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DPChallenge Forums >> Individual Photograph Discussion >> flaws in photographs?
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 10/27/2010 07:53:44 AM · #1
So, in the recent "body forms" challenge, I had a hard time deciding between photos. Do I go with the photo that had more interest, but something that would be perceived as a flaw? Or do I go with the technically better shot that's not as appealing?

entry:


2nd option:


I ended up going with the shot that I liked the best, the one with the flaw, but it started an interesting discussion between bear_music & myself.

It was my opinion going into that challenge, that a technical flaw hurts a photo quite a bit in the voting. The photo in question ended up with a good score. So this is not a complaining thread. It's also not a "which one should I have entered" thread.

So my question is this: How do you deal with technically flawed photographs in the voting process? Do you automatically vote it down because of the flaw? Do you only adjust the vote if it has an impact on the photo? Do you look to see if the flaw enhances the photo?

I'll go on to add that the blurred hand, in this case, is a flaw. I didn't check my settings, because I was worried about whether my husband could breathe comfortably. If I was going for the motion blur to add movement, I would have exaggerated it a little more. I do find the blur a bit distracting, but I liked the rest of the photo better.

Along those lines, I saw in her comments that njsabs was concerned about the run in the nylons in this shot:


Imo, it made the photo so much better. It added interest and a story to an already beautiful shot. It's not a technical flaw, but it's something that could be considered a flaw by others.

So the discussion is open: what do you think of flaws in photographs? How do you see/deal with them? Have there been flawed photographs that still really captured your imagination and wowed you? Or should a photograph be perfect?


10/27/2010 08:03:34 AM · #2
I don't know why it should be considered a flaw. To me, it makes it more of an "in the moment" type shot. The other one is so static. Usually it's the "flaws" that make me fall in love with a photograph, but I guess I'm in a minority.
 10/27/2010 08:04:15 AM · #3
Varies from image to image. In this case, I only voted on the strength of the concept, I didn't rate the image lower for the halo around your son or the strange color and banding in the skies not even on the oversharpened sand. Did you mention another flaw? Seriously, I thought the motion blur was intentional.
 10/27/2010 08:57:21 AM · #4
If the flaw actually hurts the image, it will get a ding for it. I'm also anal about compression. If an entry has a small file size and obvious blocky artifacts, that is easily avoidable and loses points from me. I'm often the only one to notice them, however. As I said when you asked my feedback on the above entry, having a visually strong image is more important than minor imperfections. Sure, someone probably knocked off a point or two for the blur, but more people would have knocked off points if you had entered the less appealling shot.
 10/27/2010 09:48:42 AM · #5
In the second shot, his kicking knee is straight, probably because he is using that leg to maintain balance for the pose. The first one has a lot more natural look, the second just looks totally posed because of the straight knee.
The first one looks like his leg is in mid swing in a normal kicking swing. I feel that might be what you were seeing as the reason you went with the first one.
I also don't see the little blur as a flaw. It actually puts some action into the image for me.
10/27/2010 10:48:01 AM · #6
It's our flaws that make us beautiful. How do I deal with technically flawed photographs when voting? If the flaw dis-integrates from the photo & I notice it as a flaw, then my pleasure in looking at the photo is interrupted & I'm motivated to give it a lower score. If the flaw adds to the story & meaning then I don't notice it as a flaw & my vote is likely to be purely my response to the photograph. Some features that might be seen as a flaw by others, I never notice as a flaw at all. I am much more likely to vote a photo down a bit for a flaw that is obvious, easy to correct, possible to correct under the rules, & yet somehow still there--like a slightly crooked horizon.
 10/27/2010 10:58:03 AM · #7
Originally posted by pixelpig:
It's our flaws that make us beautiful. How do I deal with technically flawed photographs when voting? If the flaw dis-integrates from the photo & I notice it as a flaw, then my pleasure in looking at the photo is interrupted & I'm motivated to give it a lower score. If the flaw adds to the story & meaning then I don't notice it as a flaw & my vote is likely to be purely my response to the photograph. Some features that might be seen as a flaw by others, I never notice as a flaw at all. I am much more likely to vote a photo down a bit for a flaw that is obvious, easy to correct, possible to correct under the rules, & yet somehow still there--like a slightly crooked horizon.


I agree with that -- I certainly will mark down a flaw that's easily fixed under the given rules. Although, it's usually only a point.

In my case, if the flaw is bothersome, meaning if it keeps drawing my eye back to the flawed spot and I find no interest or enjoyment in that flaw, then it probably will drop the score by a point. Sometimes mistakes can be quite intriguing.

I know I've seen flawed photographs with ribbons before, I just can't remember what they were. It would be intriguing to see whether it worked because of the flaw or in spite of the flaw.

Message edited by author 2010-10-27 10:59:13.
 10/27/2010 11:18:44 AM · #8
The following was an interesting flawed entry for me, but it's not the photo that is flawed. It is the subject.


The cast iron bull has a horn missing and it's been replaced with a screw. That unique flaw of the prosthetic horn is what appealed to me about the piece and is why it came home with me. Nonetheless, I received a comment that saw it as a problem and suggested I should have turned it the other way to hide the imperfection. No, I couldn't have. Then there would be nothing unique about it.

My point is that whether something is a flaw or not is in the perceptions of both the photographer and the viewer.

Message edited by author 2010-10-27 11:20:02.
 10/27/2010 12:11:33 PM · #9
Personally, I think images are picked apart way too much. I first vote on, for lack of another word, my "enjoyment" of the image. I don't think I even noticed the motion blur till you mentioned it. I know I didn't notice the run in the stockings of njsabs image; but after seeing it, I like the photo that much more.
And the image posted by yo_spiff? I was clearly looking for the screw by the horn, but had I not been looking for it I probably wouldn't have spotted it (at least not right off).
I tend to look at the overall picture....not the technicals. I enjoy seeing the image....not melting it down.
 10/27/2010 12:23:55 PM · #10
Originally posted by Luci11e:
Personally, I think images are picked apart way too much. I first vote on, for lack of another word, my "enjoyment" of the image. I don't think I even noticed the motion blur till you mentioned it. I know I didn't notice the run in the stockings of njsabs image; but after seeing it, I like the photo that much more.
And the image posted by yo_spiff? I was clearly looking for the screw by the horn, but had I not been looking for it I probably wouldn't have spotted it (at least not right off).
I tend to look at the overall picture....not the technicals. I enjoy seeing the image....not melting it down.


I agree with this 100%. For me photography is not about the technicals (I guess that shows), but rather what makes me think or feel.

Btw Wendy, you found a flaw in my mid-day sun entry & pointed it out, but still gave me a great score. LOL! Thank you!
 10/27/2010 12:28:49 PM · #11
Originally posted by Kelli:
Originally posted by Luci11e:
Personally, I think images are picked apart way too much. I first vote on, for lack of another word, my "enjoyment" of the image. I don't think I even noticed the motion blur till you mentioned it. I know I didn't notice the run in the stockings of njsabs image; but after seeing it, I like the photo that much more.
And the image posted by yo_spiff? I was clearly looking for the screw by the horn, but had I not been looking for it I probably wouldn't have spotted it (at least not right off).
I tend to look at the overall picture....not the technicals. I enjoy seeing the image....not melting it down.


I agree with this 100%. For me photography is not about the technicals (I guess that shows), but rather what makes me think or feel.

Btw Wendy, you found a flaw in my mid-day sun entry & pointed it out, but still gave me a great score. LOL! Thank you!


haha! You're welcome!
 10/27/2010 12:39:45 PM · #12
Originally posted by h2:
Varies from image to image. In this case, I only voted on the strength of the concept, I didn't rate the image lower for the halo around your son or the strange color and banding in the skies not even on the oversharpened sand. Did you mention another flaw? Seriously, I thought the motion blur was intentional.


My thoughts as well. The motion blur is the last thing in the photo I would have labeled a flaw. However, that said, I can see how someone might consider the blur a mistake since the image has been worked up so much, and not in a good way, it gives the impression that you're trying to cover up mistakes. Just let the image be.

Message edited by author 2010-10-27 12:40:37.
 10/27/2010 10:41:39 PM · #13
Not all "flaws" are flaws while many technicals contribute to failure.
For me, if something is a flaw, it's a flaw and I vote accordingly, but there is no "this is a flaw" hard-set criteria. There are no absolute rules in art, and rightfully so. If you get stuck thinking there are, I can't help but think you're missing out on a lot.
But to me, something that is visually strong cannot be nitpicked for flaws, as it is strong, and is not riddled with them in the first place. They are mutually exclusive, flawed and visually strong.
Concept and image are much the same thing in my mind. Citing the concept just makes an attempt to explain in words what the photo already was supposed to have done.
When voting, I know that finding direction can be hard, and I typically reward that attempt, but that is more to reward and encourage the photographer than voting on the photo. If I'm left thinking "I like where you're going" it means it's not there, but encouraging somebody to stay on that road is why I'll give it a bump.
 10/28/2010 01:38:40 AM · #14
I totally agree with Luci11e. Sometimes I'm reading the comments and marvel at just how nitpicky some people can be about truly insignificant "flaws" in truly spectacular images. The only thing I consider a "flaw" is when the spirit of the challenge is obviously ignored. Although every "rule" has many exceptions :-).
 10/28/2010 09:32:34 AM · #15
Originally posted by tanguera:
The only thing I consider a "flaw" is when the spirit of the challenge is obviously ignored. Although every "rule" has many exceptions :-).

But even that is very subjective. You left a comment on a recent entry "sounds" that it didn't convey any sound to you at all. Myself and a handful of others left comments that it conveyed sound better than most of the other entries. How could we perceive it so differently?

Message edited by author 2010-10-28 09:33:01.
 10/28/2010 09:47:13 AM · #16
I am going to defer you to a recent challenge:

Bridges III

look at the 4 ad 5 highest rated photos (yeah one is mine).

Nearly identical shots as far as composition goes.

One is clean, crisp, perfect horizontal, well lit and flaws kept to a minimum.

The next is dark, skewed horizontal, not flawless but is a way more interesting shot in that is has a great lighting capture.

Both scored over 7 and have almost identical scores.

There is no real answer. Sometimes a shot is so interesting it can make up for its technical flaws. Other times a shot is so just plain and simple that it needs to be technically perfect and clean to look great and score high.
 10/28/2010 11:33:11 AM · #17
Originally posted by Kelli:
I don't know why it should be considered a flaw. To me, it makes it more of an "in the moment" type shot. The other one is so static. Usually it's the "flaws" that make me fall in love with a photograph, but I guess I'm in a minority.


ditto. The flaw adds and since it adds I don't consider it a flaw.
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