Digital blandness - DPChallenge Forums

Canon EF-S 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6 IS

07/02/2004 10:32:21 AM · #1

Looking at some recent film shots I start wondering if I'm getting bored of the technically lifeless digital 'feel' The obsession about perfectly noiseless images (neat image et al) the absolutely correct colour balance, crisply sharp, infinite depth of field.

It starts feeling soul destroying.
Film

Digital

Message edited by author 2004-07-02 10:57:22.

Konador

Canon EOS-500D Rebel T1i

07/02/2004 10:35:02 AM · #2

They don't have to be noiseless, correctly coloured, sharp, or infinite dof if you don't want them to. It's only to please DPC voters that you often need to do shots like this.

bod

07/02/2004 10:47:47 AM · #3

Heh, Ben beat me to it with that response ; )

I'm not sure what the photos you've posted are supposed to highlight.
I see no reason why any of the film photos couldn't have been shot digitally and I expect the same is true the other way around. Apart from the 3rd film and the 1st digital, which are as good as each other, they're not really comparable.

For me, obsessing about noise, sharpness, etc was a beginner thing. Now that I've advanced to beginner+ I worry about, and vote on, the technicalities a lot less.

GeneralE

Canon PowerShot S3 IS

Canon 12x IS USM (S3 IS built-in Lens) -- 36-432mm (35mm EQ)

07/02/2004 10:49:51 AM · #4

Originally posted by Gordon:

... perfectly noiseless images (neat image et al) the absolutely correct colour balance, crisply sharp, infinite depth of field.

Hmmm ... none of my photos feature those characteristics ... must have soul ...

Oops! I do have a couple with good DOF ... the devil made me do it.

Message edited by author 2004-07-02 10:50:47.

Konador

Canon EOS-500D Rebel T1i

Canon EF-S 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6 IS

07/02/2004 10:50:55 AM · #5

I was gonna post some of your shots as examples Paul but I got lazy :)

Marjo

Canon EOS-7D

Canon EF 70-200mm f/2.8L IS USM

07/02/2004 10:51:00 AM · #6

Gordon, Your Wild Flower Center gallery is beautiful. All of them are "Wow" shots. (I may never take another flower shot! lol)

I was feeling the same about film vs. digital and just picked up a new(used) lens for my old Pentax K1000. I admit the prints look pretty good with no editing. I've only shot one roll so far. I had to keep reminding myself to make each shot count. I'm so used to that delete feature.

digistoune

Canon EOS-20D

07/02/2004 10:54:33 AM · #7

Soul destroying??

I might be completely off the mark but is it the technology that's taking away from your photographic satisfaction or have you been too busy trying to make images that please everyone but you? Do try to remember that while challenges are voted highly for technical correctness on DPC, some of the most beautiful and compelling images have been lacking in technical perfection. Why? Because an image brings forth a strong mood or an emotion in the viewer.

Go out and shoot some images just for you - I'll bet you'll feel better and the images will probably be even better than you'd thought possible. :-)

07/02/2004 10:55:03 AM · #8

Originally posted by bod:

The feel of the medium is totally different.
None of the film shots, if taken digitally would look like that

07/02/2004 10:56:22 AM · #9

Originally posted by digistoune:

heh - this is so far off the mark it made me laugh. I haven't shot for a DPC challenge since the painting with light challenge. I'm talking about the visual feel of film versus digital capture -it just looks completely different.

digistoune

Canon EOS-20D

07/02/2004 11:02:00 AM · #10

Originally posted by Gordon:

Originally posted by digistoune:
Soul destroying??

I might be completely off the mark but is it the technology that's taking away from your photographic satisfaction or have you been too busy trying to make images that please everyone but you? Do try to remember that while challenges are voted highly for technical correctness on DPC, some of the most beautiful and compelling images have been lacking in technical perfection. Why? Because an image brings forth a strong mood or an emotion in the viewer.

Go out and shoot some images just for you - I'll bet you'll feel better and the images will probably be even better than you'd thought possible. :-)

heh - this is so far off the mark it made me laugh. I haven't shot for a DPC challenge since the painting with light challenge. I'm talking about the visual feel of film versus digital capture -it just looks completely different.

Sorry; Just trying to offer some encouragement - the 'soul' thing threw me off.

yuki

Nikon D70

07/02/2004 11:04:04 AM · #11

to me, digital is a much more sanitised way of taking photographs as you can manipulate any error away from the photo.
With film, there was once upon a time where "grain" would be desired - rather than the trend now to make the picture as perfectly plain as possible. I myself have recently acquired a D70, and am not very happy with the amount of noise i get throughout the range, but being a complete amateur, its probably me rather than anything else - i would LOVE to produce a noiseless photo with it! - any suggestions apart from turning that noise reduction thing on?
;)

I have looked at quite a lot of digital and film work to try and learn from both, and i often find that its the original Film photographers who switch to digital who make the most appealing photographs, so maybe its that they're just more used to seeing the "soul" from the photo and converting that into digital?
its an interesting point though - one I shall be no doubt arguing myself when I start my degree course this sept (digital and lens media) althoguH i'm sure that there IS a way the two can work together.

bod

07/02/2004 11:04:35 AM · #12

Originally posted by Gordon:

The feel of the medium is totally different.
None of the film shots, if taken digitally would look like that

I guess I need a straight comparison then. I've never shot film seriously so comparing a flower macro to a building or a giraffe doesn't tell me anything.

I understand what you mean to a point - I remember resisting CDs for as long as possible (though my job meant I had to). The vast majority of my music collection is still on vinyl, and of course, sounds better that way.

Tokina AF 28-70mm f/2.8 ATX Pro-SV for Canon EOS

07/02/2004 11:10:21 AM · #13

Originally posted by bod:

I guess I need a straight comparison then. I've never shot film seriously so comparing a flower macro to a building or a giraffe doesn't tell me anything.

Probably still not the best of examples but

Film just looks different. It has character, fobiles, personality. It is the crusty old guy with a story to tell. It isn't perfect, it doesn't accurately and perfectly reproduce the reality in front of it.

Message edited by author 2004-07-02 11:16:30.

MWitt

Canon EOS-5D

07/02/2004 11:17:12 AM · #14

I think the two groups of images you are trying to compare are as different as a hamburger is to oranges. With the exception of the two flower macros, which I feel have a similar feel to them.
I think you should choose some digital photos that have similar subjects. I don't think you can really compare a shot of city streets to a flower macro or close up of a carnival ride.
I'm sure there are some differences, film vs. digital. I definitely think film captures reality a bit better than digital.
Lets see some digital shots of city streets to compare with Venetian. Or some candid shots to compare with your shot in the car.

My two cents.

Oppps,,,too late! (:
I had to go tend to the child while in the middle of my reply. Looks like someone beat me to the punch.

Message edited by author 2004-07-02 11:18:50.

bod

07/02/2004 11:22:09 AM · #15

Originally posted by Gordon:

That's a much better example, thanks.

I expect this is a common complaint from film photographers? Do you expect the camera manufacturers will do anything about it, or are we stuck with the 'new look'? Is there no way to easily reproduce the film look in Photoshop?

I'm going to sit back and watch the discussion from here - I'll probably learn something.

Nikon AF-S Zoom-Nikkor 24-120mm f/3.5-5.6G IF-ED VR

07/02/2004 11:26:41 AM · #16

Originally posted by Olympian:

I don't think you can really compare a shot of city streets to a flower macro or close up of a carnival ride.

heh - those two shots were taken about 50 yards from each other - both represent the bizzare unreality that is Las Vegas

jadin

Nikon D800

07/02/2004 11:29:08 AM · #17

I LOVE the color's digital provides. To me film is the bland one.

Nikon AF Nikkor 50mm f/1.8

07/02/2004 11:31:43 AM · #18

Originally posted by jadin:

I LOVE the color's digital provides. To me film is the bland one.

It certainly usually ends up with the most saturated, vibrant results.

pcody

Canon PowerShot G6

07/02/2004 11:32:55 AM · #19

Or you could try a sd10. Not that I'm a good represenative for the brand, but if you want a feel of film with a digital camera, that's the camera to try. You can download photopro and a couple of raw files to play with from the sigma site. You'd be amazed at the amount of detail in such a small image. Sorry. Just couldn't help but post a comment. Carry on.

garlic

Canon EOS-10D

Sigma 15-30mm f/3.5-4.5 EX Aspherical DG DF for Canon

07/02/2004 11:38:39 AM · #20

Originally posted by Konador:

They don't have to be noiseless, correctly coloured, sharp, or infinite dof if you don't want them to. It's only to please DPC voters that you often need to do shots like this.

CouldnÂ´t agree more. And great shots Gordon.

geewhy

Canon EOS-1D Mark III

Canon EF-S 17-85mm f/4-5.6 IS USM

07/02/2004 11:41:31 AM · #21

Originally posted by Gordon:

It is the crusty old guy with a story to tell. It isn't perfect, it doesn't accurately and perfectly reproduce the reality in front of it.

Ahhh..Friday nights at chucking out time !!!

To be serious, I understand the points being made but are we ever going to be able to accurately judge the two when viewed on an internet site since the film image has to be digitised to enable us to view it.. which must defeat the purpose to a degree..or do I totally misunderstand this ? (I am a bit technophobic..it`s my age )