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05/01/2010 12:25:11 PM · #1 |
I am gonna throw my frickin camera at the idiot that says it.
I see professional images in mags and in print that have a lot of "no,no's" according to the "photog experts"!!
Such as..
hands or feet cut out of the pic
blown hilites in areas
hard shadows
processing that is excessive and at the same time not enough
skin too smooth or not smooth enough
and so on..
I am truly tired of hearing all that bs that people need to recite..
Whenever I engage in a conversation with a fellow hobbyist or "pro" I hear the same shit
" I am a details person, I need to see all the details"
"OOh thats harsh lighting"
"Or your pic is a little soft or over sharpened"
or the ever present equipment judgement..(oh brother!!)
"I prefer natural lighting over flash"
Whenever I hear that it tells me ,that they are afraid to use flash and don't take the time to learn to use it properly (I'm still learning)
and my favourite..
I really prefer to get it right in camera and photoshop is cheating or not photography
I can go on but I think the point is made.
I needed to vent.
I know I have made comments myself on some of these issues and I now realize how assinine it is.
The inconsistent commenting and observations here are annoying. I received a comment on a pic regarding lighting and how I made an error ( not an error but intentional hilighting), only to see that this same person raved about recent ribbon winner with an obvious intent with the same lighting. Be consistent! Don't flip flop!
Anyone else feel the same or am I alone here.
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05/01/2010 12:35:07 PM · #2 |
I agree with almost everything you said apart from this...
Originally posted by LVicari:
"I prefer natural lighting over flash"
Whenever I hear that it tells me ,that they are afraid to use flash and don't take the time to learn to use it properly (I'm still learning) |
because i do actually prefer natural light over flash and don't think that it's because i'm afraid of flash. But the rest of it. Yea! Right on!
Message edited by author 2010-05-01 12:35:31. |
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05/01/2010 12:35:32 PM · #3 |
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05/01/2010 12:36:06 PM · #4 |
| No you are not alone and yes I have felt the same. I really felt like throwing in my camera in December 2009 because of that and other things. Some times the no no's actually make the photo if people would actually take the time and look at. It is good to vent occasionally. Just ignore the comments. You are a good photographer. |
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05/01/2010 12:37:42 PM · #5 |
Nope, you are all alone and when you throw the camera at me, could you please put it in the original packing, with a little extra padding? Hate to see it damaged... And if you could throw some of that L glass my way, that would be nice too...
I try to remember that different people have different tastes, that is why there are so many different artistic styles.
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05/01/2010 12:39:16 PM · #6 |
Originally posted by BeckyT:
No you are not alone and yes I have felt the same. I really felt like throwing in my camera in December 2009 because of that and other things. Some times the no no's actually make the photo if people would actually take the time and look at. It is good to vent occasionally. Just ignore the comments. You are a good photographer. |
I have no doubts on my abilities and lack of.. I usually brush off the comments but lately I have noticed it more to the point where I had to post. |
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05/01/2010 12:42:54 PM · #7 |
Originally posted by ambaker:
Nope, you are all alone and when you throw the camera at me, could you please put it in the original packing, with a little extra padding? Hate to see it damaged... And if you could throw some of that L glass my way, that would be nice too...
I try to remember that different people have different tastes, that is why there are so many different artistic styles. |
And I appreciate that. I see that people are not consistent with their comments or voting on images with the same "errors"
I guess I choose to play here and this is what I should expect.
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05/01/2010 12:43:17 PM · #8 |
| Sometimes I wish we could reply to the comments that we get... then I think of what my retort would be and realise how glad I am that we can't reply. |
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05/01/2010 12:50:56 PM · #9 |
To say "I prefer ..." is not the same as saying "You did ____ 'wrong.'" Why get upset over someone telling specifically what they like or don't like? That's a lot better than someone just saying "bad photo" or the equivalent.
And remember that the picture you see in the magazine is often not the same as what the photographer shot originally.
Around here people complain a lot about not getting comments -- I don't think a thread dumping on commentors is really going to help the situation. If you don't like a specific comment, respond to it directly in the photo's discussion thread. |
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05/01/2010 12:59:06 PM · #10 |
Originally posted by GeneralE:
To say "I prefer ..." is not the same as saying "You did ____ 'wrong.'" Why get upset over someone telling specifically what they like or don't like? That's a lot better than someone just saying "bad photo" or the equivalent.
And remember that the picture you see in the magazine is often not the same as what the photographer shot originally.
Around here people complain a lot about not getting comments -- I don't think a thread dumping on commentors is really going to help the situation. If you don't like a specific comment, respond to it directly in the photo's discussion thread. |
"I Prefer" GeneralE's post ;P |
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05/01/2010 01:05:03 PM · #11 |
Originally posted by clive_patric_nolan:
I agree with almost everything you said apart from this...
Originally posted by LVicari:
"I prefer natural lighting over flash"
Whenever I hear that it tells me ,that they are afraid to use flash and don't take the time to learn to use it properly (I'm still learning) |
because i do actually prefer natural light over flash and don't think that it's because i'm afraid of flash. But the rest of it. Yea! Right on! |
What Clive said...I know how to use strobes and I don't like them, I prefer warm/hot lights over cold ones any day if I must use artificial light...Warm light and natural light just have a different look that can't be replicated all that well via flash. |
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05/01/2010 01:27:02 PM · #12 |
Yup, you've made your point.
I'll stop commenting completely now, so that I don't take a chance on offending anyone, ever again.
Thanks for letting us know!
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05/01/2010 01:50:34 PM · #13 |
Originally posted by LVicari:
I am gonna throw my frickin camera at the idiot that says it. |
I'm almost sold on this idea but I'd prefer a Nikon. Get a D700 and I promise to take you up on your offer ;) |
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05/01/2010 01:52:16 PM · #14 |
Originally posted by K10DGuy:
Yup, you've made your point.
I'll stop commenting completely now, so that I don't take a chance on offending anyone, ever again.
Thanks for letting us know! |
That was my thought as well. I took Deb up on her 38 comment side challenge. While I was commenting on the B&W landscapes, I commented on what I didn't like the in the photo -- how it could be improved, imo, so that I would have given it a higher score. I was uncomfortable doing it. I gave comments that I would have like to have received. What would have made the shot better in the viewers opinion. I am only partly through the comments. If they are not appreciated, if the people are sick of hearing them, then I have no interest in continuing to give them.
There were deep shadows that I thought were muddy and served no purpose to the photo. I have seen photos with hands and feet cut off that were not artistically done, that looked like someone couldn't compose a shot. I have made the comments of which you are speaking, and might very well have made one for your B&W landscape shot.
You've done a wonderful job of convincing people not to comment. I think it's a shame.
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05/01/2010 02:07:28 PM · #15 |
For the record, I'm not going to actually stop commenting, I'm not THAT fragile, but I wanted to make my own point.
Which is, essentially, get over yourself :D
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05/01/2010 02:20:55 PM · #16 |
I think you guys are just all jealous that I know how to take better pictures than you and I'm not afraid of telling you....LMAO
In all seriousness though. I took up the 38 comment challenge, and I̢۪m glad I did. It got me out of my comfort zone, and forced me to look at the photo's and really study them so that I could comment on them.
I learned a lot, not only about what types of pictures I like personally, but how I could take some of the shots and tried to figure out what I would have done differently, not better, just differently.
I was not comfortable offering my opinion at first, and doing 38 in a row was really, really tough, but I hope that I have offered some suggestions that might have helped the photographer make that shot or future shots different. I have to also admit i fell back on the old "Nice Shot" comment sometimes wheni could fail to make a constructive comment.
Having said all that, I have received comments too (just look at the ones I did NOT mark helpful) that are what I consider rude or completely useless. These are comments that point fault, but offer no solution. And I really see no need for them.
I think this is where Leo is coming from.
On the flip side, I still only have 3 comments on my B&W landscape, (sigh).
I mean it can’t be THAT bad LOLâ€Â¦Ã¢€Â¦Ã¢€Â¦..
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05/01/2010 02:32:33 PM · #17 |
Originally posted by PixelKing:
... are what I consider rude or completely useless. These are comments that point fault, but offer no solution. |
And yet the OP seems to be complaining about comments which offer "solutions" to non-existant problems ...
I think it's fine to describe what you might have done differently, but I always take it that the photo looks the way it does because of intentional choices made by the photographer, not because of any "mistake." |
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05/01/2010 02:36:13 PM · #18 |
Art is opinionated
Art on the internet is subject to opinion
get over it |
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05/01/2010 02:45:32 PM · #19 |
Originally posted by GeneralE:
Originally posted by PixelKing:
... are what I consider rude or completely useless. These are comments that point fault, but offer no solution. |
And yet the OP seems to be complaining about comments which offer "solutions" to non-existant problems ...
I think it's fine to describe what you might have done differently, but I always take it that the photo looks the way it does because of intentional choices made by the photographer, not because of any "mistake." |
I'd like to add that if (and when) you get comments where people offer 'solutions' to something you did intentionally, it's a great chance to have a conversation with that commenter about WHY you chose to do what you did. Not only might it help the commenter learn something, it might even help the photographer learn something. Maybe the commenter has a reason for commenting as they did that didn't occur to the photographer.
I mean, I can intentionally crop out, say, a hand, because I feel it makes the shot stronger for some reason. However, if a commenter says they didn't like it cropped out, I can always ask why they feel that way, and give them a reason why I did it my way. Two things can happen here:
1) The commenter can go, "Oh, wow, I didn't think of that reason, that makes sense."
2) The commenter can say, "I can understand why you did it your way, but it is my experience that..." and maybe the photographer learns something.
Of course, there's always 3, which is both parties throw ego around and stop talking to each other for the rest of time.
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05/01/2010 03:01:17 PM · #20 |
Originally posted by K10DGuy:
Of course, there's always 3, which is both parties throw ego around and stop talking to each other for the rest of time. |
There's certainly enough of that around already, so I recommend a significant increase in exercising options 1 or 2. Great points. If you "hold the discussion" in the comments thread, everybody can learn from the exchange of perspectives. Perhaps the option of getting an email/PM automatically whenever someone replies to/quotes one of you comments would make this easier ... |
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05/01/2010 03:02:25 PM · #21 |
Originally posted by GeneralE:
Originally posted by K10DGuy:
Of course, there's always 3, which is both parties throw ego around and stop talking to each other for the rest of time. |
There's certainly enough of that around already, so I recommend a significant increase in exercising options 1 or 2. Great points. If you "hold the discussion" in the comments thread, everybody can learn from the exchange of perspectives. Perhaps the option of getting an email/PM automatically whenever someone replies to/quotes one of you comments would make this easier ... |
Fantastic idea. |
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05/01/2010 03:42:35 PM · #22 |
In every book on photography there are some rules which tell you how to take a good picture. Then it also tells you that those rules are just guidelines and some of the best pictures are ignoring them.
Now, why do people remind us of these rules in a comment? Because they think they were not broken intentionally but accidentally!
In a picture which is truly brilliant (like most of the OP's), I never see a comment like those mentioned, because it is recognized as outstanding. If you get such a comment, it means you did only average work and might need help. Ego... |
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05/01/2010 03:54:04 PM · #23 |
I recently sent a pm to one of the more prominent ribbon winners on this site asking honestly about their thoughts on why they scored me as they did. I felt I was quite humble in the message and even said the reason I was asking is that I have alot of repsect for their work, stated i was NOT mad, only curious.The reply? I got BLASTED as if I was wasting the time of such a talented individual. I still love the work of this person but I certainly view them in a different light now and will never initiate messages to them again.
I always felt the best feature if this site is learning from some very talented people who were willing to teach. When the OP makes comments like this it SOUNDS (not saying it is) but SOUNDS very elitest and discourages this learning process. What good is talent if you don't use it to sometimes teach those around you with the same passion? |
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05/01/2010 04:00:16 PM · #24 |
Originally posted by smardaz:
I recently sent a pm to one of the more prominent ribbon winners on this site asking honestly about their thoughts on why they scored me as they did. I felt I was quite humble in the message and even said the reason I was asking is that I have alot of repsect for their work, stated i was NOT mad, only curious.The reply? I got BLASTED as if I was wasting the time of such a talented individual. I still love the work of this person but I certainly view them in a different light now and will never initiate messages to them again.
I always felt the best feature if this site is learning from some very talented people who were willing to teach. When the OP makes comments like this it SOUNDS (not saying it is) but SOUNDS very elitest and discourages this learning process. What good is talent if you don't use it to sometimes teach those around you with the same passion? |
thats the whole reason I joined this site. To surround myself with people who are better than me, in the hopes I can learn and improve through my experiences on this site. |
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05/01/2010 04:00:31 PM · #25 |
Originally posted by smardaz:
I recently sent a pm to one of the more prominent ribbon winners on this site asking honestly about their thoughts on why they scored me as they did. I felt I was quite humble in the message and even said the reason I was asking is that I have alot of repsect for their work, stated i was NOT mad, only curious.The reply? I got BLASTED as if I was wasting the time of such a talented individual. I still love the work of this person but I certainly view them in a different light now and will never initiate messages to them again.
I always felt the best feature if this site is learning from some very talented people who were willing to teach. When the OP makes comments like this it SOUNDS (not saying it is) but SOUNDS very elitest and discourages this learning process. What good is talent if you don't use it to sometimes teach those around you with the same passion? |
I also, have received similar reactions to some honest inquiries. There's not much you can do about it though. There will always be people that believe they are above everyone and anything else, so you just have to avoid the individuals in the future, and find those that ARE willing to teach or give of themselves.
The other thing I find on this site that I'd like to see less of are the people that go pack mentality if you have anything even SLIGHTLY critical to say about photos that score really high. As if these photos are, by definition, incapable of being anything but perfect. It's always been bizarre to me :D
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