Staged or captured? - DPChallenge Forums

09/22/2008 09:22:28 AM · #26

A couple of people have mentioned it, but yes, to me posed portraits are "staged" - your subject is reacting to you, you're reacting to them. You're putting them in the possible light (literally!) even if it's natural light, and arranging everything to suit the photograph. Make sense?

timfythetoo

Apple iPhone 16 Pro Max

09/22/2008 09:29:23 AM · #27

I totally hear where Pawdrix is coming from. I respect him immensely and the work taht he does. I often wish I had the eye for what was going on around me. Alas - I am not there yet. I feel I am capable of the variations between staged and found images - as well as the inbetween.

Staged -

- Totally staged. I knew specifically what i wanted and I placed my model exactly where I needed. There was a specific pre planning of the image and there was nothing left to chance. It came out exactly as I had preconcieved.

Found -

- Man did I luck out with this one. I just happened to have my camera at this event. Had no intentions of taking any pics to begin with. And when I realized I needed to shoot the environment was less than friendly and my camera settings were far from what I would have chosen in a staged environment. But I remember seeing this moment and I remember the feeling I had when I knew I caught it. And this is one of my fave images of the year.

Kind of in between -

The preplanning was basically that I wanted a pic of my daughter playing hopscotch with an umbrella. I just told her to go and play. And play she did. The idea was pre planned, but how that would come out in the end was still somewhat of a tossup. I just let her do her thing. I set up the situation but allowed it to play out on its own and I took what was given me.

And I will be the first to admit that I enjoy PP. For me - photography can be all three aspects - the preplanning, the shoot, the processing. It can be all three aspects - or it can be just 2 - or just the shoot itself (granted it would never be just preplanning and postprocessing - you still need the image ;). But why ever limit it to just the one when they can all be used together or in combination for the desired result.

pixelpig

Sony Alpha a55

Sony DT 1.8/50mm SAM

09/22/2008 09:51:45 AM · #28

I'm definitely a Serendipity Shooter. And I enter a challenge to see what happens. And I am not a professional photographer

Canon EF 70-200mm f/4.0L USM

09/22/2008 10:31:25 AM · #29

Just because I don't do many staged shots doesn't mean I don't do any planning. Oddly enough, I do. I get an idea of something I'd like to "find" more or less, then go looking for it. For my Long Exposure, for instance, I did some shooting one day.... Liked an effect I got, but wanted to try it again. Tried to find another suitable location (couldn't get back to the first one) and shot some more. Not exactly what I wanted, but close enough in some respects. And may be something I'll continue to play with when I get a chance. So creativity, as Andre already mentioned, does indeed play a part in both styles of shooting. You just can't beat serendipity, though. :-)

Fun thread - appreciate all the discussion!

karmat

Apple iPhone 7

09/22/2008 10:36:40 AM · #30

I go back and forth, and like others have said, use some in between.

There was a time when most of my dpc shots were set up, and if I get in a crunch and NEED to enter something, I will set it up.

But, frankly, I hate cleaning up after myself, so if I can "find" a shot, I would much rather just find it.

7 of my last 10 have been "found." Of those, four were not even shot with the challenge in mind, but rather "fit," after I was looking at them.

DrAchoo

Panasonic Lumix DMC-LX5

09/22/2008 11:13:16 AM · #31

Staged. Staged. Staged. I am an artist. I want to control my canvas and have it express who I am.

To be the devil's advocate since there is an undercurrent that "staged" is bad or not pure or something, couldn't we argue that candid or serendipity shots are more a product of being in the right place at the right time? There is an element of skill there, but ultimately it's luck. While we can certainly appreciate the luck and enjoy it, why would we praise the artist who merely happened to be lucky?

And before I hear the counter that the skill is knowing where to be at the right time or that someone like Cartier-Breson knew how to include elements that enhanced the feel of the shot, wouldn't that all ultimately qualify as staging?

Nikon AF Nikkor 85mm f/1.4D IF

09/22/2008 11:19:39 AM · #32

No one said "staged is bad". I think both staged and captured involve creativity, thought, planning, and yes, sometimes right place/right time. Staged is where the money is made, no question. And staged suits many, for the artistic sense and control you mention, Jason. There are some who just enjoy the capture - doesn't mean it's better, or purer for that matter. And in my case, it's often not all that good - I just enjoy the process.

pawdrix

Nikon D700

09/22/2008 11:29:20 AM · #33

Luck? Ouch...that hurts. ;)

I feel there's a lot more intuitive that goes into seeing or finding those shots than you may be giving credit for.

"Like chess, or writing, it is a matter of choosing from among given possibilities, but in the case of photography the number of possibilities is not finite but infinite." -John Szarkowski

John Szarkowski's introduction to William Eggleston's Guide 1976.

A great read whether or not you like Egglestons work.

He goes on to say something about narrowing the 100 possibilities in any given scene to a 1/100 and then shooting only that (to paraphrase). That's something that's hard to explain, define...teach or learn. Just an opinion but commercial work and technique can be learned.

Doc-It's all good, I just personally have a preference for the skill it takes to capture genuine moments as opposed to staging...or as I put it before, a "Hallmark moment". I don't have much interest in looking staged moments. They don't move me at all whereas real ones do.

eta. I posted the image above because it showed the anatomy of how I work. I could have been looking anywhere...shooting anything but somehow I knew those little girls were going to deliver a moment...and they did. They appeared in a few steps and I had three takes...maybe a matter 8-10 seconds to feel what was going on. Commercially, I could have staged a whopper of a moment. Incidentally, I shot 41 frames the entire day with about 6 keepers.

Message edited by author 2008-09-22 11:49:33.

DrAchoo

Panasonic Lumix DMC-LX5

Pentax D-FA* 70-200mm f/2.8 ED DC AW

09/22/2008 11:37:51 AM · #34

I was trying to present the other side, not necessarily exactly what I personally feel.

An excellent candid shot will go beyond a staged shot because it does, in fact, contain that feeling of ephemera that is uncontrollable by the photographer. We can appreciate the fleeting nature and gasp to ourselves, "wow, how lucky was it to be in that place at the exact right time?"

There is a total element of luck in this shot from us being camped on the beach, to me having my camera shooting other shots, to my friend actually noticing the deer coming down the beach, to me being able to get the briefest of shots (I think I had 3 frames before the deer high tailed it for the woods).

It is probably no coincidence that it's my fourth highest scoring image. People can apprecite that quality.

Originally posted by pawdrix:

Doc-It's all good, I just personally have a preference for the skill it takes to capture genuine moment as opposed to staging...as I put it before, a "Hallmark moment". I don't have much interest in looking staged moments. They don't move me at all whereas real one do.

Don't worry. I think both genres have a definite place in photography.

Message edited by author 2008-09-22 11:39:54.

glad2badad

Apple iPhone 16 Pro

Lensbaby Sweet 35 Optic

09/22/2008 11:38:18 AM · #35

Originally posted by pawdrix:

Similar in some regards to a "Wildlife" photographer that learns the habits of the animals they intend to "capture" in a photograph. They don't just show up in a field or stream chosen at random at some random time of day and "hope" that they get "lucky".

ETA - Of course after the last post it seems if you're a Dr anything can happen. :-P

Message edited by author 2008-09-22 11:39:39.

K3Master

Pentax K-3

09/22/2008 11:40:24 AM · #36

I do both, and I'm not very good at either.

ralph

Nikon Z9

09/22/2008 11:58:02 AM · #37

hmmm
just looked at my top 10 here in this context
1 was not staged
but an additional 4 were captures of a controlled random event (splashes drips or etc.. )
set up but with an element of randomness..

escapetooz

Canon EOS-500D Rebel T1i

Canon EF-S 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6

09/22/2008 12:49:34 PM · #38

well... i shoot portraits, and by definition, yea they are staged. But I am terrible at the planning really. Half the time I don't know what I'm gunna do until the model gets there and I see their clothes. And then I just go. And I prefer shooting out doors. It has so much the element of finding interesting lighting situations and or a beautiful location and then placing the model in it. So I don't think it's all staged really. I do a lot of studio-type shots too but they aren't as rewarding.

I have a terrible eye for candids... or else I'm too scared to really capture them. I hate feeling rude taking photos of people I don't know... I gotta get over it one day I guess or be stuck shooting only beautiful women forever. ;)

sabphoto

Samsung Galaxy S8/S8+

09/22/2008 01:00:44 PM · #39

I would LIKE to stage more but since I rarely have the time to shoot anyway (and dont' really shoot with a specific challenge in mind), challenge entries are mostly (a few exceptions) just something I come across. Which probably explains my scores and ~~excess~~ absence of ribbons. ;) Once I am done with the military (7months thank you very much for asking) I entend to use my light kit a lot more and do some actual staged shots, (of course staged can be done without light kits too).

Nikon AF-S Nikkor 70-200mm f/2.8G ED VR II

09/22/2008 01:02:27 PM · #40

My top ten scorewise on DPC: four are 'scapes, which I would consider "captures" - landscape/waterscape/wallscape/from the airscape (with only one of those in landscape orientation); two are staged - one is a self-portrait, and in the other I found a doll, set it on the bed, shot it (does that count as staged??); and four are what I would consider candids, possibly even (gasp!) snapshots. :-)

MattO

Nikon D4

09/22/2008 01:11:34 PM · #41

Out of my top 10 two are staged, 8 are captured, oddly enough the two staged are my only two top 10's. So now the question is why? Because thats what the voters prefer or because I could control more of the shot and therefore the end result is more what I had in mind.

Matt

Message edited by author 2008-09-22 13:12:13.

Bear_Music

Samsung Galaxy S24 Ultra

Sony 24-70mm F4 Vario-Tessar T* FE OSS

09/22/2008 01:51:14 PM · #42

Originally posted by Melethia:

in the other I found a doll, set it on the bed, shot it (does that count as staged??)

If you manipulate anything in the scene, it is "staged". Of course, there's staging and there's staging, like what Shannon does, but it's a matter of degree, basically :-)

R.

MattO

Nikon D4

Nikon AF-S Nikkor 70-200mm f/2.8G ED VR II

09/22/2008 01:53:17 PM · #43

Originally posted by Bear_Music:

Originally posted by Melethia:
in the other I found a doll, set it on the bed, shot it (does that count as staged??)

If you manipulate anything in the scene, it is "staged". Of course, there's staging and there's staging, like what Shannon does, but it's a matter of degree, basically :-)

R.

Shannon has a degree in staging? Wow I never realized that.

Matt

pawdrix

Nikon D700

Nikon AF Nikkor 85mm f/1.4D IF

09/22/2008 03:30:50 PM · #44

Staged and destroyed...

Time for a nap.

posthumous

Canon EOS-40D

Canon EF 50mm f/1.8 II

09/22/2008 03:41:22 PM · #45

3 of my top 5 are staged, and another is an expert editing composite of images. This is not my overall ratio. :)

bobnospum

Sony Alpha a99 II

Tamron AF 70-200mm f/2.8 Di LD IF Macro Lens for Sony

09/22/2008 04:05:06 PM · #46

7 of top 10 are captured. Like most I do a bit of both, but I think I find the captures more fun/interesting. Other than the points that everyone else has made, I like doing it for the excercise. Walking around a location you have never seen before gives you the thrill of discovering something new and allows you to keep your body in shape at the same time. :)

tate

Apple iPhone 15 Pro

Nikon AF Nikkor 50mm f/1.4D

09/22/2008 04:26:46 PM · #47

My favorite style is shooting outside staged shots that interacts with nature. THat's why I love the ducky challenges I suppose.

I want to elaborate on this latest photo â�¦ I got completely drenched and almost seriously hurt and nearly dropped all of my equipment on the rocks. It really made me feel alive. Walking around with a ducky - trying to find a place where he can take a nice photo without getting washed away â�¦ what a joy. Of course, the people around me appropriately thought "What a weirdo".

Message edited by author 2008-09-22 16:49:32.

tnun

Ricoh GR III

Pentax DA 18-135mm F3.5-5.6ED AL [IF] WR DC

09/22/2008 04:31:32 PM · #48

Hmn. Surprised to realize that 2 of top 4 entries were staged. Not really what I like to do; to paraphrase Melethia, I generally feel like a left handed boa constrictor when setting up more than one object for Anything (eg flower arrangements ie for non photo purposes). It is of course immensely satisfying to get a staged shot right, but it doesn't give me half the kick of getting a found shot that goes beyond my powers of previsualization, however inferior technically it may be.

PaulE

Canon EOS-50D