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07/27/2004 05:50:10 PM · #1 |
and if you did, what did you think? Any interesting stories from your night at the theater?
Ill post mine later.. :) |
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07/27/2004 06:11:21 PM · #2 |
Originally posted by MadMordegon:
and if you did, what did you think? Any interesting stories from your night at the theater?
Ill post mine later.. :) |
Do tell!!!
I, myself, am not a Michael Moore fan. |
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07/27/2004 06:19:05 PM · #3 |
Originally posted by GoldBerry:
Originally posted by MadMordegon:
and if you did, what did you think? Any interesting stories from your night at the theater?
Ill post mine later.. :) |
Do tell!!!
I, myself, am not a Michael Moore fan. |
Not yet, be patient :)
Can I ask why your not a Michael Moore fan? (ill assume you haven’t seen the movie). |
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07/27/2004 06:28:22 PM · #4 |
I saw it, and I really enjoyed it. I don't swallow what MM has to say wholesale, but I appreciate his brand of humour quite a bit and he certainly has an interesting interpretation of the facts. I found it to be a useful balance to many other opinions that are readily jammed down the throats of north american consumers.
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07/27/2004 06:34:19 PM · #5 |
I saw it. It was okay.
I think it's lame that this is the biggest documentary of all time, because it's seriously one of the worst I've ever seen. |
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07/27/2004 06:36:54 PM · #6 |
I agree with Frisca on this one.
I like MM's sense of humour. I read Stupid White Men and laughed all the way through it. Even though it had a serious side that i occasionally agreed with, the overwhelming feature for me was the humour. However, i have been to see F9/11 and i found it sensationalist. The point that he was making was onesided. I did not see the point in telling us that the Saudi's excecuted people (I already knew this...) and then to show a public beheading as if we didn't understand what an excecution was. As i said, Sensationallism at it's worst. Even though his hatred of the Bush family may be just, i found his film to be anything but.
Kev |
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07/27/2004 06:52:59 PM · #7 |
I'm vaguely considering going to the Crawford, Texas showing this week. I think fears about being deported will probably keep me away though.
Message edited by author 2004-07-27 18:53:16.
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07/27/2004 07:10:35 PM · #8 |
I've seen it and if you've yet to see it, in the interest of "fairness and balance," do so.
I think my girlfriend has described it best: F-9/11 is an opinion piece (like an article), supported with facts -- irrefutable facts -- presented in a certain way, and it leaves it up to the viewer to conclude on their own whether Bush's policies have been worth the cost.
Yes, I say "irrefutable facts" because those that have tried to discredit F-9/11 cannot disprove the facts used in the film; in stead, they've only distorted and muddied how those facts are presented in the film. If you're really interested in learning the specifics on the facts, and why no-one really disputes them head on (without resorting to hyperbole and distortion) visit the F-9/11 fact book. (Note that Michael Moore used The New Yorker's official fact checker to compile the evidence supporting every claim made in F-9/11.)
Anyhow, what struck me about the movie was not the so-called Bush bashing, but rather the human face and cost that Moore presents -- and which is generally missing in news coverage. I think that the second half of the movie is an incredibly moving pro-military, pro-working class, pro-humanitarian piece of film making.
Clearly I was moved, and I know that many people in the theatre where I saw it were too.
Forget what the media talking heads are saying, and see it... make up your own mind... and then go out and learn more about what you've seen.
All that said, two things are guaranteed: 1. You'll be moved, and 2. You'll be angry (whether because your eyes have been opened wide to the total costs of certain policies, or whether because you support Bush's administration and refuse to believe what are "irrefutable facts").
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07/27/2004 07:55:28 PM · #9 |
| I encourage everyone who thinks the film is a "documentary" (more like a "crockumentary") to read Fifty-nine Deceits in Fahrenheit 9/11. (Complete with relavent links.) |
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07/27/2004 08:11:43 PM · #10 |
Originally posted by Gordon:
I'm vaguely considering going to the Crawford, Texas showing this week. I think fears about being deported will probably keep me away though. |
Go see that! |
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07/27/2004 08:57:41 PM · #11 |
Anyone just see the "O'reilly Factor" on Fox just now? (yes im sure you all just couldn’t pull your eyes away from the National Democratic Convention)
Bill Oreilly just had Michael Moore as a guest. Im currently trying to download the clip, ill post it if I find it.
/me goes out for drinks, bbl. |
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07/27/2004 09:32:48 PM · #12 |
Originally posted by bdobe:
Yes, I say "irrefutable facts" because those that have tried to discredit F-9/11 cannot disprove the facts used in the film; in stead, they've only distorted and muddied how those facts are presented in the film. If you're really interested in learning the specifics on the facts, and why no-one really disputes them head on (without resorting to hyperbole and distortion) visit the F-9/11 fact book. (Note that Michael Moore used The New Yorker's official fact checker to compile the evidence supporting every claim made in F-9/11.) |
Irrefutable??? There are quite a few links in this forum alone that have refuted them pretty thoroughly (including the one Eddy posted above, which is excellent). At best MM presents a hodgepodge of trivial, incidental information wrapped up in his own devious, if arguably witty, misrepresentation of what those morals if info really mean. I honestly can't believe anyone with half a brain doesn't see through his garbage. Too many purple kool-aid drinkers in this world... |
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07/27/2004 09:34:37 PM · #13 |
Originally posted by MadMordegon:
and if you did, what did you think? Any interesting stories from your night at the theater?
Ill post mine later.. :) |
I'm still waiting for my free pass from MM. I refuse to pay to be propagandized. I bet the Nazis and the Communists didn't charge... |
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07/27/2004 10:07:55 PM · #14 |
Originally posted by MadMordegon:
Originally posted by Gordon:
I'm vaguely considering going to the Crawford, Texas showing this week. I think fears about being deported will probably keep me away though. |
Go see that! |
That's what I was talking about. The organisers seem to expect the police to try to stop them in one way or another.
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07/27/2004 10:56:36 PM · #15 |
Originally posted by ScottK:
I honestly can't believe anyone with half a brain doesn't see through his garbage. |
I feel the same way in the opposite direction. |
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07/27/2004 11:01:33 PM · #16 |
Originally posted by EddyG:
I encourage everyone who thinks the film is a "documentary" (more like a "crockumentary") to read Fifty-nine Deceits in Fahrenheit 9/11. (Complete with relavent links.) |
It takes one sharp razor to split all those hairs.
But I say, you cant see or feel human emotion that comes with that movie in that article. |
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07/28/2004 06:13:46 AM · #17 |
Originally posted by frisca:
I saw it, and I really enjoyed it. I don't swallow what MM has to say wholesale, but I appreciate his brand of humour quite a bit and he certainly has an interesting interpretation of the facts. I found it to be a useful balance to many other opinions that are readily jammed down the throats of north american consumers. |
Good call Frisca, I will add though that i think it could well convince a good number of voters, 'sitting on the fence' so to speak, to swing anti-bush. I hope it does. The film is very American and was fairly cheesy at times but i think there was a lot of information contained that the average Joe didn't know.
Roll on November - Nice one Moore!!
PS. Loved the bit at the beginning with Bush driving to the Whitehouse.... Hilarious! |
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07/28/2004 01:03:31 PM · #18 |
Originally posted by ScottK:
I honestly can't believe anyone with half a brain doesn't see through his garbage. Too many purple kool-aid drinkers in this world... |
Why do this administration's supporters always resort to juvenile name calling to attack those that disagree with them -- what ever happened to "compassionate conservatism"?
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07/28/2004 01:58:27 PM · #19 |
I saw Bowling for Columbine a number of times and wasn't torn up over his view points although I do really like the fact he'll dig to find information, even if it is to suit his views. And I think that's why I don't entirely like his work; he imploys the same techniques that he's complaining so much about. Fact picking.
I started to read Stupid White Men but found Moore's attempt at humor to be contrived and point-missing. But since I never read the entire thing I'll conceed that it might've actually gone somewhere intelligent! |
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07/28/2004 06:44:45 PM · #20 |
Originally posted by GoldBerry:
I saw Bowling for Columbine a number of times and wasn't torn up over his view points although I do really like the fact he'll dig to find information, even if it is to suit his views. And I think that's why I don't entirely like his work; he imploys the same techniques that he's complaining so much about. Fact picking.
I started to read Stupid White Men but found Moore's attempt at humor to be contrived and point-missing. But since I never read the entire thing I'll conceed that it might've actually gone somewhere intelligent! |
Fahrenheit is so much better. Moore learned his lesson from the mistakes he made in Bowling that have hurt his reputation. |
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07/28/2004 07:03:55 PM · #21 |
Perhaps people who automatically tune out anything with Michael Moore's name attached should try reading something from an actual Texas populist, Jim Hightower.
After I first took office as Texas agricultural commissioner in 1983--having run a headbutting, bloodletting campaign against the chemical companies, the right-wing Farm Bureau, and other forces of ignorance and arrogance--these same forces sent their lobbyists around to see me, offering big toothy smiles, cooing words of congratulations, and proffering checks to help pay off my campaign debt. It's a ritual in Texas politics called "getting well."
--from There's Nothing in the Middle of the Road Except Yellow Stripes and Dead Armadillos
Jim's Blog
Message edited by author 2004-07-28 19:10:14. |
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07/28/2004 07:14:47 PM · #22 |
And an exerpt from Hightower's latest book ...
Very few presidents in our nation’s string of 43 have been as brazenly servile to the moneyed elite as has George (only Grant, McKinley, and Harding are competitive). And none have been so blithely obtuse to that servility, couching every single act as being for "the children," "the single mom," "the small farmer," " the seniors," or some other humble group that actually gets none of the action.
He reminds me of the fable from which we get the term, "naked truth." It’s about two goddesses, one named Truth and the other named Falsehood, who went skinny- dipping. When Falsehood came out of the water, she put on Truth’s clothes, and left. When Truth came out, however, she refused to put on Falsehood’s clothing, preferring to go home naked.
George sees no virtue in naked Truth when Falsehood’s garb is so readily available and such a natural fit, and he reaches for it regularly to cloak his steady undermining of the common good. One quick example: The Patient’s Bill of Rights. Remember this issue? It was hot in the 2000 election, as people were outraged by the abuses they receive from their HMOs and insurance companies.
Bush grabbed this people’s issue and ran with it, loudly touting his record as Texas governor, including this TV ad on his behalf: "While Washington deadlocked, he delivered a patient’s bill of rights that’s a model for America." Good stuff. Onlyâ€Â¦ it was totally false. A patient’s rights bill did pass, but he vetoed it at the behest of a major campaign funder who owned the biggest HMO in the country, Colombia/HCA. Then, against his active opposition, the Texas legislature passed another version, this time by a veto-proof margin. Even then, George refused to sign it, letting it become law without benefit of his gubernatorial imprimatur.
Yet, throughout the 2000 election, he claimed to be Mr. ConsumerMan, promising to fight like an enraged bear for a national patient’s bill of rights: "It’s time for our nation to come together and do what’s right for the people." |
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07/30/2004 07:26:21 AM · #23 |
| What only half a dozen people on here saw the movie? Surely that cant be all. Its the most seen documentary ever and its only been out for a month. |
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07/30/2004 07:53:29 AM · #24 |
Isn't this movie a way for the US to maintain the hostility, until they find another small country to blow the crap out of.
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07/30/2004 08:37:57 AM · #25 |
Originally posted by BooZon:
Isn't this movie a way for the US to maintain the hostility, until they find another small country to blow the crap out of. |
Good guess but, more likely it would be the division the current administration has created in America. I fight with my co-workers allmost daily about this stuff.
As a matter of fact, I walked into an argument at work between 4 guys this morning at 7am about the Kerry's DNC speech last night.
btw, Iraq is not small :) |
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