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08/27/2012 11:28:12 AM · #26 |
Originally posted by Paul:
And remember - you can play 'both' sides if you want - plenty of people do.
Mass appeal one challenge, niche the next... |
I really like this idea |
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08/27/2012 12:11:59 PM · #27 |
Originally posted by Neat:
Originally posted by JuliBoc:
About leaving DPC:
First of all, you will be missed, both for your photography and your comments.
Second, if you only see DPC as a place to compete, then perhaps it is time to move on. But if you see it as a supportive community of photographers, you won't find a better bunch of friends elsewhere.
I find DPC a stimulating environment that has many ways of accommodateing all styles of photography.
Edit for typo. |
Well I like the comp and the support, and I'm sure when I decide to leave I'll miss everyone, I mean it's been a lot of fun - really! |
I left for a while too and was close to wanting to leave again recently but... something draws you back. :P For me it was that I hadn't been shooting for a long time, not seriously, and I needed a little jump start to get me going again.
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08/27/2012 12:25:12 PM · #28 |
Funny, mine also start off well, and start to plummet as soon as the Aussie's wake up...LOL!
Anita, as long as people try to turn DPC into something it's not, they will not stay here. By your own admission in this thread, you have acknowledged how much you have learned and grown from DPC, that you have found your style, that you have friends here, that it is a social and supportive environment. ("Well I like the comp and the support, and I'm sure when I decide to leave I'll miss everyone, I mean it's been a lot of fun - really!") In addition, you have created an award that is cherished by many.
Simply stated, your two stated goals ("I want to score over 7", and "I'm not willing to change just to get a ribbon...") are mutually exclusive. It simply will not happen. Very few people's native photography style ALSO has mass appeal. Perhaps the key lies in your own statements, which quite frankly, sound as inflexible as the people you accuse of having narrow vision ("It's taken me a while to come up with a style and now I have one I don't want to compromise to please people."). Do you truly believe that once found, our "style" is frozen into perpetuity? And what IS style anyway? Subject matter? Processing? Does our style not evolve, grow, transform over time? Do we only have one "style"?
DPC is what you make of it, and if you have stagnated, perhaps it's at least partly because you're not putting into it what you used to, are not willing to continue to experiment, or are so invested in this idea of "style" that it is paralyzing you. Obviously, you should do what your heart tells you to, but find your bent on leaving rather mystifying. |
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08/27/2012 12:26:42 PM · #29 |
PLEASE DO NOT LEAVE, AS YOU ARE A GREAT PHOTOGRAPHER, WITH SOME EXCELLENT IDEAS, SUBJECT MATTER, AND A DIFFERENT LOOK AT PROCESSING...
YOU HAVE A UNIQUE STYLE SO JUST TRY AND LOOK AT THE MAIN ISSUES PEOPLE HAVE COMMENTED ON YOUR PHOTOS THAT ARE CLOSE TO THE 7'S AND THEN YOU WILL REAP THE REWARDS...
HANG IN THERE GIRL AS I KNOW IT WILL HAPPEN AND THEN YOU THINK OF ANOTHER GOAL AND STAY LONGER I HOPE... I WOULD MISS YOU AND YOUR INDIVIDUAL STYLE...
LOVE FROM SHEZ
I ONLY GOT MY ONE 7 AND OVER JUST BEFORE ALL MY HEALTH ISSUES AND WISH I COULD HAVE CONTINUED BUT MY SIGHT WAS MAKING HUGE ERRORS IN MY PROCESSING AND I REALIZED MY TIME WAS OVER... KEEP DOING WHAT YOU LOVE UNTIL YOU CANNOT DO IT AS I MISS IT SO SO MUCH XOX
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08/27/2012 12:31:20 PM · #30 |
everyone vote 1 on Neat's images from now on so she never leaves.
the great Oz has spoken. |
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08/27/2012 12:32:09 PM · #31 |
Ok, the way I see this is that everyone has, or is looking to develop a style which some may like, yet others won't appreciate it.. The point is whether you use this site to shoot for interesting challenges or for the ribbons.. Would I like to ribbon? Sure I would love to at some stage where my shot finds appeal with the masses.. Does this mean that I would shoot what dpc'ers would like to see.. Most definitely, NO!
Take the ongoing street challenge for instance.. I had some shots which I thought might find appeal with the voters, but I chose to enter one which I thought had some street humor and told a story. As a result my shot isn't doing too well.. Do I regret it? No! I love constructive criticism, but that does not mean that I will change my style.
I think your work is excellent though I'm personally not a big fan of blur and noise, but I love some of your shots! If you do decide to leave this site, it would definitely mean the loss of a talented photographer. |
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08/27/2012 12:38:22 PM · #32 |
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08/27/2012 12:42:58 PM · #33 |
Originally posted by Paul:
Clear alignment with challenge - sometimes that means finding a middle pathway between perceptions of a challenge, shoot late after you've read the discussion thread (the aim here is to avoid the low ballers who disagree with your interpretation).
Avoid clutter, ensure the eyes have somewhere to settle and that this area has pristine focus (in camera - sharpening artefacts ruin scores).
Maintain clarity - use your histogram display on the camera to ensure you gather maximum data - harder to 'break' an image in post.
Don't let post processing define the image - for the most part, don't tone map, absolutely avoid halos.
Use a palatable composition.
Maximise the screen real estate - avoid portrait orientation, square crops give you more if the composition works.
Get rid of any blemishes - dust spots, target banding etc are ruinous.
Subject should communicate depth and draw you in, leading lines, perspective cues, good use of depth of field to isolate subjects etc.
Shadows (on the ground) and reflections seem to do well too.
That's just a brain dump - and what do I know anyway...
Just my thoughts of the things that I think score well. In no way do I think any of those gets you a truly 'good' image; but if we are game playing....
In reality the stuff I like to look at is like the image below:
That's the sort of image that I give high scores for... but shooting for a 7+ is all about mass appeal. |
F#ck that s#it, just shoot the way you like it!
Edit: I mean you no harm! Just kidding.
Message edited by author 2012-08-27 12:43:45.
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08/27/2012 12:53:06 PM · #34 |
Your average vote cast is 5.661 right now, which means you are as generous with your score as you are with your comments. If you leave I wish you all the best (I'm sure you will find it), & I will miss you.
My take on it is that the voter is expressing another bit of personal style. In other words, the vote is more about the voter than it is about the comp being voted on. And definitely has nothing to do with the photographer who entered the comp. Nobody can know (or care) why you entered that particular comp. But you know all this.
Why not stick around just for the entertainment value?
Message edited by author 2012-08-27 16:42:10. |
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08/27/2012 12:57:01 PM · #35 |
Originally posted by flavioalima:
F#ck that s#it, just shoot the way you like it!
Edit: I mean you no harm! Just kidding. |
No harm felt - you speak wise words! |
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08/27/2012 01:52:28 PM · #36 |
Originally posted by JuliBoc:
About leaving DPC:
First of all, you will be missed, both for your photography and your comments.
Second, if you only see DPC as a place to compete, then perhaps it is time to move on. But if you see it as a supportive community of photographers, you won't find a better bunch of friends elsewhere.
I find DPC a stimulating environment that has many ways of accommodateing all styles of photography.
Edit for typo. |
+1 |
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08/27/2012 02:20:33 PM · #37 |
Originally posted by cloudsme:
Shoot a landscape. |
Are you sure? I have eight 7s and I've never got one shooting a landscape (and I take a lot of landscape pics). |
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08/27/2012 02:58:52 PM · #38 |
Originally posted by Alexkc:
Originally posted by cloudsme:
Shoot a landscape. |
Are you sure? I have eight 7s and I've never got one shooting a landscape (and I take a lot of landscape pics). |
Interesting because I DON'T consider landscapes to be my forte, yet 3 of my ribbons are landscapes, and many of my higher scoring entries have strong landscape elements to them. My take on the landscapes is that nobody few object to the genre and you can often get some serious wow factor in them.
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08/27/2012 03:10:52 PM · #39 |
| What I always wondered about is why images that I give 5s end up getting 7s? Some images really do surprise me because if I had the same shots I would pull them out but there they are on the front page. Voting is part of the learning process so I do think I should be able to differentiate between the good and the bad. Mostly it's easy to see which image will win (even if it isn't my 10 or 9 or even 8) but when I'm wrong it's out of the ballpark wrong. |
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08/27/2012 04:24:08 PM · #40 |
Didn't you just get here?
Man I've been here too long, I've experienced the whole cycle.
No reason to leave and shut the door for good, but by all means stop entering if that's no longer your thing. I haven't entered a shot in ages but I still like to drop by from time to time for the forums. |
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08/27/2012 05:08:27 PM · #41 |
With all due respect Anita, you are a bit fixated on ribbons. Look at your Favorites page. The vast majority of your favorite shots won no ribbons. Do you think your images are not appreciated here? It looks like your images have been chosen as favorites 276 times. You have been selected by others as a favorite photographers 57 times -- 5 times just this month.
I have made an effort to occasionally take more risks with my entries this year -- to enter images I have some passion for that I do not expect to be universally DPC voter friendly. Without question, your entries have inspired me to be more bold. It's a bit ironic that someone so focused on achieving a 7+ score has helped me to enter some shots less focused on scoring highly.
Hopefully, you will stick around and keep entering. But if frustration over scores is driving you crazy then perhaps a break would be best for your mental health. |
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08/27/2012 05:27:45 PM · #42 |
Originally posted by Alexkc:
Originally posted by cloudsme:
Shoot a landscape. |
Are you sure? I have eight 7s and I've never got one shooting a landscape (and I take a lot of landscape pics). |
yep only 1 of my 7's are of a strait on landscape. Most of my 7+ images combine both a landscape with a person in it or are just a portrait. I find it really hard to get a 7+ with just a landscape it has to be something really special. On the other hand I can go down in the basement of my studio and shoot a unique shot of one of my children and get a 7+ much easier. |
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08/27/2012 05:30:42 PM · #43 |
If you want to leave, why do you care how you score?
Looking at my 7s, most of them are strong responses to the challenge, and that is key to a strong score. They all have light that was pretty strong, either found that way, or more often created with supplemental light. A few years ago I quit caring how my images scored, when I enter it is to see how the DPC community will react to experiments, though I enter less often than I used to, but I prefer this community to any other I have found on the web.
If you don't want to adapt your style to the challenge, and you care about how you score, then only enter challenges that suit your style. If you want my advice, keep honing your style and quit worrying about 7s, they will come when you least expect them, as long as you nail the challenge, and shoot good light. |
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08/27/2012 06:00:14 PM · #44 |
Originally posted by BrennanOB:
... keep honing your style and quit worrying about 7s, they will come when you least expect them, as long as you nail the challenge, and shoot good light. |
Very true. A shot you think will be above 7 will be far below and a shot that you feel is nice but just meh about could easily do well. I can't say it's a crapshoot but I definitely feel that way a lot of the time.
As far as Paul's early post, that sums up a lot things to keep in mind when shooting and processing an entry. As you know it all starts with a strong image to begin with. Keep all those things in mind when starting out on a project.
I knew we've talked about your wanting to leave DPC just a few months ago and I'm happy you stayed for those months. If you really feel the need to leave, know that you'll be strongly missed. There are A LOT of photograhpers here, including me, that really admire and respect your artistic vision. Whenever there's an artsy challenge coming up, I often look at your portfolio for some inspiration.
If you really need to go, maybe just set aside a few months and take a break from the site. Don't sign on, peek or anything like that. I did this for 3-4 months I think and came with new desire to shoot and learn again. I hope that will be the same situation for you.
Good luck in whatever you decide. |
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08/27/2012 06:03:50 PM · #45 |
Originally posted by BrennanOB:
If you want to leave, why do you care how you score?
Looking at my 7s, most of them are strong responses to the challenge, and that is key to a strong score. They all have light that was pretty strong, either found that way, or more often created with supplemental light. A few years ago I quit caring how my images scored, when I enter it is to see how the DPC community will react to experiments, though I enter less often than I used to, but I prefer this community to any other I have found on the web.
If you don't want to adapt your style to the challenge, and you care about how you score, then only enter challenges that suit your style. If you want my advice, keep honing your style and quit worrying about 7s, they will come when you least expect them, as long as you nail the challenge, and shoot good light. |
Very true, I find I score best when I am entering a challenge that fits my style. For instance I would do poorly in a street photography challenge or a bird challenge (or any wild animal for that matter) You already have the technical ability so, when you are shooting what you love and doing something that you are passionate about and it really fits the challenge everything will collide into a 7+ score. |
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08/27/2012 07:42:01 PM · #46 |
Anita, first I've got to say that if you go I'll miss you. I have seen you grow in the 2 1/2 years or so you've been here and I really enjoy your work and comments and the interaction between you and me and DPC. You have been here a couple of years less than me, but you have entered more challenges than I have. Is burnout a possibility? I know that each challenge carries a certain degree of stress and of course time spent here is time not spent elsewhere. I hope that you can maybe just slow down a bit, take a break if you need to, choose your challenges and regain the enjoyment. Funny thing is that one of your images singled out as 'not so successful' really, REALLY, appealed to me.
Message edited by author 2012-08-27 19:42:21.
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08/27/2012 07:46:42 PM · #47 |
| Anita, please don't go. You leave great comments and your work is lovely. If it makes you feel any better, in the 6 years I've been here I have only one 7 - bang on the nail 7.000 - and the damn thing didn't even ribbon :-( Yet I've got two ribbons, both with 6.9s. Go figure. |
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08/27/2012 07:58:40 PM · #48 |
Originally posted by Neat:
... I'm not willing to change just to get a ribbon, It's taken me a while to come up with a style and now I have one I don't want to compromise to please people.
... |
And yet, amazingly, you continue to post threads like this one.
I'm going to try to go a different direction here and give advice that I think you might find more helpful.
Forgive me, please, but I've seen a pattern in your threads:
First you ask for help/advise on how to score well.
Next you'll throw up your hands a bit and proclaim how it's not right for you
Finally you seem to change your tune to the above attitude.
I respect the attitude, I just can't figure out why you keep asking for help to "improve" and then shrugging off the advice as non-applicable.
Don't compromise, and get used to getting crappy scores.
Compromise and your scores will rise, but you'll lose cred with the art crowd here.
The choice is yours, but for heavens sake, as I said last time we did this thing: Start taking the advice, or start asking the right/real question.
One more bit of useful advice, stop saying you're going to leave... It doesn't do anything helpful, even especially if you really are considering it.
With that being said, I'll add my voice to the chorus and say "stick around, you do some cool stuff". |
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08/27/2012 08:24:34 PM · #49 |
Originally posted by Cory:
Originally posted by Neat:
... I'm not willing to change just to get a ribbon, It's taken me a while to come up with a style and now I have one I don't want to compromise to please people.
... |
And yet, amazingly, you continue to post threads like this one.
I'm going to try to go a different direction here and give advice that I think you might find more helpful.
Forgive me, please, but I've seen a pattern in your threads:
First you ask for help/advise on how to score well.
Next you'll throw up your hands a bit and proclaim how it's not right for you
Finally you seem to change your tune to the above attitude.
I respect the attitude, I just can't figure out why you keep asking for help to "improve" and then shrugging off the advice as non-applicable.
Don't compromise, and get used to getting crappy scores.
Compromise and your scores will rise, but you'll lose cred with the art crowd here.
The choice is yours, but for heavens sake, as I said last time we did this thing: Start taking the advice, or start asking the right/real question.
One more bit of useful advice, stop saying you're going to leave... It doesn't do anything helpful, even especially if you really are considering it.
With that being said, I'll add my voice to the chorus and say "stick around, you do some cool stuff". |
Perhaps some feel there should only be an "art crowd." I mean, what is this, a stock photo website? a technical manual device testing page on a gear review site? a place for fledgling wedding photographers to get their chops? (all perfectly fine pursuits, mind you)
Why is there such a groupthink that people that want change or are frustrated get shouted down?
My advice is to find some friends and get them to join. We need more people like you, not less. |
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08/27/2012 08:41:41 PM · #50 |
Originally posted by Cory:
Originally posted by Neat:
... I'm not willing to change just to get a ribbon, It's taken me a while to come up with a style and now I have one I don't want to compromise to please people.
... |
Don't compromise, and get used to getting crappy scores.
Compromise and your scores will rise, but you'll lose cred with the art crowd here.
The choice is yours, but for heavens sake, as I said last time we did this thing: Start taking the advice, or start asking the right/real question.
One more bit of useful advice, stop saying you're going to leave... It doesn't do anything helpful, even especially if you really are considering it.
With that being said, I'll add my voice to the chorus and say "stick around, you do some cool stuff". |
Funny thing is she doesn't get crappy scores. To place in the top often amongst this pool of photographers is not easy. Sadly once we start nailing a top 20, and top 10 finishes consistently we feel a 6.3-6.7 is a "bad" score. By we I mean me, but I have a feeling more people probably feel that way. |
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