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12/02/2005 12:20:58 PM · #101 |
My whole thought on this is put up or shut up. I'm not about to critique the vast range of ability displayed on this website by taking some elitist attitude when I don't have the guts to post anything of my own. I will give people my honest opinion when I think it might help them learn, but in no way would I ever insinuate that a large majority of what I consider to be "Bad SHots" be in someway inferior in value than others based on my own aesthetics. the ratings you get tend to be a good enough indicator of people's opinions of shots without having to lable anything as BAD.
The neat thing about this site is that there is a HUGE range of talent here and people shouldn't feel intimidated to post pictures that don't look like the ones you see in the top 5. And you might be saying, "we're talking about the ones that I would rate as a 1 or maybe a 2. not the ones that i would rate a 4 or 5." Well, too bad we all can't see the world through your eyes. But chances are if you rate all the pics in a particular challenge, then you will see what is good and what is not. If you submitted a pic, (and I see you never have) the rating and the comments will tell you that you have succeeded in representing your artistic thoughts, or you have failed.
Even the great artists of all time have created things that are not worth a second glance. Don't be so sure that yours will always be outside of that group. |
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12/02/2005 12:23:09 PM · #102 |
I don't really mind looking at a truly awful photograph, once in a while. I do prefer it to looking through so many pretty postcards and gift-shop sentiments. A truly wretched shot slows my viewing habits, and, more often than not, encourages a second or third look.
I can also think of some truly great photos, which appeared truly awful at first glance. I don't feel inundated by ugly images. I feel inundated by by the slick delivery of shallow perceptions.
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12/02/2005 12:24:56 PM · #103 |
I haven't read this entire thread, but I did read the first 50 or so posts, and I simply wanted to add something:
I think a lot of folks jumped on the OP citing the lack of entries, ribbons, etc. I think this is WRONG. I think she had a very valid point in asking why there are some tragically bad photos in challenges that it is difficult to see the merit in. Yes we have some very young participants, that's one reason, also, we have some new people who are still learning about their camera and this site and what counts as a "good" photo to DPC eyes. Lets be nice, give the benefit of the doubt and try to see what the question was instead of making ad hominem (personal) attacks on the poster for asking a valid question.
I am posting this, in case there is any question, as a member of the site and nothing else.
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12/02/2005 12:25:10 PM · #104 |
Originally posted by mesmeraj:
oh and 7. They were intoxicated
"drunk man walking home" is never as humouros with a hangover. |
Quite often my reason ... lol
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12/02/2005 12:27:08 PM · #105 |
also, I fixed the typos in the title. I don't think that's a reason to attack someone either. I have made typing and spelling errors in my time as well.
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12/02/2005 12:37:01 PM · #106 |
Originally posted by KaDi:
Originally posted by megatherian:
...(omission of well-stated arguments)...Which comes back to my question, why do people post pictures they KNOW are bad? |
They don't know. |
I didn't know this one was 'bad' until I got the reactions from the voters. That's when I learned about monitor calibration.
So, I would suggest to those who have problems looking at what they consider "bad" images, to either hold your nose, avert your eyes (or both) and hit the button for the next image.
Hmmm, come to think of it, that makes an interesting picture right there.
;>)
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12/02/2005 01:02:04 PM · #107 |
.
Message edited by author 2005-12-02 13:22:39. |
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12/02/2005 01:10:33 PM · #108 |
Originally posted by frisca:
I think a lot of folks jumped on the OP citing the lack of entries, ribbons, etc. I think this is WRONG. I think she had a very valid point in asking why there are some tragically bad photos in challenges that it is difficult to see the merit in. |
I completely agree with this. It happens all too often in the forums here. Known as the logical fallacy of "ad hominem" (to the man), people attack the person and their credentials (or apparent lack of)in order to refute an argument. This, of course, leads to a "red herring". So we end up arguing about the argument instead of the question.
As to the question, I think many fine answers have been offered. People do all sorts of things for all sorts of reasons....that's why we see what might be considered a truly "bad" photo so frequently. HOWEVER, I'd like someone to show me a photo here that received nothing above a 5! (Even my lowest scoring challenge entry, which was to many voters truly awful, received two 10's, one 9, and four 8's.)
The question itself, in this case, may also be "flawed". Asking why people post pictures they "know" are bad--assumes that they "know." (Of course this was only implied in the original question and stated after the fact.) Still, there's nothing wrong with asking the question and expecting intelligent discussion.
///On a humorous note, I'd like to know:
--Why does the woman who sings off key always sit in the back of the church and always sing louder than anyone else?
edit: Is one hour too soon to claim a kill?
Message edited by author 2005-12-02 14:13:22.
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12/02/2005 02:25:19 PM · #109 |
I agree that lack of experience doesn't negate one's opinion. I'm not an expert in making TV shows or movies, or writing books, but I think I'm free to say that certain ones are bad...
We'll see about claiming the kill, KaDi...
Message edited by author 2005-12-02 14:26:01.
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12/02/2005 02:45:09 PM · #110 |
Originally posted by scalvert:
There are "awful" shots here for the same reason there are obese people at the gym... everybody has to start somewhere. In both cases, hard work WILL pay off, and the real shame would be not trying at all. |
Hear, hear. (I'm also the obese bloke at the gym)
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12/02/2005 02:48:06 PM · #111 |
Originally posted by nshapiro:
So it's probably a good thing I didn't enter this?
:) |
It is, indeed, hard to differentiate between a purposely out of focus shot and an accidental one, but it is easy to see that the out of focus works on this photo, definitely. Nice shot, Neil.
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12/02/2005 02:52:40 PM · #112 |
I think the scores reflect the quality of the shots in most instances.
It is then up to the individual to get their average up by improving their work.My personal average vote received is around 5.5, which means I am an average photographer.If I really want to excel and get up there with the big guys I need to put more effort in and come up with better pictures.
Is it so simple :-)
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12/02/2005 03:14:18 PM · #113 |
After ploughing through this thread, I'm afraid I have only one answer to the question posed:-
Does it matter?
It hurts no-one, it might help someone, it doesn't harm the site and it causes interest if nothing else!
Let's go and talk about something else or shoot a few more pics!
P
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12/02/2005 03:24:07 PM · #114 |
Originally posted by frisca:
... I think she had a very valid point in asking why there are some tragically bad photos in challenges that it is difficult to see the merit in. ... |
This is the second time in this thread that someone has tried to give the OP a sex change.
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12/02/2005 03:55:13 PM · #115 |
Originally posted by lenkphotos:
Originally posted by frisca:
... I think she had a very valid point in asking why there are some tragically bad photos in challenges that it is difficult to see the merit in. ... |
This is the second time in this thread that someone has tried to give the OP a sex change. |
:-) I don't want to go back and re-check the whole thread, but actually I think it is the 3rd or 4th time :-) ..in fact, I think I recall seeing in an early post, someone referred to them as a he and she in the same post!
hmmmmm....very interesting....strange things are afoot in the 'bad photo' thread!!!
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12/02/2005 04:59:15 PM · #116 |
Originally posted by megatherian:
Wow I really think I hit a nerve with some people.
My question wasn't personal but it seems a lot of people are taking it personally and taking pot shots back at me and making assumptions and interjections about what my point was.
I never said people with truely aweful shots should not be allowed to enter and I never said I should be the ruler by which all photos are judged.
There have been a few pictures posted in this thread - take a look at the ratings, they are all in the 4 point range, THOSE AREN"T THE PHOTOS I'M TALKING ABOUT.
As far as my qualifications to even ask such a question on here having not posted pictures myself well I'm a paid member and voter on this site and I don't believe the picture count in your portfolio gives you added rights or qualifications. I still have an opinion and I still will be voting on your photos.
Not everyone needs a hug, told that they are special and that their photo is good in it's own special way. A bad photo that no one likes is a bad photo that no one likes, it doesn't matter how experienced the photographer is.
When you vote do you factor in the experience of the photographer? How about their age? How good their vision and color recognition are?
When it comes down to it we vote on the pictures not the photographers. If the majority of the people here on this site vote a picture a 1 or maybe a 2 then according to this community it's a bad photo and I think the majority of the people who post a photo that will be rated a 1 or maybe a 2 know it's a bad photo. If they know it's a bad photo then couldn't they ask themselves "why do I think my photo is bad?" and then try and fix those problems before posting? Which comes back to my question, why do people post pictures they KNOW are bad? |
You just answered your own question. I must say I can't believe your still misspelling awful (aweful) after all the comments. And its truly not, (truely).
Message edited by author 2005-12-02 17:28:29. |
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12/02/2005 05:03:12 PM · #117 |
Originally posted by keegbow:
Some of the members here are children who are just learning and having fun. |
yeah im 13 and the one challenge i've entered i ended up putting a semi-blurry one because it was the best one. Some people enter for the fun of it and to hope to get a critique that will help them out in the future. Give a little slack already. Why do you care if we're having fun? isn't that what photographys all about? |
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12/02/2005 06:45:24 PM · #118 |
Originally posted by stormy:
Everything is subjective |
*cough*NotTrue*cough*
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12/02/2005 07:07:23 PM · #119 |
Well said :)
Originally posted by coatedbtrmlk:
Originally posted by keegbow:
Some of the members here are children who are just learning and having fun. |
yeah im 13 and the one challenge i've entered i ended up putting a semi-blurry one because it was the best one. Some people enter for the fun of it and to hope to get a critique that will help them out in the future. Give a little slack already. Why do you care if we're having fun? isn't that what photographys all about? |
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12/02/2005 07:15:41 PM · #120 |
To the origanator of this thread, there must be truth in Confuscious' expression... "man who fishes in another man's pond will catch crabs"
One thing that came through many times are 'so what?'. Maybe if you start fishing in your own pond WE may catch the craps(sic).;-)
To those like me, do not let this get to you, like I said before there are more good guys on DPC than bad. Do not allow the acid tongued minority to influence the sweet of sharing and participating and learning and challenging yourself to become better. |
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12/02/2005 07:23:16 PM · #121 |
Originally posted by megatherian:
Wow I really think I hit a nerve with some people.
My question wasn't personal but it seems a lot of people are taking it personally and taking pot shots back at me and making assumptions and interjections about what my point was.
I never said people with truly awful shots should not be allowed to enter and I never said I should be the ruler by which all photos are judged.
There have been a few pictures posted in this thread - take a look at the ratings, they are all in the 4 point range, THOSE AREN"T THE PHOTOS I'M TALKING ABOUT.
As far as my qualifications to even ask such a question on here having not posted pictures myself well I'm a paid member and voter on this site and I don't believe the picture count in your portfolio gives you added rights or qualifications. I still have an opinion and I still will be voting on your photos.
Not everyone needs a hug, told that they are special and that their photo is good in it's own special way. A bad photo that no one likes is a bad photo that no one likes, it doesn't matter how experienced the photographer is.
When you vote do you factor in the experience of the photographer? How about their age? How good their vision and color recognition are?
When it comes down to it we vote on the pictures not the photographers. If the majority of the people here on this site vote a picture a 1 or maybe a 2 then according to this community it's a bad photo and I think the majority of the people who post a photo that will be rated a 1 or maybe a 2 know it's a bad photo. If they know it's a bad photo then couldn't they ask themselves "why do I think my photo is bad?" and then try and fix those problems before posting? Which comes back to my question, why do people post pictures they KNOW are bad? |
You have every right to ask questions and post in the forums you are also well within your rights not to enter competitions or have photos in your portfolio.
So I don't know why you are being hounded and why so many people here are suffering from an over-reaction, do they feel it is a personal insult ? or are they over sensitive ?
To help answer your question I think some valid answers have been given already amongst all the hype but to me personally I don't know why some entries are put up, I even reviewed something I entered and still came up with the same answer, what was I thinking ? truly an awful shot.
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12/02/2005 07:26:01 PM · #122 |
keegbow, I'm trying to kill this thing... please let it die, and me be the killer, please...? ;-)
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12/02/2005 10:04:09 PM · #123 |
No fair trying to kill threads while I'm out at my photo club meeting!
The death of this thread rightfully belongs to me for posting such a long post with links to Wikipedia and logical fallacies--for they apparently put everyone to sleep!
;p
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12/02/2005 10:22:16 PM · #124 |
| Those threads that are about to die.... I salute you. |
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12/02/2005 10:24:41 PM · #125 |
Originally posted by jsas:
Those threads that are about to die.... I salute you. |
The thread thanks you....and so do I. =)
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