| Author | Thread |
|
|
12/26/2002 10:42:22 AM · #1 |
Personal feeling. Black and White should be just that. Black and White. If the powers that be wanted it to be a duotone challenge they would have stated it.
Duotone involves colors. Colors involve RGB. RGB would then open the gamut. Duo, Tri, why not Quad tone? And if Quad is OK why not a full color images? What about a duotone that doesn't use Black? Is that OK?
Calling this a B+W challenge is misleading at best and a down right mis-represention at worst if duotones are allowed. At that point it is no longer black and white challenge but a color one and opens an unfair advantage to those that read this thread. If Duo's are allowed it should be stipulated in the challenge description.
B&W photography is the absense of color, just gray tones. IMO it should just stay that way.
JMO - Dave
|
|
|
|
12/26/2002 10:51:00 AM · #2 |
Well, the fact is that "Black and White" photography has never reflected its name in a literal sense. It has always been about photographing things using a medium that is sensitive to the intensity of light. The colours produced by these media (plates, film and paper) have always been intrinsic to the chemical compounds used. None of these have ever been what a scientist would define as strictly shades of grey. Different media had slightly different tints.
So that's what B&W photography really is, in practice - a portrayal of the varying intensity of light, in whatever shades the medium you use produces. Since we use the digital medium, we (for the first time ever, really) have the ability to create photos that are strictly shades of grey. They don't really emulate traditional B&W photos, though, and many people would like to have the freedom to do that.
|
|
|
|
12/26/2002 10:55:14 AM · #3 |
If you look through the past winners of many B&W competitions (both digital and film) you'll find a fairly large percentage of duo-tone images.
But then again, everyone is entitled to their opinion :) I'm sure there is a couple of folks out there that will vote down anything that is not a 3/4 face bust of a human with perfectly combed hair. That's why I shot 'my' vision of what the challenge is and don't worry too much about scores :)
|
|
|
|
12/26/2002 11:00:18 AM · #4 |
If you wanted to say this was just black and white, then you would end up with a load of entries like this:
In photography duotone is classed as black and white.
The image doesnt even need to be converted to duotone, eg 2 eggs on a brown surface would be in full colour but only be duotone.
|
|
|
|
12/26/2002 11:01:25 AM · #5 |
since my camera does not support a B&W mode I have to edit my pic to B&W. Well its duotone, because I dont like to spend a lot of time getting the shades just right, and I dont really like to edit my pictures from their original form.
James
|
|
|
|
12/26/2002 11:24:42 AM · #6 |
Originally posted by lisae:
So that's what B&W photography really is, in practice - a portrayal of the varying intensity of light, |
No it is a portrayal in the varying intensity of black and being void of saturation.
So is a quad tone or a tri tone viable? Can I enter a duotone with two pms colors and no black?
Dave
|
|
|
|
12/26/2002 11:36:38 AM · #7 |
IMO, black and white is anything that is two tones where one of them is predominantly black.
|
|
|
|
12/26/2002 11:48:45 AM · #8 |
Just 'cause I feel like mixing things up...
First, I recognize the difference between digital and traditional photography. But I'm gonna say this anyway...
In traditional B&W photography, you have all sorts of ways to get tone into an image. (Note that I'm talking about toning and B&W at the same time?)
You can print using various different chemical combinations that will give you browns, rusts, blues, whatever. You can also print using a straight "B&W" chemical bath, and then put that finished print into another chemical bath that will change the color. (What often happens is that the toner coats the silver in the prints and makes them more stable -- thus the print will last longer.) Blah blah blah, right?
What it comes down to, I believe, is that the black and white in B&W photography comes from the color of the FILM not the color of the PRINT. (And yes, I'm sure that there are all sorts of ways to dissect that statement and prove me wrong -- but at base, I'm pretty sure that's correct.)
|
|
|
|
12/26/2002 12:52:07 PM · #9 |
Originally posted by Davenit:
Originally posted by lisae:
So that's what B&W photography really is, in practice - a portrayal of the varying intensity of light, |
No it is a portrayal in the varying intensity of black and being void of saturation. |
You didn't really understand what I said. I have a physics background, so maybe my terminology isn't really photographic... however I was referring to the light being incident on a medium. The medium reacts to the intensity of the light at each point.
B&W photos are a record of just the intensity value of the light. Colour photography includes colour information along with intensity. So, my distinction is really that any photo that shows ONLY the intensity information of the light could be classed as B&W photography. That would even work if the light being measured was IR, or any other part of the electromagnetic spectrum. Ever seen the output from the COBE detector? :)
|
|
|
|
12/26/2002 03:12:38 PM · #10 |
lisae, so then... anything is a go because everything is void of color and it's classification in a color spectrum is based on reactivity to light and at what temperature it absorbs light? I think what you are saying is the color of the objects which we see are largely due to the way those objects interact with light and ultimately reflect or transmit it to our eyes. The color of an object is not actually within the object itself; rather, the color is in the light which shines upon it that ultimately becomes reflected or transmitted to our eyes.
Is this sort of what you meant?...
Dave
Message edited by author 2002-12-26 17:17:14.
|
|
|
|
12/26/2002 03:51:48 PM · #11 |
Am I going to be quized on this after the challenge??
|
|
|
|
12/26/2002 10:27:56 PM · #12 |
Originally posted by Davenit:
lisae, so then... anything is a go because everything is void of color and it's classification in a color spectrum is based on reactivity to light and at what temperature it absorbs light? I think what you are saying is the color of the objects which we see are largely due to the way those objects interact with light and ultimately reflect or transmit it to our eyes. The color of an object is not actually within the object itself; rather, the color is in the light which shines upon it that ultimately becomes reflected or transmitted to our eyes.
Is this sort of what you meant?...
Dave |
Sorry, I went to bed just after my last post, so I didn't get back to you...
That's not really what I meant. Everything you said is true, but what we're talking about here is how the light is detected and recorded, not its source (or the objects reflecting/transmitting it). In a B&W photo (or any duotone photo), areas are dark because there wasn't much light coming from that area in the scene, and other areas are light because there was a lot of light. However, this is just a record of intensity. In colour photography, areas can be dark green, other areas can be light and red.... this shows colour information along with the intensity.
So, I guess what I'm talking about here is what information we're given about the scene via the photograph. If it's just in terms of one area being bright and another being dim, that's just intensity information, and that's what B&W photography tells us. If this is shown in shades of grey, sepia, red, blue or purple, it's still just intensity information, and it still qualifies as "Black and White photography" to me.
|
|
|
|
12/26/2002 10:37:56 PM · #13 |
I always thought it should be called monochrome. In digital, if you do not want color, the proper term is gray scale not black and white. If that is what the admins wanted, they would have asked for it. Believe me, they have enough expirience by now.
|
|
Home -
Challenges -
Community -
League -
Photos -
Cameras -
Lenses -
Learn -
Help -
Terms of Use -
Privacy -
Top ^
DPChallenge, and website content and design, Copyright © 2001-2025 Challenging Technologies, LLC.
All digital photo copyrights belong to the photographers and may not be used without permission.
Current Server Time: 08/28/2025 10:21:13 AM EDT.
