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08/11/2004 07:09:36 PM · #51 |
this issue seems more important than it really is. i have gone through all my challenge entries and looked to see how many recieved 1s and 2s. this goes all the way back to within 2 months of the site's creation. so if it's getting worse it should show up. anyway, i only had 3 pics that had no 1s or 2s. this includes 6 top 10s, 2 ribbons, and a site avg. of 5.86 (included because a low avg. would obviously mean more 1s).
  
i like "play" and "quell the burn" ok, however, "feast" doesn't do anything for me and is probably one of my least favorite shots i have taken for a challenge. if i took this same shot now i would probably delete it in the camera before it even got to a computer. yet, it got not a single 1 or 2.
interestingly, i got fewer 1s and 2s as the site grew. this probably has something to do with my skills improving, but it's still something to think about.
if all but three of my pics have gotten 1s and 2s, then it seems pretty evenly distributed and shouldn't really have any effect on scoring other than lowering the overal numerical score across the board.
Message edited by author 2004-08-11 19:12:23. |
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08/11/2004 08:02:10 PM · #52 |
hrmm
the 3rd shot is much worse than the 2nd - i give the 1st one an 7 - the 2nd one a 7 - and the 3rd a 4.
i do agree, however, that a vote below say a 4 is worth requiring comment as to why. typically the high rated photos already get that...
as it stands now - it is requested that votes of 1,2,3 be left a comment suggesting why the vote was low.
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08/11/2004 08:12:24 PM · #53 |
Originally posted by soup:
hrmm
the 3rd shot is much worse than the 2nd - i give the 1st one an 7 - the 2nd one a 7 - and the 3rd a 4.
i do agree, however, that a vote below say a 4 is worth requiring comment as to why. typically the high rated photos already get that...
as it stands now - it is requested that votes of 1,2,3 be left a comment suggesting why the vote was low. |
and are you going to require that the comments are rated/ validated ?
It makes a nice 'sound bite' but if people think the picture is bad and aren't moved to comment, the fact that you force them to comment, isn't suddenly going to get a better comment than the fact they scored it low already.
Is it okay if I just put '1' in as my comment ? Or 'bad' ?
Would there be a minimum length on these centrally mandated comments for non-conforming voting ?
The scale is 1 to 10 - not 4 to 10 unless you give a reason or ask for a special pass.
You'll just get instead of a vote of 1, 2, or 3, a vote or 1, 2, or 3 and a comment that says 'I don't like it' and a name to start a personal vendetta against in the forums or someone to email flame comments to.
Depends I guess if the idea is to get honest opinions or platitudes. |
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08/11/2004 08:15:10 PM · #54 |
Originally posted by MatrixReloaded:
personal taste should not be a reason to vote a 1 or 2.
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In your opinion
Originally posted by MatrixReloaded:
You vote on if the photo meets the challenge and quality.
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In your opinion
Originally posted by MatrixReloaded:
That is no reason to give it a 1 or 2..
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In your opinion
Originally posted by MatrixReloaded:
if you do...then you have no respect for the photographer.
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In your opinion
Yes, I know, boring, repetative and childish - but while you obviously have your own view on what bad means, until someone decides that what you think it means is required, you've pretty much described my voting scheme and in the majority cases I respect the photographer, I don't know who the photographer is, but when I hand out a 1, 2 or a 3 vote, I don't like the picture much. |
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08/11/2004 08:16:42 PM · #55 |
Originally posted by scalvert:
Originally posted by Gordon:
... I also don't want to see yet another witch hunt that tries to get rid of people that don't agree with the mass view of 'good'. |
Me neither.
Originally posted by Gordon:
However, it doesn't mean that a picture that meets the challenge can not get a 1. |
If it's a good photo that obviously meets the challenge, then yeah, I think it does. |
And that's the beauty of it. You think it does. And you vote accordingly. I disagree, and I vote accordingly. The end result is the most popular photo wins in our DPC popularity contest and that is no bad thing.
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08/11/2004 08:18:16 PM · #56 |
Originally posted by MatrixReloaded:
you seem to be defending the trolls.
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I'm defending the right of someone to disagree with you and vote how they think, while not being required to publically defend their vote.
I'm not the one calling people who disagree with you trolls. |
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08/11/2004 08:30:28 PM · #57 |
| I think it happens when somebody clicks the little 2 on the rating bar. |
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08/11/2004 08:34:38 PM · #58 |
| sometimes you don't put a lot of thought into it. Perhaps this person had just looked at a dozen insect shots. If that was the case, then this one would look pretty run-of-the-mill, certainly when you compare it to his other insect shot which won first. That shot was great. |
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08/11/2004 08:36:23 PM · #59 |
I saw this somewhere before but if everybody wants comments from the low scorers why doesnt dpc just make a check box thing for comments.
Like:
Poor Focus
Doesn't Meet Challenge
Bad Lighting
Good Lightin
Good Foucus
Etc.... |
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08/11/2004 08:38:28 PM · #60 |
Originally posted by mrwaffles989:
I saw this somewhere before but if everybody wants comments from the low scorers why doesnt dpc just make a check box thing for comments.
Like:
Poor Focus
Doesn't Meet Challenge
Bad Lighting
Good Lightin
Good Foucus
Etc.... |
how lazy are you? |
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08/11/2004 08:38:30 PM · #61 |
Originally posted by G4Ds:
How else could an image get a 1? |
By not meeting the challenge AND being a bad photo, just as the winners are good photos that do meet the challenge. It boggles my mind that this concept should cause any confusion at all. It's the only semi-objective aspect of voting we have. A photo that doesn't meet the challenge in any way shouldn't get a 10, and a photo that clearly does meet the challenge shouldn't get a 1, regardless of whether or not you happen to like it. At the very least...
bad photo, doesn't meet challenge = <5
good photo, meets the challenge = >5
Everything else falls in between, and that is the part where your own opinions and tastes come into play. There is no reason why you can't use the whole 1-10 scale, but WHY you vote the way you do should be based on something other than personal taste alone. If everyone voted purely on whether or not they liked the photos (which Gordon is defending as valid), then the challenges would become meaningless and the scoring arbitrary, with little hope of learning from your results. Can you imagine the results of a "brown" challenge if the majority of voters voted this way and decided they just didn't care for brown pictures? Maybe the winner would be a daffodill against a blue sky, with excellent brown compositions placing near the bottom. Scary stuff.
If this were truly a popularity contest, then there wouldn't be any voting guidelines. We'd just pick the shots we like the best and the challenge aspect would disappear.
Message edited by author 2004-08-11 20:45:40. |
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08/11/2004 08:40:18 PM · #62 |
| Well how does everyone else do their ratings? I first look at if it meets the challenge. If so I like to give at least a 4. If it doesn't... you'll be lucky to get a 4. 5 is avg, 6 is good, 7 is very good, the rest are great, greater, greaterestest. |
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08/11/2004 08:43:05 PM · #63 |
I agree, people need to learn how to vote. My "Zodiak" photo was pure trash yet 15 people gave me an 8 or higher!
And my "Letting Go" photo clearly did not meet the challenge and is just another flower shot, yet 13 people gave me 8 or higher!
Clearly the voters can not be trusted to get it right!
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08/11/2004 08:45:28 PM · #64 |
Greetings all,
As a new user I have been watching things closely and trying to vote my honest opinion on the submissions, I rarely if ever give either a 1,2,9 or 10. In answer to the issue of "trolling" how about requiring a user to post a comment for any votes lower than a three, or higher than an 8, just my humble idea....
Mike Fairbanks
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08/11/2004 08:46:06 PM · #65 |
| All photos are created equal, but some photos are more equal than others. |
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08/11/2004 08:47:59 PM · #66 |
Originally posted by kyebosh:
Well how does everyone else do their ratings? I first look at if it meets the challenge. If so I like to give at least a 4. If it doesn't... you'll be lucky to get a 4. 5 is avg, 6 is good, 7 is very good, the rest are great, greater, greaterestest. |
Bingo. |
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08/11/2004 09:02:03 PM · #67 |
Originally posted by scalvert:
Originally posted by kyebosh:
Well how does everyone else do their ratings? I first look at if it meets the challenge. If so I like to give at least a 4. If it doesn't... you'll be lucky to get a 4. 5 is avg, 6 is good, 7 is very good, the rest are great, greater, greaterestest. |
Bingo. |
Yep - that sounds like "one" fair way of many. Part of the problem is those three words "meets the challenge." There's more definitions of that than anything else - from "if it's a photo it counts" to "if it's not a dog/cat/child/bug/flower it counts" to "if it is very literally what the challenge says." What makes it worse is when they don't tell you why the "thought" it did not meet the chllenge.
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08/11/2004 09:03:52 PM · #68 |
The only way it doesn't meet the challenge is if you can't find a vanishing point of somekind. Some of the entries are tough to tell, but are there, and some just... I don't know what happened.
edit: vanishing point challenge used for example
Message edited by author 2004-08-11 21:05:25. |
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08/11/2004 09:07:22 PM · #69 |
What? Someone gave me a 2?  You bastards !!! 
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08/11/2004 09:09:24 PM · #70 |
Originally posted by kyebosh:
The only way it doesn't meet the challenge is if you can't find a vanishing point of somekind. Some of the entries are tough to tell, but are there, and some just... I don't know what happened.
edit: vanishing point challenge used for example |
That SHOULD be true, but I just got zapped because my parallel lines weren't "straight." And technically, I suppose to be exactly parallel they would have to be straight lines by definition.
You just learn to live with it. |
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08/11/2004 09:13:55 PM · #71 |
Originally posted by photom:
Originally posted by kyebosh:
The only way it doesn't meet the challenge is if you can't find a vanishing point of somekind. Some of the entries are tough to tell, but are there, and some just... I don't know what happened.
edit: vanishing point challenge used for example |
That SHOULD be true, but I just got zapped because my parallel lines weren't "straight." And technically, I suppose to be exactly parallel they would have to be straight lines by definition.
You just learn to live with it. |
That's just TOO nitpicky! Parallel can be defined simply as "Being an equal distance apart everywhere", only in math is straight added. Also, you'll never find perfectly parallel/straight lines in real life... |
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08/11/2004 09:15:33 PM · #72 |
Originally posted by kyebosh:
...only in math is straight added. |
...I keep telling you people about math but no one listens... ;o)
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08/11/2004 09:17:36 PM · #73 |
Originally posted by Jacko:
What? Someone gave me a 2? |
Probably meant to hit 20.
Photom- The voter's opinion of what meets the challenge is one thing we can't control. I was only referring to obvious cases (like the ribbon winners) where a voter may acknowledge an entry as meeting the challenge, but still gives it a 1 just because he/she didn't care for it (or vice versa). |
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08/11/2004 09:22:10 PM · #74 |
Originally posted by laurielblack:
Originally posted by kyebosh:
...only in math is straight added. |
...I keep telling you people about math but no one listens... ;o) |
Speaking of math how does a 5.1935 sound for feet - wasn't that your prediction?
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08/11/2004 09:24:02 PM · #75 |
For feet, 5.19 sounds about right... or left... LOL ;o)
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You bastards !!! 
