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02/26/2004 09:15:17 PM · #26 |
Other Talk about Conflict PHOTOS
Click there and see other thoughts on this exact issue...The conflict topic is a hard one to shoot but to submit a photo just for the sake of submitting is kind of bad decision...take a gander at the other talk on tihs issue...
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02/26/2004 09:25:55 PM · #27 |
Originally posted by Paclo:
Hence there are number of common devices that I generally give low scores, such as: pictures of sculpture (someone else's idea), pets, propaganda, obviously staged shots and shots set up with games, toys and stuffed animals. Harsh? |
Yes.
Unless you make your criteria more stringent, you'll be voting lowly on great shots which do include those elements. It is indeed possible to shoot a great shot using someone else's sculpture. Just check out the Monuments challenge and others. |
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02/26/2004 09:38:01 PM · #28 |
Originally posted by moodville:
Under my preferences, which is found under my home there is an open on the right hand side to hide signatures. I believe it is defaulted off so you'll have to tick the box and it will stop you from seeing all signature of all people in the forums. |
Perfect! thnx ...worked, like a charm. Now I don't have to see Karmat's or Jacko's.
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02/26/2004 09:52:04 PM · #29 |
Originally posted by Russell2566:
or crying like girls |
Hey! I resemble that! ;)
Originally posted by KentuckyGal:
I like this sight because of the honest criticism |
The critisism that started this thread was honest, just put out globally... Agreed.
I haven't had a chance to look at this challenge yet, but I have to say there is a trend in some challenges to go on a "treasure hunt" rather than take the best shot possible.
<begin disclaimer> This is a general statement, please don't try to break it down and make it look like I am pointing fingers. <end disclaimer> |
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02/26/2004 10:10:30 PM · #30 |
I just finished voting through 100%.
Wow..that was bad. I'll chalk it up to the Challenge.
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02/26/2004 10:22:52 PM · #31 |
| What is bad is when everyone is sitting in here ranting and leaving comments on prints in the contest that go directly against what they are talking about in this forum. They say they want people to see the art merit and do not look deeper. Also, this last open challenge was awful. But instead of having a normal curve on my voting scale it was bottom loaded with 1-3's. So keep voting and give everyone what they deserve. |
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02/26/2004 10:34:20 PM · #32 |
Nothing against you, but a lot of the images I'm talking about are not 'artistic', they look like someone just took a point and shoot camera, aimed it randomly and uploaded. There is something to be said about learning proper exsposure and composition. These aren't hardfast rules, but using some of the rules now and then will help make the voting process more enjoyable again. Until now, I've voted on every image for every challenge since joining. I have a lot to learn myself, so I still enter so that I can challenge myself and improve my skills. That's what I'm hoping others are doing when they enter the challenges too.
-danny
Originally posted by thumper:
What is bad is when everyone is sitting in here ranting and leaving comments on prints in the contest that go directly against what they are talking about in this forum. They say they want people to see the art merit and do not look deeper. Also, this last open challenge was awful. But instead of having a normal curve on my voting scale it was bottom loaded with 1-3's. So keep voting and give everyone what they deserve. |
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02/26/2004 10:42:19 PM · #33 |
I agree that if you want to enter then spend the time to enter quality. It is not fun judging photos that dont fit the catagory but it dosent take much time to hit the old famous 1 button on them and go to the next photo. I have judged high school photo contest and it can be worse than here. Not trying to ruffle to many feathers just stating a fact. Originally posted by crabappl3:
Nothing against you, but a lot of the images I'm talking about are not 'artistic', they look like someone just took a point and shoot camera, aimed it randomly and uploaded. There is something to be said about learning proper exsposure and composition. These aren't hardfast rules, but using some of the rules now and then will help make the voting process more enjoyable again. Until now, I've voted on every image for every challenge since joining. I have a lot to learn myself, so I still enter so that I can challenge myself and improve my skills. That's what I'm hoping others are doing when they enter the challenges too.
-danny
Originally posted by thumper:
What is bad is when everyone is sitting in here ranting and leaving comments on prints in the contest that go directly against what they are talking about in this forum. They say they want people to see the art merit and do not look deeper. Also, this last open challenge was awful. But instead of having a normal curve on my voting scale it was bottom loaded with 1-3's. So keep voting and give everyone what they deserve. |
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02/26/2004 10:49:19 PM · #34 |
Yes that is true about spending time on the picture you enter. My first one Was done in a hurry because I just found this site. I spent alot more time on the next photo and wished that everyone would vote for all pictures. It is interesting to watch every hour and see what your rating is doing. It is hard to view 175 bad photos out of 200 and still want to be fair and judge on a fairly even basis. That is what I was trying to say.
The more you work the BETTER the reward!!!!!!!!!! |
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02/26/2004 10:53:26 PM · #35 |
Originally posted by sweet_devil:
I agree that if you want to enter then spend the time to enter quality. It is not fun judging photos that dont fit the catagory but it dosent take much time to hit the old famous 1 button on them and go to the next photo. |
Please do remember that quality can be in the eye of the beholder. I was going to go for the paid membership this payday, but this thread has me reconsidering. My purpose for entering the challenges is to improve my skill level and to discuss photography with others who enjoy it. If my quality isn't up to someone else's standards then please educate me on what to do differently instead of just complaining about the photo.
If an elite site is what this is suppose to be, then perhaps a portfolio review should be required before entering any challenges.
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02/26/2004 10:57:18 PM · #36 |
I don't concider myself an elite, and I will gladly share my opinion on your photo's if you'd like. Send me a private message and I'll be glad to critique what you have.
-danny
Originally posted by jpochard:
Originally posted by sweet_devil:
I agree that if you want to enter then spend the time to enter quality. It is not fun judging photos that dont fit the catagory but it dosent take much time to hit the old famous 1 button on them and go to the next photo. |
Please do remember that quality can be in the eye of the beholder. I was going to go for the paid membership this payday, but this thread has me reconsidering. My purpose for entering the challenges is to improve my skill level and to discuss photography with others who enjoy it. If my quality isn't up to someone else's standards then please educate me on what to do differently instead of just complaining about the photo.
If an elite site is what this is suppose to be, then perhaps a portfolio review should be required before entering any challenges. |
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02/26/2004 11:25:19 PM · #37 |
| Wow, this whole thread has me feeling really self-conscious about my submission. I'm just getting into the swing of shooting for the challenges. I think my photograph was on topic, but I had a hard time capturing what I was looking for, and given that we only have a limited amount of time and I have limited experience, I did the best that I could. I think everyone should remember, especially in open challenges, that not everyone who enters is a professional. :) |
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02/26/2004 11:32:14 PM · #38 |
Good points. Sometimes I forget some of the 'snapshots' I entered over a 100 entries ago. To be fair, I shall continue with my voting and keep the mindset that everyone is at different levels and that perhaps what they've entered is their current level. Sorry to have caused such a stink!
-danny
Originally posted by kellian:
Wow, this whole thread has me feeling really self-conscious about my submission. I'm just getting into the swing of shooting for the challenges. I think my photograph was on topic, but I had a hard time capturing what I was looking for, and given that we only have a limited amount of time and I have limited experience, I did the best that I could. I think everyone should remember, especially in open challenges, that not everyone who enters is a professional. :) |
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02/26/2004 11:40:18 PM · #39 |
Originally posted by crabappl3:
I have just stopped voting on the Conflict challenge. I don't think I can continue. There are just so many images that in my opinion don't meet the challenge or are just bad examples of photography skill. For some reason it seems to me the the open challenges have become nothing more then Photosig or the likes where people upload any and everything that they may have captured. A shoehorn here and there is one thing, but submitting some of these shots that don't even come close to being 'conflict' and are poorly exposed images is just a waste. Where did the desire to submit good photographs go? |
i couldn't agree more. I've been on dpchallenge.com for a few weeks now and am hesitant to join some challenges, simply because my shots aren't good enough or not on topic. I think that people need more self-criticism in choosing what shots they will use and if they should even use one. |
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02/26/2004 11:45:14 PM · #40 |
stopped before 20% so I won't be counted. Incredible how sad the view made me. :(
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02/27/2004 01:54:00 AM · #41 |
| I have yet to see a comment from anyone here on my conflict picture. Mine seems to be doing well at a 5.6 average and 16 great comments. Actually I am waiting for a comment from crabappl3, rooster, and jpochard since I find your comments honest and helpful. I will let you know when you have commented on my photo, if you wish. |
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02/27/2004 05:43:01 AM · #42 |
Originally posted by kellian:
I think everyone should remember, especially in open challenges, that not everyone who enters is a professional. :) |
But should not all photos be judged on the same criteria? At least as far as each individual voter is concerned?
I used to try to make allowances for percieved ability/equipment when I voted, but actually this a more elitist approach than any - ther have been some truly abysmal shots taken with the 300D, amongst other cameras.
If we're generally here to learn, then we are presumably to learn to take 'better' photographs. We learn that from the work and comments of the 'better' photographers - which must mean that we think there are photographers here who are 'better' than us. Is this not what 'elitism' is - the situation where some are considered 'better' than others? Is this not a good thing? I would be pretty certain that every photographer on this site, without exception, believes at least one other regular participant to be a 'better' photographer than themselves.
If I vote a touch higher on a shot I percieve to be not so good, out of some kind of pity, am I not patronising you?
To judge all shots by the very highest standards in my estimation, is the greatest compliment I can pay to all photographers here; to start making allowances, is to accept the mediocre.
The variety of different 'ideals' that we all bring to the challenges, as participants and voters, is what makes the ribbons, personal best scores, worth something in tersm of achievement.
E
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02/27/2004 06:24:21 AM · #43 |
Ed. I don't think that person was asking for a better score because they are a beginner. I think they were saying that THIS thread, where everyone is complaining how their eyes are offended by having to look at such lowly entries is the problem. Of coarse that person has a right to not read the thread, but then, that would be encouraging them to not fully participate in the site and might limit the amount they will learn.
I know you are a fair and resonable person. This is not a personal attack. |
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02/27/2004 08:17:30 AM · #44 |
[quote=crabappl3] Good points. Sometimes I forget some of the 'snapshots' I entered over a 100 entries ago. To be fair, I shall continue with my voting and keep the mindset that everyone is at different levels and that perhaps what they've entered is their current level. Sorry to have caused such a stink!
Danny,
Thank you for reconsidering. I consider you a professional artist of great skill and I know if you comment on my photo I will learn more. Since entering these challenges I have definately improved (based on scores) I do tend to go up and down but overall there is improvement. Sometimes when Ilearn a new thing everything I read goes way over my head until someone points out the problem I am having. I can begin to comprehend with just a bit of guidance. I agree with you that many of the shots did not have real conflict in them and that meeting the challenge is important. I too am considering joining when my skill level improves just a bit more where I won't be embarrassed entering photos in the members challenge. |
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02/27/2004 09:47:44 AM · #45 |
I am really, really new to this site. I have extremely limited equipment and software, but I try to make the best of what I have. I know my camera shoots less than 1MP, so my pictures just simply aren't going to be the high quality pictures. That's ok...it's what I have to work with. I am more interested in learning how to use what I have to the best of the equipment's ability. I don't have the funds to get a better camera or software, and I don't anticipate having funds any time in the foreseeable future. Now, having said that, I don't expect my photos to be graded on any different level than those with the top-notch equipment and software; I just have to know that there are some things I can't change, and pay attention to the things I CAN do something about, like composition and the ability to capture the topic. I'm not here for the competition - I'm here to learn, and a low score without a comment is pretty useless to me, as well as a higher score that doesn't tell me what I did that was good.
If it offends some of you that a person with such low technology and skills would even try to compete, perhaps the challenges should be even further separated by equipment. Or perhaps move your photos and voting to the members-only challenge. I would suspect those who would pay to join might also have better equipment and skills. Then you might not have to deal with "riff-raff" like me.
And...finally...call me crazy. This is the first challenge I have really taken the time to vote on. And ya know my biggest criteria? Did I like the picture...was it aesthetically pleasing and did it match with the topic. There were some technically wonderful (at least to me) pictures that I flat out did not like, and I scored them as such and explained that in the comments. Some photos that were not as technically sound but closer to the topic and had some good features in my eyes got better marks...and I commented to the photographer on what it was I liked. Hearing what is done right is just as important as hearing what could be improved (at least for me).
~ Mern |
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02/27/2004 10:21:49 AM · #46 |
I started on DPC about 4 days after I purchased my first digital camera. I shot a landscape shot within the city limits and there was a telephone pole, a building, and some cars in the shot. To be honest I didnt even notice them as it's something I saw all the time. My score wasnt too bad, but the comments made me aware of the background stuff and now I make a point of reviewing the background on images before I take a shot and certainly before I upload it to a challenge. On another entry I had a tilted horizon - it was actually a perspective thing and so I didnt think about it. Again, I received a lot of comments about my tilted horizon and now I make a point of making sure my horizons are straight.
My point is that you have to do something wrong in order to be told it is wrong so you can correct it in future photographs. I would like to think that my previous 52 challenges have helped me look for some of the more obvious flaws in pictures and helped me be able to set up a scene in my mind before I imprint it in the camera. There are people who are still at the first challenge stage of their photographic journey and I feel it is important to point out those things that some of us 'older' members take for granted. That said, if you make a comment correcting a basic correction to someone who isnt 'new' they sure can take it negatively :(
I also think challenges that are difficult to convey exactly what the challenge details call for are the ones most people feel frustated with. If the challenge was something like 'yellow' then even bad shots would not appear so 'bad' as long as there were yellow in the shot.
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02/27/2004 10:42:55 AM · #47 |
There are a lot of good points being raised in this thread and one of the most interesting to me is the reluctance of some people to become members as they seem to think they are joining an elite group.
Yes, there are a lot of very good photographers amongst the members..but equally, there are many excellent photographers amongst the Registered users.I decided to apply for membership purely because this meant more challenges, which in turn gave me more opportunity to improve.I hadn`t been involved with any sort of photographic club or internet site before coming into contact with DPC.
My prowess in the art of post processing is basic, at best, and I have no inclination to learn any more than I already know on that score.
Prior to joining in November, I rarely used a camera to take anything other than family snapshots.I feel I have learned a lot in a short space of time and if this site has done anything..it has made me think more about the basics..such as composition.
I have absolutely no studio equipment..in fact in one of my earlier submissions for the "On the edge" challenge..I had my wife holding a pencil torch in the direction of the subject (bunch of roses)in a pitch dark kitchen.The kids thought I was beginning to lose it (maybe they`re right) :)
I guess the point I`m trying to make is that far from being reluctant to join...it should be a priority..if you are serious about improving your work. Don`t worry about being out of your depth...it`s no different from being a registered user in that respect, it just gives more opportunities for improvement.
Gordon
Message edited by author 2004-02-27 10:47:13. |
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02/27/2004 10:52:22 AM · #48 |
In my opinion, the overall standard in challenges on this site has increased over time, with the increased number of participants.
If you look back over some of the earlier challenges, some images that figured highly would not do so well today.
I've been a registered user here since before the membership started, the main reason I have not subscribed being that I normally don't have the time to shoot for multiple challenges in a week.
I'm sure that at some point I will become a full member, but I don't consider my talent (or lack of) as a photographer to be an issue in that.
Some people will put in a sub-par image, just to be involved in the week's events. This has always been the case, as long as I can remember here.
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02/27/2004 11:55:14 AM · #49 |
To judge all shots by the very highest standards in my estimation, is the greatest compliment I can pay to all photographers here; to start making allowances, is to accept the mediocre.
Amen
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02/27/2004 12:00:41 PM · #50 |
Originally posted by geewhy:
There are a lot of good points being raised in this thread and one of the most interesting to me is the reluctance of some people to become members as they seem to think they are joining an elite group....
Gordon |
Gordon,
I did not consider members elite vs. non-members. I was reconsidering (only very briefly, of course :) ), joining because this forum thread started to sound a bit harsh regarding entering a photo that even the photographer may think is not the best - member or not. Perhaps it's because I know there's something missing from the photo that I enter to gain feedback. Yes, by all means view each photo with the same standard and vote that way. To actually discourage entering a photo because it doesn't live up to "our" standards, is I think a bit harsh and subjective.
I'm not even against critical comments on the challenges...I started a critical thread myself for the Textures challenge. And I do agree that the "Conflict" challenge is pretty weak compared to others I've seen. But I learn from the weak photos as well....what NOT to do.
Anyway, I'm joining next week (when the boss shows me the money) so yer stuck with me!
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