Originally posted by kathleenm:
Exactly my thoughts, lionel! I lean heavily towards 1-3 word titles. If you can't sum it up, then maybe it doesn't meet the challenge as well as you thought it did.
Although my last comment was a "huh?". LOL
I find this whole thread a bit silly. But I also find the assumption
that every picture should not have any text to support it or its a bad
picture' idea pretty stupid too.
I'll throw one of my favourite paintings out as an example of this
Dali's Christ of St John On the Cross
7 word title - does that make it bad ????
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10/15/2002 04:55:51 PM · #8 |
7 words do not a bad title make, if they're a title, not a pained description meant to tell the viewer what to think about or how to interpret an image. 'Dali's Christ of St John On the Cross' is a very simple title that does nothing but name the subject. It's not 'Christ on a Cross with One Light so It Meets the Challenge' or 'God's Garbage'.
Sonifo: When in doubt, 'Untitled'. Not everything needs a witty, punchy title.
timj351: 'Tree & Lilly Pads' or 'Tree and Lilly Pads' would be a perfectly respectable title, but note the formality of using proper English. ;)
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10/15/2002 05:19:15 PM · #9 |
Originally posted by MarkRob:
I titled mine this week with the name of the sin it depicts - some get it, some don't, but at least all know what I was trying to accomplish with the all powerful TITLE!
i think the point is - if you had titled your entry UNTITLED, would everyone still know what you were trying to accomplish? if the answer is no, then you're probably going to be voted down - titles that put the picture into context, even if it's only 1 word, are too descriptive
* This message has been edited by the author on 10/15/2002 5:17:19 PM.
* This message has been edited by the author on 10/15/2002 5:25:19 PM.
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10/15/2002 05:25:34 PM · #10 |
Originally posted by kathleenm:
Although my last comment was a "huh?". LOL
hehehe, I think they moved on to me next because I just got the comment:
"Again, huh?" |
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10/15/2002 05:31:18 PM · #11 |
Originally posted by spiderman:
i think the point is - if you had titled your entry UNTITLED, would everyone still know what you were trying to accomplish? if the answer is no, then you're probably going to be voted down - titles that put the picture into context, even if it's only 1 word, are too descriptive
I've seen this expressed several times and I'm frankly bemused.
Can you explain why it is too descriptive to you ? Why do you feel
that a picture cannot be any good if it requires some context to
enhance the meaning within it ? I think on a large majority of the
images I like and in most cases the titles are part of the art, enhancing
the work. Though I think this of the descriptions that are typically
provided.
A lot of the most insipid, pretentious modern art appears with
'UNTITLED #1' and the like. Often I feel it just tries to hide the lack
of meaning by throwing it back to the viewer to decide. |
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10/15/2002 05:34:46 PM · #12 |
My 2 cents on titles is that since they are included, they should be considered. Several shots this week made no connection to the challenge but after reading the title, I could see a deep, well thought out connection. I'm inclined to accept that.
I have no problem with long titles (although 3 to 7 syllables seems most appealing to me) but I will vote down anything titled "This meets the challenge because it's of my Uncle Fred and if you knew Uncle Fred you'd know what a sinner he was and he's been dead for 7 years so it's the 7 deadly sins. Get it? Also you should give me a good grade because I'm 9 years old and only have a 1 megapixel camera." |
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10/15/2002 05:40:10 PM · #13 |
Originally posted by Gordon:
A lot of the most insipid, pretentious modern art appears with
'UNTITLED #1' and the like. Often I feel it just tries to hide the lack
of meaning by throwing it back to the viewer to decide.
agreed. funny example. i also agree that a title shouldn't save a picture, but a nice relevant title is the icing on the cake. |
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10/15/2002 05:40:19 PM · #14 |
Originally posted by Gordon:
Can you explain why it is too descriptive to you ? Why do you feel
that a picture cannot be any good if it requires some context to
enhance the meaning within it ?
if the point of the challenge was to portray one of the 7 sins, and even though i know what the challenge is, i still can't distinguish what is being depicted without an assist from the title --- that is too descriptive
i never said that a picture can't be any good if it requires some context-orienting title - i just said that for the purposes of these challenges, too-descriptive titles are frowned upon for the reason stated above
Often I feel it just tries to hide the lack
of meaning by throwing it back to the viewer to decide.
if the point of the art is to provoke thought, why give the viewer a head-start?
on the other hand, if there is a well-defined point to the art, why is a title needed at all?
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10/15/2002 05:41:13 PM · #15 |
good lord.
title and image work together in synergy.
the title helps to provide the context. the image provides the substance.
some images may have a context that's not apparent without the descriptor. that doesn't make them necessarily poorer photographs.
humans are both visual and beings of language.
trying to narow a scope to include only one or the other is somewhat arbitrary.
finally i will say that it might be interesting to have a challenge topic and render the best image without supplying an additional title.
however in such a case the challenge topic would in effect BECOME the title ...
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10/15/2002 05:46:20 PM · #16 |
Have a very precise title also stops people interpreting your image in different ways.
It's best to be brief and let people think about the photo.
If my previous photo was called "Block of Garbage" people would have looked and seen it was a block of garbage, voted, and moved on.
By calling it "Regeneration" it makes people look harder and see why it might be called that.
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10/15/2002 05:47:25 PM · #17 |
Originally posted by spiderman:
if the point of the challenge was to portray one of the 7 sins, and even though i know what the challenge is, i still can't distinguish what is being depicted without an assist from the title --- that is too descriptive
Actually, the point of the challenge was to use *one or more* of the 7 Deadly Sins as a working theme for your photograph, nowhere do I see 'portray' or 'one and one alone'.
But that's just my interpreataion.
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10/15/2002 05:47:38 PM · #18 |
Originally posted by Gordon:
A lot of the most insipid, pretentious modern art appears with
'UNTITLED #1' and the like. Often I feel it just tries to hide the lack of meaning by throwing it back to the viewer to decide.
Originally posted by Alecia:
agreed. funny example. i also agree that a title shouldn't save a picture, but a nice relevant title is the icing on the cake.
Alecia that's a GREAT link - I do like some modern art but I also agree with some of his points very much!
I don't, and never will, believe that Tracy Emin's unmade bed, or her box of soiled underwear are works of modern art.
But I do really like many highly abstract paintings and sculptures.
* This message has been edited by the author on 10/15/2002 5:45:36 PM.
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10/15/2002 05:50:01 PM · #19 |
This is a silly thread, so I think I jump in. Some shots really need a title, as part of the story, while other photos stand very well with the story in the shot. Not everyone can be a literary master and shouldn't have to be. These are photographs and we are photographers, nobody has asked us to be "title wizards". Some of us do have a nack for turning the cute phrase, but not all do. Personally, most photos I see NEED a title, to fill out the rough details, to get to the point. I prefer titles that are short and sweet, but I've seen a couple of plus 10 word titles that I really liked. MarkRob has a valid point, but probably could have written more to justify his point.
Example - I have a picture of a racoon at my desk, right? Submit it for a crime challenge as "untitled" and many will miss the point. That is their choice. Title the same photo as "Masked Forest Dweller" for the same challenge would certainly help many. To the extreme, titled as "Racoon - Forest Thief wearing a mask over it's eyes" might be considered too much, so some restraint really can be called for.
My humble suggestion - start by LOOKING at the photo, ignore the title entirely. If you get it, wonderful, this is a photo challenge, you can ignore the title. If you don't get it, please, please, please, read the title, then RELOOK at the photo. Does it make sense now? Good, score it appropriately. If you are insulted by the title, tell the photographer so, but SCORE the picture on it's merits. I would ask all of you...Are you looking for a reason to trash the photo, then trash the photo, not the person's tastes in wording.
Final point - Youngsters and Non-English speaking people participate at this site, too. Please don't let the narrow minds win here. Offer kindness, it's easier on the soul. Take care. |
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10/15/2002 05:50:08 PM · #20 |
I love Dali's work. I have a poster of this one.
Originally posted by Gordon:
Originally posted by kathleenm:
[i]Exactly my thoughts, lionel! I lean heavily towards 1-3 word titles. If you can't sum it up, then maybe it doesn't meet the challenge as well as you thought it did.
Although my last comment was a "huh?". LOL
I find this whole thread a bit silly. But I also find the assumption
that every picture should not have any text to support it or its a bad
picture' idea pretty stupid too.
I'll throw one of my favourite paintings out as an example of this
Dali's Christ of St John On the Cross
7 word title - does that make it bad ????
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10/15/2002 05:58:10 PM · #21 |
Originally posted by Zeissman:
I love Dali's work. I have a poster of this one.
I used to live about 5 minutes walk from the gallery that picture
hangs in - seen it many many times. It is positioned at the end
of a long gallery / walkway and has a huge impact. |
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10/15/2002 05:59:32 PM · #22 |
Another one I really like is the Temptation of St. Christopher(?)
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10/15/2002 06:03:23 PM · #23 |
Originally posted by Mousie:
... use *one or more* of the 7 Deadly Sins as a working theme for your photograph, nowhere do I see 'portray' or 'one and one alone'.
okay, i'll grant you that
does that mean a picture of a postage stamp, titled GOVERNMENT GREED, would have equal footing with a silhoette of an unclad female titled FANTASY?
within the context as stated in the challenge, one entry obviously requires the additional context of the title - that entry, however well intentioned and however well presented, IMO, falls on the short side of the voting scale
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10/15/2002 06:06:14 PM · #24 |
spiderman,
See my previous post in this thread. :)
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10/15/2002 06:09:12 PM · #25 |
Originally posted by Mousie:
spiderman, See my previous post in this thread. :)
yeah!
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