servitude under threats of torture and death "free will?"
P.S. Heaven, if it existed, would be a good afterlife by definition. |
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08/23/2008 06:27:15 PM · #216 |
Originally posted by scalvert:
Originally posted by love32907:
I choose to freely serve God (He doesn't make me)... living on what the Word of God says is a very small price to pay to go to heaven. It's a good life in my opinion :) |
Interesting. You believe an invisible deity doesn't make you serve... you merely "choose" to do exactly what ancient authors claim He wants you to do to avoid a promise of death, eternal torment and suffering. I wonder if a slave or prisoner of war would also consider willing servitude under threats of torture and death "free will?"
P.S. Heaven, if it existed, would be a good afterlife by definition. |
Interesting the way you twist things. |
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08/23/2008 08:25:40 PM · #217 |
Originally posted by scalvert:
Originally posted by love32907:
I choose to freely serve God (He doesn't make me)... living on what the Word of God says is a very small price to pay to go to heaven. It's a good life in my opinion :) |
Interesting. You believe an invisible deity doesn't make you serve... you merely "choose" to do exactly what ancient authors claim He wants you to do to avoid a promise of death, eternal torment and suffering. I wonder if a slave or prisoner of war would also consider willing servitude under threats of torture and death "free will?"
P.S. Heaven, if it existed, would be a good afterlife by definition. |
I simply meant that serving God in this life was a good life. By accepting Jesus Christ as my Lord and Savior I have been released from the bondage of hell, death, and the grave. Before I was saved things were different... not as good. Now I live a free life because I serve God willingly :) I will admit though, that I did get saved because the idea of going to hell scared me! But that is ok, because that is what Jesus died on the cross for... so I wouldn't have to go to hell :) You don't have to believe me if you don't want to. Everyone has a right to believe what they want to :) |
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08/23/2008 08:36:11 PM · #218 |
Originally posted by love32907:
Originally posted by scalvert:
You believe an invisible deity doesn't make you serve... you merely "choose" to do exactly what ancient authors claim He wants you to do to avoid a promise of death, eternal torment and suffering. |
By accepting Jesus Christ as my Lord and Savior I have been released from the bondage of hell, death, and the grave. |
Originally posted by dponlyme:
Interesting the way you twist things. |
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08/23/2008 11:04:10 PM · #219 |
Originally posted by love32907:
By accepting Jesus Christ as my Lord and Savior I have been released from the bondage of hell, death, and the grave. |
Pity that all of those that came before Jesus, as well as all of the people believing in other deities will all end up in Hell... and to think that some of us lead exemplary lives too... oh well C'est la vie.
Ray |
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08/23/2008 11:07:08 PM · #220 |
Originally posted by love32907:
I choose to freely serve God (He doesn't make me)... living on what the Word of God says is a very small price to pay to go to heaven. It's a good life in my opinion :) |
Originally posted by scalvert:
Interesting. You believe an invisible deity doesn't make you serve... you merely "choose" to do exactly what ancient authors claim He wants you to do to avoid a promise of death, eternal torment and suffering. I wonder if a slave or prisoner of war would also consider willing servitude under threats of torture and death "free will?"
P.S. Heaven, if it existed, would be a good afterlife by definition. |
Originally posted by dponlyme:
Interesting the way you twist things. |
You don't think Shannon has a valid point?
I have always struggled with the meaning of happenstances such as a perfectly normal, regular family who just happens to be in the wrong place at the wrong time, their 10 year old daughter is brutally raped, dismembered, and then thrown into a dumpster....it happens to people who dedicate there lives to God.
How do you reconcile things like that?
How do you reconcile slavery and prisoners of war, either?
Especially if the slaves/prisoners have pledged their life to God?
The pat answer is that it's not for us to know, but it sure flies in the face of all we are supposed to know about a good and merciful God, and a rational, reasoned person would have a hard time accepting these things on faith.
I know I have a hard time accepting the death of my nephew to SIDS....after the sixth month battle his brother made to live and all my sister went through with him.....to have the second child be a trouble free birthing and have him just die at six months?
What's that all about?
Sorry.....didn't mean to digress, I just get a degree of angst with total blind faith.
Mine's conditional, and I just really believe that God lets us screw up......whether or not you can accept that in any degree is up to the individual.
I just haven't gotten anywhere with serial killers, and their victims, and other kinds of horrors that are beyond my comprehension.
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08/24/2008 12:42:30 AM · #221 |
| ARRRRRRGHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! |
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08/24/2008 12:44:25 AM · #222 |
Originally posted by BeeCee:
ARRRRRRGHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! |
Yup it happened again ... |
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08/24/2008 12:46:32 AM · #223 |
I've told SC that if they feel it's time to lock this thread I certainly won't complain.
It's a shame, because a few people did have worthwhile contributions, IMO. I guess I'm not surprised though, just disappointed... |
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08/24/2008 01:46:24 AM · #224 |
I am sorry that the thread went this way... I did not mean for it to... I am new to the thread discussions and I had no idea that I could have just sent my reply to Sam's question over a private message... oops :) Sorry again everyone. At least I know that now...
Please, if anyone else has any questions for me or wants me to answer what has already been said e-mail me, because I don't want to dispupt the thread anylonger.
And if anyone has anything to add to the origional thread question please do it! (That way it doesn't have to be locked) :) |
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08/24/2008 06:38:25 AM · #225 |
Originally posted by love32907:
I am sorry that the thread went this way... I did not mean for it to... I am new to the thread discussions and I had no idea that I could have just sent my reply to Sam's question over a private message... oops :) Sorry again everyone. At least I know that now...
Please, if anyone else has any questions for me or wants me to answer what has already been said e-mail me, because I don't want to dispupt the thread anylonger.
And if anyone has anything to add to the origional thread question please do it! (That way it doesn't have to be locked) :) |
Nice of you to be considerate.
You can start your own thread as well.
BTW, SC doesn't necessarily lock a thread just 'cause someone gets their nose out of joint.....it's not like there haven't been a few of them participating in the thread.
The OP just could have put something forth to get the thread back on track.
There's certainly merit in the concept that a sixth sense could be God-given.
If you believe so, anyway.
That ought to piss her off all over again!.....8>)
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