| Author | Thread |
|
|
08/22/2008 02:34:47 PM · #176 |
Originally posted by NikonJeb:
Is it possible that we have a smart, beautiful daughter past the indicators of the genetics of our family, that might be Grace? |
Originally posted by shutterpuppy:
No. This is one I'm not willing to credit at all. What ever the wonderfulness of your daughter - and hey, I've seen the pictures she certainly did luck out not to have taken after her dad ;) - they are the result of the combined genetic and parenting contributions of her parents. (It's also something that would be easily and empirically verifiable.) |
ROFLMSOAO!!!! Good thing she takes after her mom, eh?
The things that I find most amazing is not so much the looks, which usually can be traced directly back, but the personality. There are just some things about the way she is that don't match anything we know about our ancestry.
Originally posted by NikonJeb:
Is it possible that I have had occurrences of knowing things without a reasonable explanation as to why? |
Absolutely. Count this as an area where scientists (and myself) were extremely skeptical - intuition - and it turns out is actually a real and verifiable phenomenon - if thoroughly natural. In the Blink of an Eye Of course, who worked out that it was real? Scientists. And they are now working on figuring out the exact mechanisms by which it works. They didn't just accept, they applied scientific thinking, experimentation, and observation. They asked "how" and "why."[/quote]
What's the difference between intuition and a sixth sense?
I'm using them interchangeably, maybe incorrectly.
I had always thought them the same except maybe for degree.
|
|
|
|
08/22/2008 02:34:59 PM · #177 |
| yes there is, I have seen the movie and it really exixts you can even rent it ;) |
|
|
|
08/22/2008 02:40:46 PM · #178 |
Originally posted by love32907:
I have been following this thread and I thought that I would add my opinion to it as well. I am a christian first of all. There have been many times where I felt like I should do something or go somewhere out of the ordinary. For no reason at all one time, on my way to work I felt like I should go a way that I didn't ever go... so I did. Later that day I found out that there was an accident on the route that I usually take, and I would have been there at the precise moment of the accedent had I not went the other way. |
Originally posted by eqsite:
Just to add a little more fuel to this fire -- this is the fallacy of the predetermined outcome. There is no reason to assume that the accident would have happened if you had taken that route. Perhaps you would have gotten in front of the driver that caused the accident, thus slowing them down and making them avoid the accident. |
Just to wander off on a tangent.....
In the state of Pennsylvania, if you're driving without a license, and someone blows a stop sign and centerpunches you, the accident is YOUR fault because the state maintains if you were not driving, as you're not supposed to be, it would never have happened.
|
|
|
|
08/22/2008 02:40:54 PM · #179 |
Originally posted by NikonJeb:
The things that I find most amazing is not so much the looks, which usually can be traced directly back, but the personality. There are just some things about the way she is that don't match anything we know about our ancestry. |
None of your ancestors spent their formative years during the age of the Internet and the iPod, or (hopefully) with you as a parent.
On the Nature <ΓΆ€ΒΆΓΆ€ΒΆΓΆ€ΒΆ> Nurture spectrum, I think "personality" falls at least somewhat towards the latter end. |
|
|
|
08/22/2008 02:42:35 PM · #180 |
Well, Of course there have been times where I felt like the Holy Ghost had impressed me to do something and nothing happened to make me think that I should have done it. Those could be times where I just need to be obedient so that when He tells me the time that it does metter I will listen. It's like the scripture that says I walk by Faith and not by sight:)
I did happen to look at the clock that day on my way to work. When I got to work a person came in and told me about the accident. When I got home later and saw the evening news thaty said the time right on there and it would have been the same time. I had driven that route many times and I knew how long it would have taken. I don't doubt at all that my God saved me that day.
Why don't I believe in the other gods? It's simple really :) I believe the Bible. When I was growing up I had heard about all the other gods growing up in school. I didn't start going to church until I was about 10. I never once felt convicted to worship any other gods, or get saved by other gods. But when I first went to church I felt a conviction deep inside of me and I knew that this was the one and only true God. I got saved and filled with the Holy Ghost. I believe the Bible and no one can change my mind about it :) Other people can believe what they want to. It's up to them to decide who they want to serve.
And to answer  shutterpuppy. I believe that there is a devil out there that wants to kill steal and destroy, but Jesus came that I might have life and have it more abundantly. There is a devil out there that wants to do bad things. God knew what he was going to do so he warned me and he told me to go the other way and he told me to get a flashlight. Also, I don't believe that they were bad christians or anything. They were just people. It's sad that those people got in an accident, but I don't believe that God caused it. It was the devil. The devil hates everyone. He is a lier and the father of it. So he is just out there to do bad things. Some people don't listen to the voice of the Father. Who knows, God may have tried to warn those people too, but they may not have listened. It is a choice to listen and obey, if they heard. All I know is that I listen to the Holy Ghost when He speaks to me:) Other people can believe what they want to believe.
|
|
|
|
08/22/2008 02:43:36 PM · #181 |
Originally posted by love32907:
I have been following this thread and I thought that I would add my opinion to it as well. I am a christian first of all. There have been many times where I felt like I should do something or go somewhere out of the ordinary. For no reason at all one time, on my way to work I felt like I should go a way that I didn't ever go... so I did. Later that day I found out that there was an accident on the route that I usually take, and I would have been there at the precise moment of the accedent had I not went the other way. |
My friend from college used to talk all the time about miracles happening in his daily life, and how the holy book contained so many predictions and things that 'couldn't be known' at the time.
He is Muslim. |
|
|
|
08/22/2008 02:45:57 PM · #182 |
Originally posted by GeneralE:
None of your ancestors spent their formative years (hopefully) with you as a parent. |
With your enigmatic manner, I cannot tell whether I've been b*tch-slapped or not.......8>)
|
|
|
|
08/22/2008 02:47:26 PM · #183 |
OK check it! A "6th sense" is neither God nor a UFO. Must every thread turn into a religious thing? (Rhetorical as I know it is the nature of DPC) We are talking about "Intuition" or the ability of "Prediction".
That blink of an eye link is what I am talking about.
Message edited by author 2008-08-22 14:48:20. |
|
|
|
08/22/2008 02:47:36 PM · #184 |
| It is not that the accident was predetermined and that it had to happen that way. I believe that God is all knowing and therefore knows what will happen, but He doesn't predestine anyone to be in an accident. Just like He doesn't predestine anyone to be saved or not, although He knows who will be saved. He gave us free will and it is up to us to decide, but He still knows. |
|
|
|
08/22/2008 02:47:45 PM · #185 |
Originally posted by NikonJeb:
What's the difference between intuition and a sixth sense?
I'm using them interchangeably, maybe incorrectly.
I had always thought them the same except maybe for degree. |
They can be used interchangeably in a colloquial sense, but intuition as is talked about in the article is the ability that humans appear to possess to be able to make complex, split-second decisions based on what often appears to be extremely limited information. For example, when that clean-cut boy shows up on your doorstep to take you lovely daughter out on a date and you "get a feeling" that there is just something you don't like about the kid. (Okay, bad example, what father likes the boys that date his teenage daughter.)
Our brains are apparently able to do highly complex sifting of information in almost no time at all and provide us with "a feeling" - aka, come to a conclusion - that often turns out to be correct upon later evidence gathering. (Such as when you find out the nice, clean cut young man drives a van. 'nuff said.)
"Sixth-sense" is the idea that something outside of the human brain/thought process is at work - ESP/spirits/god/whatever - it is by definition a "supernatural" phenomenon. There is no evidence that any such mechanism exists - and mountains of evidence that those instances in which people believe some such external force is at work are the result of normal, internal processes; mistaken information sifting (overcounting hits, undercounting misses); or just being fooled or wrong.
Hey, I love sci-fi and watched the x-files obsessively. I would think it was the coolest thing ever if there was actually any sort of evidence for "supernatural" claims - there isn't. Those who claim there is are either crediting quacks and con artists and avoiding credible research to the contrary or are quacks and con artists themselves. |
|
|
|
08/22/2008 02:50:55 PM · #186 |
The intent is entirely humorous. :-)
I've read some Sci-Fi which deals with the possible complications of backwards time-travel; one cites a novelty song I'm My Own Grandpaw ...
Seriously, I think a kid's personality is primarily influenced by their parental interactions -- if she has a great personality you have only yourself to blame ... ;-) |
|
|
|
08/22/2008 02:56:33 PM · #187 |
Originally posted by love32907:
And to answer shutterpuppy. I believe that there is a devil out there that wants to kill steal and destroy, but Jesus came that I might have life and have it more abundantly. There is a devil out there that wants to do bad things. God knew what he was going to do so he warned me and he told me to go the other way and he told me to get a flashlight. Also, I don't believe that they were bad christians or anything. They were just people. It's sad that those people got in an accident, but I don't believe that God caused it. It was the devil. The devil hates everyone. He is a lier and the father of it. So he is just out there to do bad things. Some people don't listen to the voice of the Father. Who knows, God may have tried to warn those people too, but they may not have listened. It is a choice to listen and obey, if they heard. All I know is that I listen to the Holy Ghost when He speaks to me:) Other people can believe what they want to believe. |
The devil causes fender benders?
So let's say there is a devil out there that causes all of the bad things that happen. If god loves us, why does he allow the devil to exist, or at least why does he allow the devil to do evil? If he doesn't know the bad things that the devil is going to get up to, then god is not all-knowing. If god does know all the bad things that the devil is going to get up to, but is powerless to stop it, then god is not all-powerful. If god knows the bad things that the devil will get up to, but chooses not to stop him, then god is evil.
In other words - what Epicurus said. ;)
Message edited by author 2008-08-22 15:09:11. |
|
|
|
08/22/2008 02:58:00 PM · #188 |
Originally posted by love32907:
It is not that the accident was predetermined and that it had to happen that way. I believe that God is all knowing and therefore knows what will happen, but He doesn't predestine anyone to be in an accident. Just like He doesn't predestine anyone to be saved or not, although He knows who will be saved. He gave us free will and it is up to us to decide, but He still knows. |
"Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?"
- Epicurus, 341 BC - 270 BC |
|
|
|
08/22/2008 02:58:33 PM · #189 |
| My "6th sense" is telling me this thread is going to rant...oh wait maybe it is the Flying Spaghetti Monster that is telling me that. I am a pastafarian for noodlness sake! |
|
|
|
08/22/2008 03:04:21 PM · #190 |
Originally posted by love32907:
I believe that God is all knowing and therefore knows what will happen, but He doesn't predestine anyone to be in an accident. Just like He doesn't predestine anyone to be saved or not, although He knows who will be saved. He gave us free will and it is up to us to decide, but He still knows. |
That contradicts any notion that God took an active role in nudging you out of an accident. I too have taken alternate routes and found out later that I missed an accident, traffic or falling tree, but many more times I took an alternate route and nothing whatsoever would have happened. |
|
|
|
08/22/2008 03:14:41 PM · #191 |
Originally posted by GeneralE:
Originally posted by BeeCee:
Can anyone tell me why it's so impossible, given what science knows and still has to learn about the human brain, that we may have a vestigal sense that has been mostly lost through evolution? |
Because to be "vestigial" there has to have been an actual, fully-developed and functional sense (organ) in the past, and there's no biological evidence that any such thing existed in any human precursor or any other species.
Also, since evolution generally selects for changes which enhance survivability, if it were vestigial, that would be an indication that the condition was somehow a "bad" mutation which was in the process of dying out.
The case for any sense beyond the traditional five would make more sense (pun intended) if you argued that it might be a nascent or newly-developing sense, an evolutionary development in the making, which provides a reproductive advantage to its possessor. |
General, thank you :) This is the kind of response I was hoping for; actual reasons explaining the flaws in my theory rather than just saying that because science hasn't measured it and it might be caused by something else it doesn't exist.
Maybe as man developed better verbal communication and settled into more stable communities there was less need for telepathy? Though it does seem to me that it would continue to be a pretty handy skill to have. Maybe it got "crowded out" as other areas of the brain developed and expanded to meet changing needs?
Maybe it's vestigal, maybe nascent, maybe a random mutation like a 6th finger, I don't know, but I do think science will figure it out some day. |
|
|
|
08/22/2008 03:15:03 PM · #192 |
Originally posted by GeneralE:
The intent is entirely humorous. :-)
I've read some Sci-Fi which deals with the possible complications of backwards time-travel; one cites a novelty song I'm My Own Grandpaw ...
Seriously, I think a kid's personality is primarily influenced by their parental interactions -- if she has a great personality you have only yourself to blame ... ;-) |
You take that back! LOL!!!
What really gets me with her is that she is one of the most naturally considerate and giving people I know.......not that her mom isn't terrific, but leagues ahead of her, and it seems to be an unconscious trait.
And though there are members of the family that are genuinely good people, Eleanor just seems to stand out.
I try to be thoughtful and giving, but it's hard work, and just doesn't come naturally.....which just makes it that much harder to stomach in my quest to be a decent man.
As an aside, it's a real privilege to be around her now as she's really coming into her own personality and self-awareness.....she's just a delightful person!
She's teaching me a lot......at 40 years younger.
|
|
|
|
08/22/2008 03:17:55 PM · #193 |
Originally posted by love32907:
For no reason at all one time, on my way to work I felt like I should go a way that I didn't ever go... so I did. Later that day I found out that there was an accident on the route that I usually take, and I would have been there at the precise moment of the accedent had I not went the other way. |
Just for the sake of argument, and I wasn't there so let's call this hypothetical. Perhaps as you were driving, your eyes saw a car driving eratically down the road that you would normally take. You didn't conciously perceive that as a threat, or may not even have conciously noticed it, but 'something inside you' said the alternate way would be safer. So you turned. |
|
|
|
08/22/2008 03:18:38 PM · #194 |
| We seem to have had similar experiences with our kids -- congratulations! :-) |
|
|
|
08/22/2008 03:19:28 PM · #195 |
Ok. I did not mean for it to go this far. I was just putting my opinion in on what the 6th sense was. :)
In no way can I explain everything, and I shouldn't have to. :)
God made the devil and all the angels before He made us. He made them with a free will, just like He did with us. He also created them to live forever, like He did us. The devil, who was an archangel, thought that he would rise above God so God decided to throw him down to earth. He has to spend eternity in hell because of his actions. He also took 1/3 of the angles with him because they all have a free will and they decided to follow the devil. God made us with a free will as well. We have to decide if we want to follow the devil or follow God. This would take waayyy to long to explain, but it is all in the Bible :) God gave us power and dominion over the devil when Jesus died on the cross. It is up to us to take authority over the devil and his plan. God gave us that authority on the earth. God is a good God, and the devil is a bad devil. God doesn't want bad things to happen on the earth. All I know is that I love my God and He takes care of His children. I can't explain everything, but if you want to find out for yourself... read the Bible :) |
|
|
|
08/22/2008 03:23:40 PM · #196 |
| Looks like my work is done here. My free will and the FSM are going to rock out to some Ministry. |
|
|
|
08/22/2008 03:24:23 PM · #197 |
Before we get too far off topic: NikonJeb, would you mind coming back to this?
Originally posted by Sam94720:
So you saw a flying object you could not identify. There's a multitude of possible explanations. It might have been extraterrestrials. Or a weather balloon. Or a military aircraft. Or the Flying Spaghetti Monster. Or a flying teapot. Or a transmissible disease that made you hallucinate. Or a message from the other side. etc. etc.
I don't know what it was. Maybe one day we'll find out. Until then I can live with the uncertainty.
You, on the other hand, seem to prefer one explanation over all the others. Why?
About your ball lightning: Ehm, yes, you saw some ball lightning. The three paragraphs above apply.
P.S.: My hamster died ten minutes ago. I think you cursed it. You can certainly not dismiss the possibility! I have been there. |
|
|
|
|
08/22/2008 03:24:27 PM · #198 |
| Okay, I'm sorry now I asked ;) |
|
|
|
08/22/2008 03:25:52 PM · #199 |
Originally posted by BeeCee:
Okay, I'm sorry now I asked ;) |
You should have sensed this coming... ;-) |
|
|
|
08/22/2008 03:26:39 PM · #200 |
Originally posted by scalvert:
Originally posted by BeeCee:
Okay, I'm sorry now I asked ;) |
You should have sensed this coming... ;-) |
Lol, sheesh, there's no such thing as prescience! |
|
