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03/05/2004 08:17:16 PM · #1 |
Having browsed through the challenge entries in order as ranked, I am sobered by what seems to be an extraordinary lack of careful, consistent voting.
The most telling comment to come from my participation in the recent "Conflict" Challenge, was that my border wasn't up to par. Suprisingly almost 70% of the comments dealt directly and soley with my border!
Rather than begin a new thread to reflect on similar themes regarding this challenge already being discussed, I would like comments and feedback on the border as an element in a challenge submission. How heavily does it weigh in your critique, how significantly should it swing the ranking of an entry and with what imaging/framing theories do you prepare your borders when submitting an entry.
Thanks!
Jarra. |
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03/05/2004 08:21:07 PM · #2 |
Borders pull the eye outward instead of inward toward your image area. This photo has a lot of action in it already and the border only causes the eye to be confused on what the focus is.
Would you be willing to post this same photo w/o the border to let us see the difference?
Message edited by author 2004-03-05 20:21:57. |
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03/05/2004 08:22:54 PM · #3 |
I've gotten some comments too, about having a bad border, but I really don't think borders to anything to photographs.
But I have to say in your photo, it's terribly distracting. It's just so big, and bold. |
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03/05/2004 08:31:55 PM · #4 |
Originally posted by shoebox:
Suprisingly almost 70% of the comments dealt directly and soley with my border! |
I've just read the comments and none deal solely with the border. All of the border mentions also comment on some other aspect of the shot - the colours, the intended meaning, the dropped object, or personal taste.
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03/05/2004 08:35:22 PM · #5 |
For what its worth....
Your border is a bit heavy for your image. Your border also creates a lot of unnecessary contrast that could be considered distracting to the viewer.
For online display of photographs, I think the borders need to be simple. Your purpose should be simply to separate your image from the background.
Framing a photo to hang on a wall is a bit different.
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03/05/2004 08:44:46 PM · #6 |
I agree with the comments about the border...it's a bit much. Borders enhance the photo when used moderately imo and I usually don't take points away because the border distracted from the photo.
My very first entry suffered heavily because of the border (among other things).
My current entry has a simple border but one voter commented about it anyway, but I think for the most part, a simpler/smaller border is acceptable.
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03/05/2004 08:45:37 PM · #7 |
| Borders. Yes, I tend to work around them. When they really interfer with my ability to see the photograph I'm likely to comment on them. I try mightily to ignore them when voting on the image. |
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03/05/2004 09:06:46 PM · #8 |
I don't try to ignore borders or titles. They are part of the overall presentation. I think it's important to understand how to do both effectively. When you put on a border and give a title, imagine that this is the way it would be displayed in a gallery. Some of the titles that show up on photos around here would get laughed at (not that they don't get laughed at here) ;)
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03/05/2004 09:16:59 PM · #9 |
Let's work a little math. Your image is 575x450 pixels. Your black and white borders equal 35 pixels on a side. This leaves an image that is 505x380 or only 74.1 percent of the total image real estate. More than one quarter of your image is border. IMHO this is a bit excessive and I for one would rather see the image that much bigger...
Also, you recieved 5 comments that mention borders out of a total of 18 comments. That doesn't equal 70%...
Edited to add: I don't remember commenting on your shot and looking back at my comment, it appears to be a tad harsh and for that I appologize, but that is one big border...
Message edited by author 2004-03-05 21:21:49. |
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03/05/2004 10:18:24 PM · #10 |
Originally posted by movieman:
I've gotten some comments too, about having a bad border, but I really don't think borders to anything to photographs.
But I have to say in your photo, it's terribly distracting. It's just so big, and bold. |
I am already confused about borders and tend not to add them to my images (yet). movieman, your comment makes me even more confused  |
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03/06/2004 12:01:50 AM · #11 |
Oops! Sorry my maths was a 'little' aggressive! :O
Here is a version with a smaller border. It was the second choice on the submission eve. Oops again!
Thanks for your comments all! John I appreciate your comments re Online vs Physically Framed images. Ironically I put a great deal of thought and experimentation into the framing of this photo after reading up on a framing theories. An even bigger Oops! Oh well, a great learning experience!
Message edited by author 2004-03-06 00:07:33. |
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03/06/2004 12:02:48 AM · #12 |
Generally when I vote, I tend not to take away points for a bad border unless it's just really terrible. On the other hand, I have seen some artistic borders which help the display of the photo and add to the overall "feel" desired. In those cases, they help raise the score just a bit.
For your photo, I didn't think the border helped your photo at all, but it wasn't so bad that it would affect my scoring of the shot.
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03/06/2004 12:21:56 AM · #13 |
Even with the smaller border I don't like it. Maybe if it were only black, or only white, but I don't think that white has any place in the border of this photo. With the theme of the photo, having white (purity) in the border contradicts with the rest of it (Black-death, Red-anger, death). Then again, perhaps I'm going a little overboard here. ^^;;
But, anyway, even just from a eye-pleasing standpoint, borders are used to exentuate what is already in the photo. I use either a white or black as the main color and then if I want to add a lesser color, I pull out one of the dominant or most eye-attracting. That way it draws the eye to the other elements with that color. The problem with yours is that yes, the black is a good choice for such a dark photo, but there is not one speck of pure white anywhere in it, therefore it only serves as a distraction.
Personally I would have prefered either no border and a larger photo, or just a solid black one (at about the width it is now) and still a larger photo. Use the 640 max to your advantage. ^_^
Message edited by author 2004-03-06 00:22:48.
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03/06/2004 12:53:59 AM · #14 |
Jarra -
Both borders really take your eye away from the photo. I hope you don't mind, but I used a different technique for a border on your image. I think something like this will give you your border, but won't detract from your image.
I'll remove this in a couple days, unless you contact me and want me to remove it sooner.
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03/06/2004 02:03:55 AM · #15 |
But then you see, a border which is simply a line drawn within the frame of the photograph would incline me to lower my vote ... it smacks a little of greetings-card-ism for me.
'Presentation' is a tricky part of entering competitions of any kind: all you can do is mess things up for yourself - no one's going to raise your score for the quality of your border, are they?
E
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03/06/2004 02:09:34 AM · #16 |
Originally posted by sfalice:
Borders. Yes, I tend to work around them. When they really interfer with my ability to see the photograph I'm likely to comment on them. I try mightily to ignore them when voting on the image. |
I agree. I usually don't give a lower score for titles or frames.
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03/06/2004 02:30:34 AM · #17 |
The very sharp outlines of your original border contrast heavily with the motion blur of your picture. Seeing it will give the impression that the picture is out of focus and mistaken. cbeller's border bring out the proper motif of the picture.
Message edited by author 2004-03-06 02:31:11. |
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03/06/2004 11:29:54 AM · #18 |
I thought your border was too large, but I would not go as far as to say that large borders do not work. I think it depends on the picture.
In John Setzler's good-bye to DPC challenges he used a large border that worked very well.
//www.dpchallenge.com/image.php?IMAGE_ID=24661
I'm sure there are many more examples out there. |
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03/06/2004 12:38:05 PM · #19 |
I just don't use borders for my photos, gets rid of the problem of it being too distractive.
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03/06/2004 01:14:20 PM · #20 |
I try to look just at the photo but sometimes borders can take away from the photo - I learned that with this
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03/06/2004 01:25:48 PM · #21 |
Originally posted by cbeller:
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Sorry Chris, but I'm really not keen on this type of border. I think a border should 'hold in' and support the picture.. Adding a thin border within the picture really doesn't sit well with me. |
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03/06/2004 04:18:18 PM · #22 |
Originally posted by cbeller:
Jarra -
Both borders really take your eye away from the photo. I hope you don't mind, but I used a different technique for a border on your image. I think something like this will give you your border, but won't detract from your image.
I'll remove this in a couple days, unless you contact me and want me to remove it sooner. |
i like where you are going with this but the white thin border is still a little distracting and adds a softness to the image, which seems to contradict the blood and anger. |
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