shooting a play... need a little help

12/04/2008 06:51:24 PM · #1

im shooting a play tomorrow night and i was went in too there practice today. and i found it really hard to get good exposures. the scene was way too high in contrast. has anyone shot a play before? any tips? my fastest lens is a sigma 70-200 2.8 by the way the rest are gonna be too slow for the night

BAMartin

Apple iPhone 5

12/04/2008 07:00:21 PM · #2

Not sure what help I can be, but I took this photo at a play and had no problem with contrast. The details: f5.6 at 1/250, I did have to use 1600 iso though.

Message edited by author 2008-12-04 19:00:38.

Nikon AF-S DX NIKKOR 18-200mm f/3.5-5.6G ED VR II

12/04/2008 07:02:04 PM · #3

im trying to avoid using too high an iso. with the black background it has, im getting horrible noise. even with NR on it bugs me.

pineapple

Canon EOS-5D

Canon EF 50mm f/1.4 USM

12/04/2008 07:13:30 PM · #4

Oddly enough, I just returned from doing work on a play this evening in NYC. Tomorrow night is the first night. Tonight was the final dress rehearsal. The DR is the time to shoot because you can move around freely without worrying about an audience having its view blocked. I have no clue about Nikon equipment. I used my Canon 5D, 24-70mm f/2.8, 100mm f/2.8, and 50mm f/1.4. I used a custom white balance shot with a white card. Tungsten setting is also good enough in such situations, usually. Check it. I also had 2 light stands, umbrellas, gels for tungsten, and 2 portable flash heads, 1 Canon and 1 Nikon. I used the flash heads during the intermission to take vignette shots, and group shots. During the play, I did not use flash but had the ISO up to 1600 and shot at f/4.0 approx at 1/80. All shot on manual in RAW. The 5D shoots nicely at 1500 ISO and the noise is fairly limited. The 100mm lens gives very sharp intimate shots. The wide angle zoom makes up all the rest.

Nikon D200

12/04/2008 07:45:13 PM · #5

Shoot in RAW
Manual Mode
Shutter speed at least 1/80, go 1/320 if there is fast moving action.
Exposure Comp +5
Aperture 2.8
Continuous Auto Focus
VR on if the Sigma lens has VR
Check white balance

This should give you room to play with your ISO, but you will have to bump it to probably about 400-600 even with those settings.

Keep shots tight in the spotlights (not the edges of the stage).

Good luck and have fun!

PS I highly recommend borrowing the 50mm 1.8 from someone if you can. :)

cdrice

Nikon D7000

Nikon AF-S DX Zoom-Nikkor 17-55mm f/2.8G IF-ED

12/04/2008 07:56:51 PM · #6

Yay, fun!

I shoot primarily theatre and concert; I'm happy to point you a couple of directions. Theatre photography shares most of the same issues as concert work, albeit (luckily) with less-extreme lighting changes (at least in terms of speed of lighting changes... depending on how creative the lighting designer was, you can stack a theatre show up against the best concerts for radical lighting and nearly impossible EV capture range).

Anyway, see my (and others, of course) comments in this thread, where I also refer to a few other dpc threads about concert photography.

You'll do well to review this article/tutorial as well. If you had more time, I'd point you to a couple of great books as well.

I *wholeheartedly* agree with Andrew's (

pineapple) comments. Final Dress is THE time to do your work, aside from if the director sets up a formal photo call for you to shoot specific scenes.

If you're not at final dress, and actually shooting a show, ABOVE ALL, stay out of everyone's way. I only shoot during actual shows if the director absolutely requires it (and even then I've turned shoots down), because it's just too hard to avoid bothering people. Just like at a concert, getting in someone's way who's paying for a ticket is horribly unprofessional, and even worse than being at a concert, the noise of your shutter (as well as your movement) is horribly annoying. If it's a show with an audience, leave your 70-200 on and stay in the back as far away as you can.

I shoot with a Nikon D80 as well. My workhorse lenses are my 70-200VR/2.8 and 17-55/2.8. I carry my 50/1.8, but seldom seem to use it, aside from creative posed (during photo call) shots. The tele lens is, of course, great of close-ups and isolation (or just working from the back of the house). I like to occasionally use my 17mm end "up close and personal" to really fill the frame with an actor or pair of actors -- it's hard to remember sometimes how creative a wide-angle lens can be up close, vs. just trying to "fit everything in". I'd recommend renting a fast wide lens if you don't have one.

On my D80, I try my best to limit iso to 640. At 800, I see uncorrectable noise, so I only cross that 800 boundry if I absolutely have to, or I intentionally want to be creative with the noise itself. Unless the lighting is unusually abundant, I just leave it set at 640. (Posed photos, of course, are a different matter altogether, and you can usually get the lighting op to bring up lights for you; just try not to alter the impact of the creative lighting they designed for the show).

I personally do not bring or use any flash at all. A monopod is a very nice accessory. Tripod only for posed shots (otherwise you are moving around too much to bother with it, and it's usually very difficult to move around the house).

My settings match Andrew's pretty closely --

I start with iso 640, f/wide-open, 1/100 and slower shutter... down to 1/30 on the monopod. I wouldn't dream of shooting anything other than raw. Tungsten WB (and adjust in post; but remember to preserve their creative lighting; don't balance it out completely), or balanced with expodisc (same caveat -- you don't want to completely balance out the creative lighting). I shoot manual mode, EV comp -1.3, spot meter. Check histograms and viewfinder for highlights. Familiarize yourself with low-key histograms, as 75-90% of your shots will fit that curve. Watch for highlights, and keep a close eye on your settings and meter readings when the lights change.

Manual mode is, in my opinion, the only way to go. I tried all modes when I was getting started, and found the lighting conditions simply change too fast for the camera to adjust (this is more of an issue in concert than theatre). Lighting conditions in concert and theatre will screw up any camera's matrix metering -- I'd only use center or spot -- meter off of a target you want to expose properly, and ballpark your settings based on your camera's meter reading. Great thing about digital there is you can quickly check your exposure and adjust as necessary. Don't worry about getting perfect exposures; you can push and pull quite a bit in post with raw images. Just don't blow out too much on your highlights, obviously.

What other specific questions do you have from what you shot today?

I'd recommend reviewing your shots from today, especially those you like, and see what your settings were, as well as what kind of lighting they had up at the time. Do the same from the shots that look horrible, and learn from your mistakes.

Concert and theatre work will really push your "real time" skills. Philosophically, I think you have to combine some zen and some ninja -- stay calm, keep your head, keep moving, and stay out of the way... ;)

ETA - Hey there, Laurie (

L2)! Your post snuck in while I was typing my little novelette. I completely agree with Laurie's comments as well (didn't want it to sound like I was ignoring her)! :) Except perhaps the EV comp +5. Maybe it's just personal preference, but what's that about? ;)

E(again)TA - OH, and wear all black. It keeps you thinking ninja thoughts. :D Okay, maybe not -- but seriously, even if it's dress and no one is there, I think it shows you're serious about staying out of the way and out of sight. Even with the stage lights up, if you have brightly colored clothing and are moving around in the house, you can distract the actors. I even have black gaff and electrical tape covering up all the "shiny" things on my D80, including the lens caps, and actually tape down my on-camera flash so there is no chance it could pop. I do that more so I don't get attacked by security at concerts, but it helps keep you look less distracting for those on stage.

Okay, last-last minute thought -- when shooting on stage (i.e. photo call / posed), lens hood or flag is a MUST, unless you actually want to get some flare for creative effect.

No more editing now. I'm done. Really. I'm putting this thread down and walking away. :P

Message edited by author 2008-12-04 20:17:31.

Tamron SP AF 28-75mm f/2.8 XR Di for Canon

12/04/2008 11:03:38 PM · #7

wowwwwwwwwwwwww did not expect such a thorough reply! thank you so much. this should help me more than you could imagine. i should be able to shoot the final dress tomorrow night. ill let you know how every thing goes and post some of my favorite shots. thank you again times a million.

PGerst

Canon EOS-20D

12/04/2008 11:54:57 PM · #8

I found shooting a play was quite easy.

Here are some shots I took from the pit (I was playing trombone) for the King and I. I decided NOT to change the color balance too much. I wanted to keep as much of the theatrical lighting tones as possible.

This is what I learned:

1) There is a lot of light there (for iso 800-1600). A lot of black space too, so make sure you KNOW what your camera is metering. Check the settings. I used the center as much as possible.

2) I shot f2.8 - f5.6 most of the time with the Tamrom 28-75 f2.8 with the canon 20D. I shot primarily ISO 800 with 1/60 to 1/100 second exposures. But, you will need to figure out the proper exposure settings and metering TTL. Each scene is different requiring different light settings (see #5)

3) PEOPLE MOVE FAST! You don't think they are, until you are shooting at 1/60th of a second. Remember, you most likely can't use flash so you can't rely on the instantaneous moment of light to freeze your frame. Shooting dance numbers was particularly challenging. At times, I bumped to ISO 1600.

4) Get a faster lens if possible. I wish I had something faster than f2.8, but the noise level on the 20D is pretty good at ISO 800 and 1600. Nothing I couldn't really manage later on.

5) Know the play. Sit through it once, take some shots, then see it again to get those perfect angles. I was lucky to see the play 1, 2, 3, + ....oh my...times, so I knew exactly where each person would stand what the lighting would be, etc. I was limited because I had the camera in one hand, and the trombone in the other. I play a few notes, and *click*, play a few notes and *click*. But, you, should move around.

6) Dress rehersal is a great time to shoot for the highest quality shots. But, if possible, get some shots the rehersal before, where people are still in jeans and t-shirts. Those rehersals mean something to the actors. Not everything has to be pretty.

7) If its a musical, shoot the orchestra! Don't leave them out. Performers rely on the music and its a major part of their performance. Capture it.

8) Get backstage photos of the dress, particularly at the dress rehersal.

So, good luck, have fun. This was my first "real" shoot. I wasn't asked. I simply volunteered for fun. The photos were better than the point and shoots everyone had and I made a few bucks on reprints.

Paul

Message edited by author 2008-12-05 00:10:38.

Nikon D200

Nikon AF-S DX NIKKOR 18-200mm f/3.5-5.6G ED VR II

12/04/2008 11:56:51 PM · #9

Originally posted by cdrice:

...

ETA - Hey there, Laurie ( L2)! Your post snuck in while I was typing my little novelette. I completely agree with Laurie's comments as well (didn't want it to sound like I was ignoring her)! :) Except perhaps the EV comp +5. Maybe it's just personal preference, but what's that about? ;)

...

:) I saw your -1.3 EV and figured you'd have a heart attack. I really only said +5EV because of the lens the OP is using; normally I'd be down lower with my own camera/lens combo -- but not quite negative EV. It defo is a personal thing - I'm just more comfortable with toning down than up in PP.

And the advice about Ninja-thinking is quite right. CMTC - Also, don't be afraid to hang out of the opera boxes - if the stage is right you might get some good reflections on the floor with the higher viewpoint. Keep a spare memory card in your pocket because you might have to change it out in the dark.

Can't wait to see what you come out with!

cdrice

Nikon D7000

Nikon AF-S DX Zoom-Nikkor 17-55mm f/2.8G IF-ED

12/05/2008 12:19:30 AM · #10

Okay, I can't help myself -- more thoughts... :D

I'm not sure how "big" your show is (in terms of production value, budget, etc.)... but one really nice professional touch that a lot of smaller venues don't have or don't consider is a lobby display. As long as they (or you) can budget maybe $20 up to $50, you can make a really nice display that gives even the smallest show a professional touch.

Here's how --

Once you have your shots from final dress, quickly pick out the best 10-20 shots and fully develop them. I try to get closeups of each major character (as much as the cast size allows), as well as some group and scenic shots. Don't pick any shots that give any secrets of the plot away, of course.

Sort them into prints suitable for 8x10, 5x7 and perhaps a few 4x6s; take them to your local lab (somewhere fast, since the show most likely opens the night after final dress) and get prints made. Pick up 2-3 black poster boards, and some double-sided tape (or black flat thumbtacks). Arrange the shots on the poster board, then display them in the lobby area at the show's main entrance. Some theatres have dedicated bulletin board space for this very purpose; if not, try to borrow an easel or other "nice looking" stand.

I stick a little 4x6 and/or business card in the bottom corner of one of the displays with my name and web site. I usually also make a 5x7 with the show title, director name, and run dates; and place that print in the middle or at the top of the display area (black background with silver or metallic "scrolly" font works really well for that).

It takes a pretty short amount of time and small amount of money, but when done correctly and artistically, the impact is HUGE, and your director (and the rest of the staff) will be delighted, especially if they weren't expecting it or didn't think of it themselves. I've even had referral shoots come in from people who saw the shots on display and wanted me to do other non-theatre work for them.

Yet another idea --

For small shows, I like to generate a large (8x10 usually) collage print showcasing each cast member in-character and have the cast sign it. I usually print 2 or 3 and frame them -- one for the director, one for the playwright (if it's written by a local artist) and one for me. There again, you're looking at maybe $10 to $15, but the impact is HUGE, and you're virtually guaranteed repeat customers and referrals. That step can be done at the end of the run (i.e. don't worry with that for opening night, but take your time on it and bring it the closing weekend of the show). I've had directors tear-up when they are presented. You can let the cast make a whole presentation of it with lots of drama and misty-eyed recollections of what a great experience this was, etc. ;)

I have some other little doo-dads I make for my small-cast shows, but I'm not giving away all my secrets. :P

Anyway, just some little tidbits that might really make your work shine, and get you more shoots in the future...

If you or anyone find this useful, I'd love to hear about your experiences.