DPL Week 1 - DPChallenge Forums

05/14/2007 03:41:57 PM · #76

So in theory that would make us #5....but isn't this completely backwards? Why would the Top 24 stay within the top 24 in terms of competition partners? How does that achieve healthy competition and or promote equal weighting within the teams? Why would the 5th highest rated team play with the #1? Theoretically, wouldn't the #5 play in the #4's division and the #8 would play in #1's Division? That is the way it usually works....

Canon 12x IS USM (S3 IS built-in Lens) -- 36-432mm (35mm EQ)

05/14/2007 03:46:00 PM · #77

I think you are thinking of single-elimination tournament play. This is a round-robin schedule, so you will play each of the teams in your Division.

The top Division in each conference has teams of approximately equal capability. In the playoffs, the division winners play each other -- if the play holds to the averages, that would be the top four teams.

levyj413

Apple iPhone 15 Pro Max

Tamron SP AF 17-50mm f/2.8 Di II LD Aspherical (IF) for Nikon

05/14/2007 03:47:59 PM · #78

Originally posted by Melethia:

Originally posted by Cutter:
But if I am understanding right, it will be either Se7endipity or Ribbon Hogs to come out of Division A Northern Conference. And that seems kinda stupid.

Not that you're worried (nor are the Ribbon Hogs, I'm sure) but there ARE four other teams in your division..... :-)

Shh! Deb, don't let on. Then when we accidentally spank one of 'em in a head-to-head match, they're not gonna know what hit 'em.

05/14/2007 03:49:22 PM · #79

Yeah I am with you general, but the breakdown would still be 1-8, 2-7, 3-6, 4-5. Because how does it reward Ribbon Hogs to have the 5th best team in their own division. They should have 8th best in their division. You see?

Canon EF 17-40mm f/4.0L USM

05/14/2007 03:51:56 PM · #80

Originally posted by levyj413:

Originally posted by Melethia:

Originally posted by Cutter:
But if I am understanding right, it will be either Se7endipity or Ribbon Hogs to come out of Division A Northern Conference. And that seems kinda stupid.

Not that you're worried (nor are the Ribbon Hogs, I'm sure) but there ARE four other teams in your division..... :-)

Shh! Deb, don't let on. Then when we accidentally spank one of 'em in a head-to-head match, they're not gonna know what hit 'em.

haha. I swear I am not discounting you nor anyone else. At all! Since this is the "Beta" edition of DPL, I am just trying to help and think out loud to have this thing make the most sense. No you may destroy us one week...but now that you warned us...

Elvis_L

Canon EOS-5D Mark II

05/14/2007 03:51:58 PM · #81

Originally posted by Cutter:

yes in theroy but i don't think many teams would even try if they thought they were gonna lose every week.

Canon EF 17-40mm f/4.0L USM

05/14/2007 03:55:19 PM · #82

Originally posted by Elvis_L:

Originally posted by Cutter:
Yeah I am with you general, but the breakdown would still be 1-8, 2-7, 3-6, 4-5. Because how does it reward Ribbon Hogs to have the 5th best team in their own division. They should have 8th best in their division. You see?

yes in theroy but i don't think many teams would even try if they thought they were gonna lose every week.

Yeah but let's say #8 upset #1 that one week. The rest of the division would be quite weak and then as long as they took care of business would have a cakewalk. So I don't think teams would approach it that way.

Elvis_L

Canon EOS-5D Mark II

05/14/2007 04:07:13 PM · #83

Originally posted by Cutter:

Originally posted by Elvis_L:

Originally posted by Cutter:
Yeah I am with you general, but the breakdown would still be 1-8, 2-7, 3-6, 4-5. Because how does it reward Ribbon Hogs to have the 5th best team in their own division. They should have 8th best in their division. You see?

yes in theroy but i don't think many teams would even try if they thought they were gonna lose every week.

Yeah but let's say #8 upset #1 that one week. The rest of the division would be quite weak and then as long as they took care of business would have a cakewalk. So I don't think teams would approach it that way.

with a 72 team league the difference between 5 and 8 is very little so you are really asking that the top play the bottom. i don.t honestly see the numbr 72 team ever winning against the nuber one team.

Canon 12x IS USM (S3 IS built-in Lens) -- 36-432mm (35mm EQ)

05/14/2007 04:08:21 PM · #84

The four Divisions were designed to be approximately equal, and since (I'm pretty sure) the team averages were actually very close, somewhat random. I suppose instead of lining up all the teams and "counting off by fours" we could have gone with some other scheme, but it really shouldn't make that much difference.

With a 5-game season, the better team should end up with the most wins and highest scores. And if a normally lower-scoring team pulls an upset and wins the division? That, as they say, is why they play the game ... : )

Canon 12x IS USM (S3 IS built-in Lens) -- 36-432mm (35mm EQ)

05/14/2007 04:12:02 PM · #85

Originally posted by Elvis_L:

i don.t honestly see the numbr 72 team ever winning against the nuber one team.

I believe the current plan is to have the playoffs occur only within Divisions -- that there will be separate championships for Division A, B, C. I could be mistaken about that, but in that case 1 never faces 72 ...

Canon EF-S 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6

05/14/2007 04:14:12 PM · #86

It's obviously too late for this season, but going forward it sure seems to me it should mathematically align with logic. Hopefully, the organizers will hear my point for the next go-round. And I am sure the difficulty of arranging the teams properly can't be too great, otherwise if it was I would agree for the most part. But with the prowess and advanced expertise of this site, I am sure it is not too much to request next time.

KaDi

Canon EOS-300D Rebel

05/14/2007 04:16:25 PM · #87

Originally posted by GeneralE:

...And if a normally lower-scoring team pulls an upset and wins the division? That, as they say, is why they play the game ... : )

I'm in it purely for the educational value. ;-P
(...and of course there's nothing very educational about a little league getting whooped by the varsity team...)

05/14/2007 04:16:36 PM · #88

Originally posted by GeneralE:

Originally posted by Elvis_L:
i don.t honestly see the numbr 72 team ever winning against the nuber one team.

I believe the current plan is to have the playoffs occur only within Divisions -- that there will be separate championships for Division A, B, C. I could be mistaken about that, but in that case 1 never faces 72 ...

What and will there be a relegation for bottom "x" teams according to scoring average in Division A and then the top "x" teams from Division B and C championships move up to Division A for the next season?

Canon 12x IS USM (S3 IS built-in Lens) -- 36-432mm (35mm EQ)

05/14/2007 04:17:54 PM · #89

Originally posted by Cutter:

Why don't you post a table with your desired Division configuration -- I'm still not sure exactly how you'd like it to be different. Just list the team ranking numbers under Divisions N S E W ...

Canon 12x IS USM (S3 IS built-in Lens) -- 36-432mm (35mm EQ)

05/14/2007 04:22:21 PM · #90

Originally posted by Cutter:

Originally posted by GeneralE:

Originally posted by Elvis_L:
i don.t honestly see the numbr 72 team ever winning against the nuber one team.

I believe the current plan is to have the playoffs occur only within Divisions -- that there will be separate championships for Division A, B, C. I could be mistaken about that, but in that case 1 never faces 72 ...

What and will there be a relegation for bottom "x" teams according to scoring average in Division A and then the top "x" teams from Division B and C championships move up to Division A for the next season?

Possibly ... that hasn't been finalized yet.

One plan is to demote the bottom two from each division and promote the top two, and then "laterally rotate" the two middle teams into another conference, so the divisions will get mixed-up between seasons. But there are also other alternatives being considered as well, especially since we need contingency plans in case a lot of teams drop out or a lot of new teams want to join.

05/14/2007 04:31:02 PM · #91

Okay, I'll do that. I didn't realize there are gonna be 3 champions though. That's different. I think there should be one champion --- Division A.

And then the Top 8 (or 12) teams from Division B and C move up to Division A for next season. So it is a more long term, goal-oriented objective. Then the bottom 8 (or 12) teams from Division A move down to Division B and C and have to earn there way back into Division A.

Because if we have 3 champions, it dilutes it. Dilute is bad. Instead have it be more coveted or rare. If there are 3 champions, couple of times a year, at varying levels of talent, it just becomes "worthless".

So assuming these things you would have:

Division A would look like this:

North

1-8-9-16-17-24

South

2-7-10-15-18-23

East

2-6-11-14-19-22

West

4-5-12-13-20-21

______

And so on and so forth for B and C.

Canon EF 24-105mm f/4.0L IS

05/14/2007 04:38:13 PM · #92

More explanation:

The reason for one champion and a long term goal for other teams in Division B and C is because the ribbons already offer a weekly "fix" of achievement. But there is nothing really that offers a team oriented, long term sense of accomplishment. That would make the relegation concept work beautifully. So that once a team makes it to Division A, they truly deserve it. And then to win it, would be some feat. It would make competition, competitive again and make consistency and team scoring a premium, even if you don't win it all that season.

Also, when I said "Top 8 (or 12)", I meant total from both Division B and C. Since the playoffs are short, I would say no playoffs for lower divisions. Simply regular season play that dictates future assignment into Division A. They would have there 2-4 weeks rejuvenation between seasons, whereas Division A teams only get a week, therefore maximzing real life scenarios like fatigue and creative block....which in turn stiffens competition and breeds intensity.

Sheryll

Canon EOS-5D Mark II

05/14/2007 04:46:57 PM · #93

Well I thought the whole idea was to learn and grow by getting help from team mates as well as promoting a sense of comraderie. I mean I like competition but if we did all that then the competative part of this whole thing gets the emphasis and not the other stuff.

I think Team 5.0 will be having a most improved award for our team but, something like that on the grand scale of having a most improved team award would better promote learning in the longrun than all this competitive "Division" A stuff wouldn't it? Of course Team Zero would probably be the most improved since they can only go up I guess.