| Author | Thread |
|
|
05/05/2008 11:38:31 PM · #1 |
I typed up this post for the 'Daunted by 1st DSLR' thread but felt I may hijack their discussion. But basically, I wonder what the desire is to shoot in manual mode as opposed to aperture or shutter mode.
Frankly, I can't see any reason to use manual mode. I tried it one day and found it rather pointless.
The way I see it...
Av: Set aperture as appropriate, camera automatically sets speed, adjust exposure up or down depending on situation.
M: Set aperture, rotate speed manually until exposure meter tells you when to stop, adjust up or down depending on situation.
The only difference in manual is that the camera doesn't automatically take you to a speed starting point. There are a few exceptions when I will use manual if I am looking for some special effects but failing that... Av all the way.
I get the sense that manual mode is more for pride than practicality unless you are using a handheld light meter and want to bypass the cameras exposure meter.
(Yes, I am open to explanations as to why I am wrong as I have lots to learn.) |
|
|
|
05/05/2008 11:43:51 PM · #2 |
Two thoughts:
1) When you need to finesse the exposure, measure it in AV then adjust it in manual. (or take the easy way out and use the +/- EV ... I use both techniques)
2) When flash becomes your main source of light, Av no longer works. You'll need to determine how much ambient light you want to let in and set your shutter speed and aperture appropriately. If you leave the camera on Av, and try to shoot a reception, for instance, you'll end up shooting at very slow speeds (1/15th of a second, for example, depending on aperture and ISO). Indoors, letting in too much ambient light also complicates getting a decent white balance. So it's better to switch to manual and limit the amount of ambient light you're getting.
|
|
|
|
05/05/2008 11:48:48 PM · #3 |
| I actually only shoot in manual. I just like having complete control of the settings. I've found that AV and TV don't always get it exactly right, so I'd rather set everything myself. |
|
|
|
05/05/2008 11:49:52 PM · #4 |
One more:
When doing a panorama, often the auto-exposure modes will pick different total exposure settings for different parts of the panorama, causing banding in the sky when you stitch them together. You are better off metering the whole panorama, then picking an exposure that won't cause too many saturated highlights, and locking that in with manual. |
|
|
|
05/05/2008 11:49:58 PM · #5 |
| I shoot manual about 90% of the time. I shoot AV when I shoot action shots. |
|
|
|
05/05/2008 11:51:55 PM · #6 |
Manual mode for the studio and Av for almost everything else.
In the studio Av mode will expose for the modelling lights so Manual is a neccessity.
bazz. |
|
|
|
05/05/2008 11:59:01 PM · #7 |
I mainly shoot Av, BUT use M when I am shooting a particular style/technique with flash. Dragging the shutter and Fast sync are two such techniques. I'm doing a project of portraits where I want the black felt background to be completely black. Manual is the only way to go in this case.
|
|
|
|
05/06/2008 12:02:06 AM · #8 |
When you have consistent lighting, such as an indoor sporting event the cameras meter can easily be fooled. Also shooting with flash in poorly lit places will cause the flash to be used for fill rather then stopping action. And as mentioned before try that AV with a set of strobes and enjoy the white photos you will get to try and edit later. There are two modes I use, AV and Manual each has their own use and situation. They could take every other setting off my cameras and I would never know.
Matt |
|
|
|
05/06/2008 12:02:30 AM · #9 |
AV most of the time with ever changing ISO. Manual only for long exposure stuff, special effects, etc. On days I decide I'll go full manual all day I spend too much time re-metering and re-setting. Its more fun though. :P
|
|
|
|
05/06/2008 12:03:24 AM · #10 |
Manual setting helps consistency in many conditions. If you don't need consistency, manual might not be helpful. I seldom use manual unless I'm doing studio macro shots. Most of the time I use aperture priority and let the shutter speed fall where it may. (I shoot mostly with a tripod and seldom fast action)
Message edited by author 2008-05-06 00:04:31.
|
|
|
|
05/06/2008 12:03:37 AM · #11 |
Originally posted by Trinch:
I get the sense that manual mode is more for pride than practicality unless you are using a handheld light meter and want to bypass the cameras exposure meter. |
Nah...I am lazy and want the easy way :-) Like a few others I do M all the time for flash/strobes and I ain't got a light meter. When not doing the strobist manual flash thing, I use eTTL with the camera in manual.... it's far better consistency that way and you can control what changes, the flash just stops when it's got enough light (although I play with the flash-comp a lot when doing this combo). eTTL in AV mode seems to grab onto anything and the variation between the shots fluctuates; I suspect if you understood it there would be less of an issue.
|
|
|
|
05/06/2008 12:10:08 AM · #12 |
One of my favorite books Understanding Exposure teaches you how to exposur using manual. Basically the big reason I found in my reading is to get homed in on part of the scene and expose it really well. So if you have a bunch of shiny leaved trees and an ominous sky with a bunch of mountains in between you can make the decision what is going to be well exposed and what can be a little off.
The camera also doesn't take into consider a lot of other factors. Eg. My 70 - 300 mm has an f-stop range from 4-5.6 In order to shoot at the 300 mm end (which is 450 mm with the small sensor crop factor), I should be shooting at 1/500 of a second or faster in order to avoid camera shake. I dial that in and....the camera just set my aperture to 5.6 which is wide open. Unfortunately I want more depth of field than that. Well how much more? I'm thinking f/8. If I adjust my aperture to f/8 my shutter speed drops to 1/125 or so. (I can't do the math in my head darn it anyways). Unless I adjust my ISO.
Hey! Now I can have
a) The shutter speed I want to prevent camera shake.
b) the aperture I want to get the depth of field I want
The point is this. You select a certain aperture to control the depth of field. You select a certain shutter speed to prevent camera shake or perhaps blur motion. Why wouldn't you want to have control over both? That's why you purchase an SLR. SLR's take no better pictures than a P&S in auto modes generally. The reason you want an SLR is to have that control right at your finger tips.
Message edited by author 2008-05-06 00:13:27. |
|
|
|
05/06/2008 12:30:06 AM · #13 |
Originally posted by Citadel:
SLR's take no better pictures than a P&S in auto modes generally. |
I think they would in low-light/high-ISO situations. My small sensor is pretty useless above ISO 200, so Manual mode becomes less useful with fewer options available.
One time you need to use Manual is for odd lighting situations like shooting the Moon -- any kind of auto-exposure will almost always blow it out entirely to a white blob. |
|
|
|
05/06/2008 12:39:19 AM · #14 |
Although my DPC username may say different, I shoot in Manual mode about 95% of the time. I learned manual mode on a Canon AV-1 and Olympus OM-1, many moons ago (back when I even developed and printed my own film photos).
To address your example, let's say you are in Av mode. You set your aperture and the speed is automatically set. What if you don't want this speed? What if the subject is moving slowly and you want to emphasize this movement. You'll need to adjust the speed manually (while maintaining the DOF--keeping your aperture size).
On the other hand, if you use Tv priority (Time Value or shutter speed priority), you may not like the DOF given to you.
Another handy feature of Manual mode is that I don't have to worry about where the exposure compensation button is and how to set it. If you shoot in Manual mode, it's all natural, just turn the dials with either your thumb or your index finger (on Canon hardware) to over or under expose the image as you see fit.
To take Manual mode one step further, I use manual auto-focus points. I can use the joystick on the back of the camera (again, Canon hardware only) to move the focus point to where I want it to be.
|
|
|
|
05/06/2008 12:41:05 AM · #15 |
I probably should have mentioned earlier, that Av would be totally useless when using a flash. I realize that. My point was that for everyday, out and about, natural light photography, doesn't manual mode just add an extra step without adding much benefit. I also see that if you need consistent exposure over several shots, manual is a must (ie stitching landscapes).
In answer to citadel, I have complete control over the situations you described when using Av. The camera selected shutter speed is just step 1. From there, I'll increase the ISO if I need more speed or adjust the exposure if I want to handle a scene with a wide range of brightness. |
|
|
|
05/06/2008 01:16:57 AM · #16 |
I have a lot of older Nikkor lenses that don't meter with the S3 Fuji. They shoot great photos, but I have to manually set everything and focus too. I like that for shooting birds and moving critters. I usually shoot a couple of test shots to get the settings right when I know that there may be some shots coming up. When shooting birds on the wing, AE and AF can't keep up with the movement, or lock in on a small object against a bright sky or dark BG, so manual is the right way to go for that occasion.
A scene that would give auto anything a tough time:
|
|
|
|
05/06/2008 01:32:23 AM · #17 |
What I would suggest is to put your camera into a medium quality JPG setting and then go try shooting manual for an hour or so. Shoot everything that you see. Your whole goal is correct exposure. Don't worry about interesting subjects or nice composition. Just get good exposure. After a while, you'll start thinking in terms of creative exposure. For any given scene, you have 6 or more choices that will have the "correct" exposure but not necessarily the "creatively correct" exposure. Really, that's why I started going straight manual myself.
edit: Is it 6 exposures or is it 3? Dang I can never remember.... :)
edit: The reason you put the camera into JPG mode is because you'll hopefully have a boat load of images to go through and critique.
Message edited by author 2008-05-06 01:38:55.
|
|
|
|
05/06/2008 01:43:31 AM · #18 |
One more thought on this subject (Then bed time for me!). I recently picked up a Holga medium format toy camera.
Here is what you can control:
ISO
That's it. Shutter speed is either bulb or normal which varies from camera to camera so don't ask me what mine is. There are two settings for aperture: f/8 or f/11. Only f/8 actually works.
After shooting with this P o S (note: not P & S) you will gladly shoot manual.
:)
(As an aside, I can't wait for my prints to come back from the lab!)
|
|
|
|
05/06/2008 03:19:29 AM · #19 |
I have been shooting in Manual for ages, since that's how I learned photography. I have only recently discovered the point explained in the OP, and now I shoot Av most of the time, adjusting the EV when necessary. Has switching from M to Av degraded the quality or creativity of my pictures? I think it has not. Has it increased the number of correctly exposed pics? Yes it has. Has it increased the ease of taking pics? You bet it has!
I can and will make the same adjustments in Av as I did in M, but when these adjustments are not needed, my camera saves me the time and hassle.
Obviously, when using flash or strobes, or when shooting special effects etc, I go back to M. Likewise, for panning and action, I switch to Tv. And I always shoot in RAW, which allows me for a little extra correction in PP if needed.
|
|
|
|
05/06/2008 05:15:59 AM · #20 |
Originally posted by AperturePriority:
To address your example, let's say you are in Av mode. You set your aperture and the speed is automatically set. What if you don't want this speed? What if the subject is moving slowly and you want to emphasize this movement. You'll need to adjust the speed manually (while maintaining the DOF--keeping your aperture size). |
Thats what Exposure Compensation is for. Or you could use ISO adjustments to influence the shutter speed.
Originally posted by AperturePriority:
To take Manual mode one step further, I use manual auto-focus points. I can use the joystick on the back of the camera (again, Canon hardware only) to move the focus point to where I want it to be. |
Do you mean the Canon has a joystick poking out of the back of the camera ? I think all current DSLR's come with a 4 way joypad so I'm wondering what your referring to here. It sounds like something that could stab you in the face during framing. :shrugs:
bazz.
Message edited by author 2008-05-06 05:17:53. |
|
|
|
05/06/2008 05:38:43 AM · #21 |
I honestly don't know how to use av or tv... or p. I have tried but couldn't get good results. I use manual not because my egos pride, but also to learn. Most cases because I am familiar with environment and its settings, I dial them without even thinking too much and get good results. Although everyone looks for a perfect setting, i don't think there is such thing. I don't think auto anything would make everyone happy all the way. I mean maybe makes some happy, but not me.
Don't you like to feel to have total control of your shots? and when you get a good exposure, don't you feel better yourself? I do.
I salute those people years years ago looking through a whole and taking great pictures that lasted for many years after they died. with no mechanical or electronical help.
Photography is an art, don't let machine take over your creativity :P
FP
Message edited by author 2008-05-06 05:40:58. |
|
|
|
05/06/2008 06:27:09 AM · #22 |
Originally posted by sir_bazz:
Do you mean the Canon has a joystick poking out of the back of the camera ? I think all current DSLR's come with a 4 way joypad so I'm wondering what your referring to here. It sounds like something that could stab you in the face during framing. :shrugs:
bazz. |
It's more of a button than a stick, but the 40D doesnt have the 4 button joypad.
|
|
|
|
05/06/2008 07:05:58 AM · #23 |
Originally posted by Delta_6:
It's more of a button than a stick, but the 40D doesnt have the 4 button joypad. |
Thanks....I looked it up and see what you mean now.
Looks good.
bazz. |
|
|
|
05/06/2008 07:25:12 AM · #24 |
Pretty much exclusively I use Manual mode. I don't see the advantage in letting the camera do my shutter speed for me if I have the aperture set and there is no difficulty or hindrance in 'spinning' the dials/thumb wheels while composing if I feel the need. The controls are right there under my fingertips and for a lot of the things I try and shoot for my own pleasure (like the beavers in the pond out back) conditions change quite rapidly as they move around the pond from dark water surface to light water surface.
Perhaps if my shooting desires change Av mode would be advantageous. But in the last three years haven't found the need for it. |
|
|
|
05/06/2008 07:51:27 AM · #25 |
I use to not use it at all but once you understand how much light you have or need you will use manual much more. I don't think I use anything else anymore. Only other setting I use is the sports mode when shooting on an extreamly bight sunny day.
|
|
Home -
Challenges -
Community -
League -
Photos -
Cameras -
Lenses -
Learn -
Help -
Terms of Use -
Privacy -
Top ^
DPChallenge, and website content and design, Copyright © 2001-2025 Challenging Technologies, LLC.
All digital photo copyrights belong to the photographers and may not be used without permission.
Current Server Time: 08/23/2025 07:31:24 PM EDT.
