voting - DPChallenge Forums

03/22/2004 11:24:50 AM · #26

Originally posted by Everyday Renee:

I think for Members Only Challenges, it would be great to display who voted what score when a challenge ends. I think after the challenge, the secrecy should end.

If you can't handle your vote being displayed, don't vote! That way, we could learn a lot. If I got low votes on a top-scoring photo, I could then e-mail the people who scored me low and ask why (especially if they didn't comment).

It would add some accountability...

It would probably encourage huge vote inflation too. After all, I could vote on all the images, or I could vote on my top 20% fav images and not get a slew of complaining emails demanding I justify giving their wonderous creation a 2.

scalvert

Canon EOS-5D Mark III

Canon EF 70-200mm f/2.8L IS USM

03/22/2004 11:31:27 AM · #27

Perhaps some quick "form-letter" comment buttons for those with little time- "Technically good, but uninteresting" "Doesn't meet the challenge IMO" "Poor focus" etc.? At least with a list of common comments, a voter could just click one or more to give insight without spending a lot of time, and still leave a more personalized comment when compelled.

EddyG

Canon EOS-1D Mark II

03/22/2004 11:39:58 AM · #28

Originally posted by scalvert:

Perhaps some quick "form-letter" comment buttons for those with little time

There was a similar thread where the concept of having anonymous "feedback checkboxes" was suggested. I still really like that idea...

Message edited by author 2004-03-22 11:40:44.

ganders

Canon EOS-40D

Tamron SP AF 28-75mm f/2.8 XR Di for Canon

03/22/2004 11:47:43 AM · #29

Originally posted by scalvert:

Perhaps some quick "form-letter" comment buttons for those with little time- "Technically good, but uninteresting" "Doesn't meet the challenge IMO" "Poor focus" etc.?

While slightly better than no comment at all, I have to say that, personally, just about the only comments I can't bring myself to tick as "useful" are ones that literally ONLY say "does not meet challenge".

The other two you suggest at least give me some insight into what the viewer felt about the photograph. Hell, even "boring subject, did not meet challenge" at least tells me to pick my subjects more carefully.

(sorry, bit off topic!)

03/22/2004 11:53:20 AM · #30

I think people one here get too upset about a 1 or 2 marked on their precious photographs.

Sometimes a photo can be great technically and meet the challenge, but just be as boring as old cheese. Some may find it boring enough to give a 1. What's wrong with that?

I don't vote that way, but I also don't mind people who do.

Lets pick on Kiwi's shot for a bit.

To me, in the realms of DPC it's a clear 9 to 10. Compared to other photographers and other shots it's great, it's clean tidy well exposed well posed well colored etc etc.

Now compare it to the photo of Sharbat Gula, an image that contains some emotion and feeling and even a huge story behind it. There is dirt and even scars on here face, she is an Afghan woman who has endured years of hardship yet her eyes are so clean and crisp and, well, simply grab you. The BG is rustic and complimentary to here eyes, her cloths are torn - etc etc one could just go on and on.

So to some critics, this is a '10' photograph, and perhaps they judge others by images of this standard or by their own personal taste in photography.

I am sure if the two were entered into a National Geographic portrait competition judged by a board of NatGeo professionals on a scale of 1-10, the results would be different.

My point isn't to downgrade the photo - as I said I think it rocks and would have given it a 9 or 10. But just my insight into people who don't vote like everyone else, perhaps they may not be trolls, or morons whom have a funny taste in photography after all.

Message edited by author 2004-03-22 11:56:55.

lwkimages

Canon EOS-5D Mark II

Canon EF 70-200mm f/2.8L IS USM

03/22/2004 12:25:54 PM · #31

jonpink, by your logic, voting then comes down to a 'personal taste' decision. I don't particularly care for the color orange; thus, regardless of how well a photo meets the challenge, or how well it was executed technically, or how 'creative' it was, it's ok for me to score it a '1' simply because orange things don't appeal to me.

Or am I totally misreading you? (..wouldn't be the first time I've misread online text ;-))

-len

KevinRiggs

Canon EOS-1Ds

03/22/2004 12:45:34 PM · #32

I'm with Renee, I say make the scores public after the challenge is over. Sometimes I don't want to post a comment because I have little to say about an image. Allowing people to see that I scored them a 4 (which for me means that the shot was either woefully off target, I can't understand how it meets the challenge or it was poorly executed) will afford them the opportunity to begin a dialogue with me. Perhaps they can show me something that I didn't see when I scored the photo originally. It won't help their score but I think it would make some people feel better when they get "trolled". Likewise when I post a comment that includes things I'd like to see change in the photo it might be nice for the photog to know that regardless of how I would like to see some different angle or some different lighting I still scored his/her photo an 8, 9 or 10 based on the quality of the work or the artistic merit I believe the photo to have. Heck, I even scored one shot an 8 in Portraits when I personally didn't like the color cast that had been added to it but I thought the photog used the effect particularly well. I thought he/she had followed pretty good principles of portraiture and then had taken a turn with dropping a colorcast layer over the top of the image and while that doesn't appeal to me, it didn't in any way diminish the quality of the photo or the artistic view of the subject that the photog had. I'm all for anyone knowing how I scored them. I just figure most people wouldn't give a darn.

Kev

03/22/2004 12:46:57 PM · #33

It could just be that the voter was quite familiar with the Nat Geo photo that was being recreated and voted low on originality. It doesn't have to be a troll vote, just because it disagrees with your own assesment.

After all, plenty of people seem to want to vote down water drops for being unoriginal too.

Message edited by author 2004-03-22 12:49:15.

03/22/2004 12:48:34 PM · #34

No your spot on - if you feel a photo is as insipid and lifeless as a piece of spit then why not give it a 1 if you feel that strongly about it?

It's not DigitalTecnicalAbilityChallenge.com there can be other factors in voting apart from focus and rule of 3rds.

03/22/2004 12:53:09 PM · #35

Originally posted by Gordon:

Exactly.

03/22/2004 12:56:16 PM · #36

If you want to let people know your score so they can start-up a dialogue just put "gave this a 4" in the comment box..

I feel that public voting will result in a lot of people becomming unpopular and even more therads like this but with names: "I can't belive jimmyjackass gave this shot a 1 - lets get him kicked out."

piwoguy

03/22/2004 01:15:59 PM · #37

Originally posted by lenkphotos:

This is pretty much the idea, and I'll tell you I vote like this, although not to the extreme that you're saying. The first factor I base my vote on is technical quality. The second is whether I truly like it - whether it grabs me, or moves me, whether I'd like to own a print, etc - and of course that's personal taste. And there's absolutely nothing wrong with voting based on personal taste of the artistic merit... that's what DPC is.

This is also why rankings aren't the most important feature of DPC, since every winner is a majority-vote winner. Historically a lot of "good art" has proven to be not "majority-vote" material. The rankings just help gage how popular a given photo is, which is different from (but related to) how "artistic" or "good" a photo is.

piwoguy

03/22/2004 01:21:37 PM · #38

Oh, and a clarification: If an image is technically perfect, I would still vote it <5 if the overall content to me is generally boring, is explotative, is unattractive, is meaningless, or some other non-technical quality. Luckily I don't see much of that here.

MikeO

Fujifilm x100

03/22/2004 01:30:30 PM · #39

Originally posted by Everyday Renee:

...and then what? send round the voting police? Whilst the voting on this site never ceases to amaze me its no good trying to figure out who gave what and why they gave it. Its a personal view of a photograph - I am certain we all do not share the same view on politics so why should we share the same view on photographs?

We are all going to have to take what we get and get on with it.

:-)

lwkimages

Canon EOS-5D Mark II

03/22/2004 01:32:34 PM · #40

Originally posted by piwoguy:

But, you would vote it a '5' vs. a '1'... Thus, you are giving credit for more than just personal taste. That was my point. There's no way a photo should be scored as '1' if it has some merit - technically or otherwise. '1's should be exceedingly rare - achieved only by monkeys randomly typing...... you know what I mean.. ;-)

Canon EF 70-200mm f/2.8L USM

03/22/2004 01:45:20 PM · #41

You could have a technicaly excellent image of a full stop, but that doesn't mean it deserves a 5

PaulMdx

Canon EOS-1D

03/22/2004 01:54:25 PM · #42

We keep coming back to the old 'why did this shot get a 1' argument......

It's funny - I've not yet heard someone complain about a shot that sucked getting a 10.. There is no difference, as far as I can see..

Has anyone ever considered difference of opinion?

PaulMdx

Canon EOS-1D

Canon EF 70-200mm f/2.8L USM

03/22/2004 01:55:32 PM · #43

Two 10s! Troooooooools!

Sony 16-50mm f/3.5-5.6 E-mount

03/22/2004 01:56:38 PM · #44

for magazines, I have 72 images that I've scored 3 or below. Should I have to justify myself to each and every one of those people when they email me to complain ?

The answer would be the same in each case - I don't personally feel that those images would ever end up on the cover of a magazine.

jmsetzler

Sony Alpha a6000

03/22/2004 02:16:50 PM · #45

Originally posted by Gordon:

Ditto.

KevinRiggs

Canon EOS-1Ds

Canon EF 70-200mm f/2.8L IS USM

03/22/2004 02:25:03 PM · #46

Originally posted by PaulMdx:

Paul,

If you'd looked farther up in this post you'd see that I already posted that image with a similar message.

Kev

ddmckinney1954

Canon EOS-300D Rebel

03/22/2004 02:32:17 PM · #47

I agree...this is an incredible portrait!!!! I certainly felt it was the best.
I wish there was some standard format for people to go by to score and score the photos subjectively. A lot of times, I might not like the subject matter; however, I look at the composition, the clarity, the color and the challenge. I vote according to those aspects...not whether I personally like the subject matter.

Canon EF 17-40mm f/4.0L USM

03/22/2004 02:50:08 PM · #48

Originally posted by ddmckinney1954:

There is a standard.

1 bad
10 good

peecee

Canon EOS-5D

03/22/2004 02:56:38 PM · #49

However one grades the pictures, it doesn't really matter as long as one is consistant, we are given 10 points to award, so why not use them?
The best should be hovering in the 9/10 points zone and the worst 1/2 points, every other could fall in between.Why use less?
A 3 in my book is a pretty poor picture technically or challenge wise
and a 7 is pretty good but not just there.
Just my way of judging, and I feel, a fair way.

lwkimages

Canon EOS-5D Mark II