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04/21/2008 02:51:54 PM · #1 |
OK, so I was was soooooo excited about my current entry to one of the basic challenges, but here's my question. I didn't copy the original RAW file, I just opened it, did some general Raw adjustments, opened it up and adjusted the curves just slightly. Then I saved as usual for DPC and as usual it asked me if I wanted to save changes on .NEF and I click no. Am I OK to enter?... or did I need to save copy. Since I have never placed high enough to have to hand in original, I'm still not sure.
ETA... also, exclusive open challenge means you can't enter both, right?
Message edited by author 2008-04-21 14:53:04. |
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04/21/2008 02:54:35 PM · #2 |
Originally posted by cynthiann:
Since I have never placed high enough to have to hand in original, I'm still not sure. |
Same here.
This time, I copied images from the CF card to my hard drive. Edited the Copy. Once I was happy with my finished JPG, I took a fresh "Copy" of the original straight off my CF card, without opening it or anything. |
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04/21/2008 02:56:30 PM · #3 |
Originally posted by cynthiann:
ETA... also, exclusive open challenge means you can't enter both, right? |
That's right.
You need to find and save the RAW file directly as it comes from your camera/card if you have to submit for validation. You should be doing this anyway ... you do not need to save the intermediate file where you do the editing, though I always do; you just need the original and your entry.
If you copied the RAW file to your hard drive and did not save any changes it should still be OK.
Message edited by author 2008-04-21 14:57:36. |
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04/21/2008 03:04:29 PM · #4 |
Originally posted by GeneralE:
Originally posted by cynthiann:
ETA... also, exclusive open challenge means you can't enter both, right? |
That's right.
You need to find and save the RAW file directly as it comes from your camera/card if you have to submit for validation. You should be doing this anyway ... you do not need to save the intermediate file where you do the editing, though I always do; you just need the original and your entry.
If you copied the RAW file to your hard drive and did not save any changes it should still be OK. |
The RAW file is still on my card, but I didn't save any changes. I can copy it to my hard drive now. It's still the original, right? Only reason I am doubting is because when I open the original, the few RAW settings I made (WB and exposure) are still as I set them. One click on default, that would be back to original, but technically... I'm not sure if that's exceptable in the rules. |
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04/21/2008 03:07:08 PM · #5 |
| Don't "open" it -- just copy it to your hard drive. The best method is to use a card reader to mount the card like a drive, and just drag to to the backup folder on your hard drive. If you don't have a card reader, you can usually mount the camera as a drive (with the card in it!), but you still want to drag-and-drop the file rather than using any kind of transfer software. |
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04/21/2008 03:10:16 PM · #6 |
Originally posted by GeneralE:
Don't "open" it -- just copy it to your hard drive. The best method is to use a card reader to mount the card like a drive, and just drag to to the backup folder on your hard drive. If you don't have a card reader, you can usually mount the camera as a drive (with the card in it!), but you still want to drag-and-drop the file rather than using any kind of transfer software. |
OK, so if I opened it I'm doomed. No big deal really... just a good lesson learned. At least now I can post them and brag on them and go out and find something else for the challenge. |
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04/21/2008 03:10:46 PM · #7 |
Originally posted by cynthiann:
It's still the original, right? Only reason I am doubting is because when I open the original, the few RAW settings I made (WB and exposure) are still as I set them. One click on default, that would be back to original, but technically... I'm not sure if that's exceptable in the rules. |
The changes you made (WB, exposure) are saved into an external file - usually .xmp and invisible in most applications. The original RAW file is untouched.
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04/21/2008 03:11:02 PM · #8 |
I just copy my Original Raw file to my external HD. I open it up, process, and when finished I choose "save as" to save my edited file. Then I resize and save for web. Then when I close CS3 it ask me do I want to save the changes and I click "NO" and it preserves the Original file.
I copy file by using my documents and copying to new location. I do this to preserve HD space.
I hope that's ok! I have done this since using CS,CS2, and now CS3. I have a couple of validation request and everything was fine.
Message edited by author 2008-04-21 15:11:58. |
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04/21/2008 03:11:46 PM · #9 |
| Here's a question along the same lines. When I import from my card, I use Lightroom. And I have the option set to "Convert Raw file to DNG and import". Is the dng File still considered an "Original"? |
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04/21/2008 03:12:31 PM · #10 |
Originally posted by Tirasco:
Here's a question along the same lines. When I import from my card, I use Lightroom. And I have the option set to "Convert Raw file to DNG and import". Is the dng File still considered an "Original"? |
No.
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04/21/2008 04:14:51 PM · #11 |
Originally posted by eyewave:
Originally posted by Tirasco:
Here's a question along the same lines. When I import from my card, I use Lightroom. And I have the option set to "Convert Raw file to DNG and import". Is the dng File still considered an "Original"? |
No. |
Really? I would think that would count as an original since no adjustments have been done to it. It's basically the same as a RAW file just a different format.
I only save files as DNG files. So I need to change my workflow? |
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04/21/2008 04:50:44 PM · #12 |
Originally posted by eyewave:
The changes you made (WB, exposure) are saved into an external file - usually .xmp and invisible in most applications. The original RAW file is untouched. |
Not necessarily - I was working in ACR, and was tweaking exposure and WB and clicked "Open JPEG" to open the JPEG version of what I was doing. I didn't realise till just afterwards it had modified my original RAW. |
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04/21/2008 05:13:29 PM · #13 |
We have not, to date, found a RAW file that can be invalidated by opening it, nor have we found software that invalidates a RAW original by saving back to it. That is *not* to say that data can't be saved back to a RAW file; it can. The image data is not changed, however, only the metadata... that is, the instructions for interpretation of the image data.
So, the conclusion, for today, is that a RAW file is a valid original, regardless of whether it has been opened.
We cannot, unfortunately, say the same thing at this point about DNG files, so if your workflow involves converting your RAW files to DNG, you'll still need the RAW file as your original. If your camera shoots DNG natively, your DNG is a valid original, but you should treat your DNGs as if they were JPEGs, and be very careful about what software touches them, ideally transferring them only with the operating system by "drag & drop." |
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04/21/2008 05:48:01 PM · #14 |
Originally posted by cynthiann:
Originally posted by GeneralE:
Don't "open" it -- just copy it to your hard drive. The best method is to use a card reader to mount the card like a drive, and just drag to to the backup folder on your hard drive. If you don't have a card reader, you can usually mount the camera as a drive (with the card in it!), but you still want to drag-and-drop the file rather than using any kind of transfer software. |
OK, so if I opened it I'm doomed. No big deal really... just a good lesson learned. At least now I can post them and brag on them and go out and find something else for the challenge. |
You're not doomed but, since some applications make changes and some don't, the only SURE way to safely transfer is the General's. You're probably fine, but why take the chance? :) |
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04/21/2008 05:54:44 PM · #15 |
Read and heed what Eyewave and Kirbic say. They are both right.
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04/21/2008 08:40:11 PM · #16 |
The name given by the camera to a sequence of files can be identical from batch to batch (depending on camera and settings). After I transfer my RAW files to my hard drive, I use a batch rename utility to give each image a unique name (currently YYYMMDDD_###.NEF which is the date followed by the original camera image number). As long as the numbering doesn't start over within a single day, every file has a different name. When I make changes, I save the next versions as YYYMMDD_###_VVVV where VVVV is something like "Master" or "V002" or "Web01" to keep track of which version is which.
Had one of my originals validated despite changing the name of the RAW file. That confirms that changing the name of the file is allowed, at least if done carefully. Makes sense, since that happens without ever opening the file and without making any changes to the pixels or the camera-related EXIF information. Good thing too, since it also makes it easier to find the original, if necessary. |
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