| Author | Thread |
|
|
02/21/2009 10:17:19 PM · #26 |
All of my contacts to the infringers were initally by e-mail with a certified return receit required letter sent even if they responded to my e-mail. I stayed polite and curtious in all correspondence (you never know when it's going to be used in court), gave them my price for their useage, the registration number and advised that they contact a IP lawyer about the consequences of infringing on someone where the images are registered. Three paid with barely a whimper (at least to me) before my deadline, the 4th tried to bluff her way out of it, which required me to have my lawyer send his letter (which said the same thing mine did but cost me $300) and she caved in and sent the money.
Yes, you have to have your images registered prior to the infringement, regardless of if they are published or not. You also have to register them before you can sue for infringement as well. As said above though, if you aren't registered prior to the infringement, you don't get the special coverage like not having to prove damages up to a certain amount and all legal fees are paid by the infringer if you win. Paying the legal fees alone is usually enough of a threat that they will usually not fight it if it's a clear cut case and they know they are in the wrong. Registration of your images (at least here in the US) is your best defense to being able to protect your copyright. It puts some real teeth into it. Getting the money is great, but I really love having some power behind my copyright. It still burns me that the first woman that stole my non-regisetered image was able to get away with it and there was very little that I could afford to do about at the time.
Mike
|
|
|
|
02/21/2009 10:52:06 PM · #27 |
Originally posted by chromeydome:
Probably he meant the rotary dial kind. Youngins today wouldn't even know what to do with one of those!! |
You can get an iPhone app so you can place calls using a rotary dial on the touchscreen ... |
|
|
|
02/21/2009 11:19:11 PM · #28 |
Originally posted by MikeJ:
Yes, you have to have your images registered prior to the infringement, regardless of if they are published or not. |
Nope. If you have published you have 3 months in which to register. If someone infringes within that 3 months they do not escape liability for statutory damages and attorney fees if you apply for registration in that 3 months.
I hope nobody reads this to say that I think the OP should register and sue on this. I'm just pointing out some issues with certain statements regarding copyright law. Doesn't seem like there is much damage here, but I know very little of the relevant facts and so I really can't say if I think you should register, contact them, ask for money, or anything. See what they say after you contact them, and go from there. It is a small college and I doubt they had any evil intent. |
|
|
|
02/21/2009 11:30:51 PM · #29 |
So wait, what exactly is all this registering business? From what I've read, it costs $30 (plus time) to register a piece of work. Am I reading this wrong? Because I'd love to protect my work, but the sheer amount most photographers produce is kind of cost-prohibitive if this is true...
|
|
|
|
02/22/2009 01:47:53 AM · #30 |
Originally posted by zackdezon:
So wait, what exactly is all this registering business? From what I've read, it costs $30 (plus time) to register a piece of work. Am I reading this wrong? Because I'd love to protect my work, but the sheer amount most photographers produce is kind of cost-prohibitive if this is true... |
You can register an entire CD, or CDs, or groups of DVDs at one time for $30. You don't have to pay for each image. |
|
|
|
02/22/2009 11:31:00 AM · #31 |
Originally posted by jmsetzler:
Originally posted by zackdezon:
So wait, what exactly is all this registering business? From what I've read, it costs $30 (plus time) to register a piece of work. Am I reading this wrong? Because I'd love to protect my work, but the sheer amount most photographers produce is kind of cost-prohibitive if this is true... |
You can register an entire CD, or CDs, or groups of DVDs at one time for $30. You don't have to pay for each image. |
This may actually be obsolete information. I seem to recall the process changed in the last year. I bet patents4u can confirm or deny this.
EDIT: Whew. I may have been wrong. Here's what it says on the Copyright office site:
Unpublished Collections
Under the following conditions, a work may be registered in unpublished form as a “collection,” with one application form and one fee:
The elements of the collection are assembled in an orderly form;
The combined elements bear a single title identifying the collection as a whole;
The copyright claimant in all the elements and in the collection as a whole is the same; and
All the elements are by the same author, or, if they are by different authors, at least one of the authors has contributed copyrightable authorship to each element.
An unpublished collection is not indexed under the individual titles of the contents but under the title of the collection.
The only difference, I guess, is the fee is $35 online (don't know if you can register a collection online) and $45 via mail.
Message edited by author 2009-02-22 11:43:39. |
|
|
|
02/22/2009 01:55:46 PM · #32 |
Very interesting discussion!
It has been more than 3 months since posting the images, so I won't be able to register the image. Also, I'm NOT out to sue this magazine for all they're worth. I just want fair compensation, and then some for the trouble I have to go through now to contact them about my image.
I got an automated reply back from the editor which said he's out of the office until Tuesday. I'll mail in a physical letter on Monday and call on Tuesday, and see what happens.
Thanks again everyone!
Kevin |
|
|
|
02/22/2009 02:00:25 PM · #33 |
|
|
|
02/22/2009 02:20:13 PM · #34 |
Originally posted by GeneralE:
Originally posted by Mulder:
Thanks for the replies!
To MikeJ - There is no doubt the photo is mine. Can I still register my photos even after the fact? |
You can certainly register them now, but the protections afforded by the registration would not apply in this instance -- the registration must occur before the ifringement.
I think you need to start with a letter to the publisher of the publication -- the editor may not have even been aware (though should have) of the source of the image; someone may have just "brought it in" and they used it. I always like to try civil discourse before resorting to civil courts ... |
Not sure this is true; from copyright.gov:
" * If made before or within 5 years of publication, registration will establish prima facie evidence in court of the validity of the copyright and of the facts stated in the certificate.
* If registration is made within 3 months after publication of the work or prior to an infringement of the work, statutory damages and attorney's fees will be available to the copyright owner in court actions. Otherwise, only an award of actual damages and profits is available to the copyright owner."
Oops, never mind. I misread "publication" as referring to the infringement, but in this case it would be posting to facebook.
Message edited by author 2009-02-22 14:21:22. |
|
|
|
02/22/2009 02:27:41 PM · #35 |
Originally posted by kolasi:
whats a 'zombie walk'? |
What Wiki whites on walk (oops, I mean "writes") |
|
|
|
02/22/2009 04:34:08 PM · #36 |
Originally posted by MikeJ:
Registration is well worth the little effort it takes to do it and if you are taking pictures that magazines want to use, you should be registering all of your images as well. It's easy, not that expensive and can be done online now. Other wise you have a copyright that you can't inforce very well.
Mike |
How do you go about registration of an Image.
|
|
|
|
02/22/2009 04:40:31 PM · #37 |
US Copyright Office has all the instructions and forms as downloadable PDFs. Basically, you fill out a form, enclose the image(s) in printed or digtal form along with a check, and mail it in. They also have an uploadable method for digital submissions.
See this thread.
Message edited by author 2009-02-22 16:45:25. |
|
|
|
02/22/2009 07:23:46 PM · #38 |
Originally posted by Mulder:
Very interesting discussion!
It has been more than 3 months since posting the images, so I won't be able to register the image. Also, I'm NOT out to sue this magazine for all they're worth. I just want fair compensation, and then some for the trouble I have to go through now to contact them about my image. |
I'll post again just to clarify....You can register anytime. If you wait more than 3 months after publication all you lose is the ability to seek statutory damages and attorney fees.
I hope you get the resolution you seek (and that it does not require any legal action - IMO, litigation should be a last resort on commercially significant matters. Shouldn't be a first thought or anywhere near that). |
|
|
|
02/22/2009 08:11:49 PM · #39 |
A young man named Rob Bliss (a student at Grand Rapids CC, the magazine's publisher...) used a Facebook group to gather people from all over Grand Rapids to attempt to break the world record for the world's largest Zombie Walk, which is basically people dressed up like zombies who walk through a city. There were easily 5,000 people there, and was really an amazing thing to experience. Discovery Channel even sent a crew out to film the event, which was aired earlier this month. It was quite funny though, because Rob thought ahead and actually got permission from the police department to do this, and got a permit to walk on the sidewalks. However, since there were 5,000 people behind Rob, very few adhered to the "sidewalks only" rule, and soon were spilling out into the streets, bringing traffic to a standstill, and splattering fake blood over everything. They were definitely into the mood of things. Some climbed light poles and shimmied out to sit 20 feet over the road, others climbed atop cars stuck in the mass of people, and still more rocked the city buses back and forth.
It was awesome, but unfortunately, it will probably never happen again. Surely it will be a yearly event now, but will be much more controlled by authorities. It only got so out of hand because they never expected so many people to show up.
Also, I received this e-mail today, so we'll see what happens.
I wanted to write you a note to let you know that your email has been received. I work in the Communications Department which publishes GRCC Magazine, but I'm not immediately familiar with the details of this story - so I'm going to take your concerns to our Executive Director.
I'll get back to you as soon as I know more. The employee who oversees the publication of the magazine is out of the office until Tuesday the 24th so I may not be able to confer with them and the leadership of the college until then.
In the meantime, if you have any other questions - please feel free to contact me. |
|
|
|
02/22/2009 08:12:50 PM · #40 |
Originally posted by Patents4u:
Originally posted by MikeJ:
Yes, you have to have your images registered prior to the infringement, regardless of if they are published or not. |
Nope. If you have published you have 3 months in which to register. If someone infringes within that 3 months they do not escape liability for statutory damages and attorney fees if you apply for registration in that 3 months.
I hope nobody reads this to say that I think the OP should register and sue on this. I'm just pointing out some issues with certain statements regarding copyright law. Doesn't seem like there is much damage here, but I know very little of the relevant facts and so I really can't say if I think you should register, contact them, ask for money, or anything. See what they say after you contact them, and go from there. It is a small college and I doubt they had any evil intent. |
I'm no lawyer, but I know I read it right on the Copyright web site that to get any special benifits of registrations, you have to be registered before the infringement. You only have 3 months to get them registered after publishing and get the special benifits IF there has not been an infringement that you are going after. This was brought up before during a dicussion like this and maybe it was you or someone else, but I found and quoted the part from the Copyright web site that stated this. This time, if people want to take the chance, that's up to them. I don't take any chances, I make sure I'm registered before an infringement. It's so much eaiser.
Mike
|
|
|
|
02/22/2009 08:44:18 PM · #41 |
Originally posted by Mulder:
Also, I received this e-mail today, so we'll see what happens.
I wanted to write you a note to let you know that your email has been received. I work in the Communications Department which publishes GRCC Magazine, but I'm not immediately familiar with the details of this story - so I'm going to take your concerns to our Executive Director.
I'll get back to you as soon as I know more. The employee who oversees the publication of the magazine is out of the office until Tuesday the 24th so I may not be able to confer with them and the leadership of the college until then.
In the meantime, if you have any other questions - please feel free to contact me. |
OK, now's the time to play it cool. Stay professional. It sounds like they have every intention of taking you seriously. Did you mention to us how much of a deal this magazine is and what the purpose is? |
|
|
|
02/22/2009 09:06:34 PM · #42 |
Originally posted by MikeJ:
I'm no lawyer, but I know I read it right on the Copyright web site that to get any special benifits of registrations, you have to be registered before the infringement. You only have 3 months to get them registered after publishing and get the special benifits IF there has not been an infringement that you are going after. This was brought up before during a dicussion like this and maybe it was you or someone else, but I found and quoted the part from the Copyright web site that stated this. This time, if people want to take the chance, that's up to them. I don't take any chances, I make sure I'm registered before an infringement. It's so much eaiser.
Mike |
To be able to seek statutory damages and attorney fees you need to register prior to infringement or within three months of publication. Thus, for a work published before an infringement, there are two windows...for unpublished works, there is one window (before infringement). Even if you register too late to be able to seek statutory damages and attorney fees, you can still register at any time and sue for actual damages or to recover the profits of the infringer. |
|
|
|
02/22/2009 10:10:26 PM · #43 |
| Just for the purposes of discussion, what constitutes "publishing"? Does the publishing of the shot to Facebook count? :) |
|
|
|
02/23/2009 12:25:58 AM · #44 |
Originally posted by L2:
Just for the purposes of discussion, what constitutes "publishing"? Does the publishing of the shot to Facebook count? :) |
"Publishing" would be the actual infringement. |
|
|
|
02/23/2009 12:41:11 AM · #45 |
|
|
|
02/23/2009 12:44:52 AM · #46 |
L2, an image is considered to be published if it's sold, rented, leased by the copyright holder or their agent. In other words, it's pretty much if someone makes money on it. I asked this specific question of the Copyright office about all the images that I've had on my web site and had been published but I didn't receive any money for (non-profit type work) and they said it was not necessarily considered published even if it had been on display and actually published in other publications. They also told me that as the copyright holder, I could declare the images published when I wanted, even if I hadn't met the specific terms outlined by the copyright law. At the time, the benifit of registering them as published verses un-published was I only had to send in one CD rather than two for non-published work. It also starts the clock ticking when you declare your images published as well. At least from what I understand.
Mike
|
|
|
|
02/23/2009 12:55:42 AM · #47 |
Originally posted by Patents4u:
Originally posted by MikeJ:
I'm no lawyer, but I know I read it right on the Copyright web site that to get any special benifits of registrations, you have to be registered before the infringement. You only have 3 months to get them registered after publishing and get the special benifits IF there has not been an infringement that you are going after. This was brought up before during a dicussion like this and maybe it was you or someone else, but I found and quoted the part from the Copyright web site that stated this. This time, if people want to take the chance, that's up to them. I don't take any chances, I make sure I'm registered before an infringement. It's so much eaiser.
Mike |
To be able to seek statutory damages and attorney fees you need to register prior to infringement or within three months of publication. Thus, for a work published before an infringement, there are two windows...for unpublished works, there is one window (before infringement). Even if you register too late to be able to seek statutory damages and attorney fees, you can still register at any time and sue for actual damages or to recover the profits of the infringer. |
Patents4u, you aren't quoting the other information on the copyright web site:
Copyright Registration
In general, copyright registration is a legal formality intended to make a public record of the basic facts of a particular copyright. However, registration is not a condition of copyright protection. Even though registration is not a requirement for protection, the copyright law provides several inducements or advantages to encourage copyright owners to make registration. Among these advantages are the following:
* Registration establishes a public record of the copyright claim.
* Before an infringement suit may be filed in court, registration is necessary for works of U.S. origin.
* If made before or within 5 years of publication, registration will establish prima facie evidence in court of the validity of the copyright and of the facts stated in the certificate.
* If registration is made within 3 months after publication of the work or prior to an infringement of the work, statutory damages and attorney's fees will be available to the copyright owner in court actions. Otherwise, only an award of actual damages and profits is available to the copyright owner.
Note that the Bold around the word "or" are mine. This is from this page: //www.copyright.gov/help/faq/faq-general.html#register down in the paragraph titled: "Why should I register my work if copyright protection is automatic?".
I've also read it elsewhere on their web site and I talked it over with two different lawyers on the first infringement since the image used was not published at the time. So that is what I'm going by. I wish it was the way you said because my first infringement was by a woman worth millions and I would have gone after her for everything the law allowed because of how she handled it with me.
Anyway, I'll not say any more about it, I just wanted to show where I was getting my information.
Mike
|
|
|
|
02/23/2009 11:52:17 AM · #48 |
Originally posted by MikeJ:
I've also read it elsewhere on their web site and I talked it over with two different lawyers on the first infringement since the image used was not published at the time. So that is what I'm going by. I wish it was the way you said because my first infringement was by a woman worth millions and I would have gone after her for everything the law allowed because of how she handled it with me.
Anyway, I'll not say any more about it, I just wanted to show where I was getting my information.
Mike |
Emphasis added by me.
I think you are crossed-up a bit, and that probably means I am not being clear enough. I've referred to infringement that occurs after publication and you refer above to infringement before publication. There is a short window in which they can be different, as I've noted, and will again (hopefully more clearly).
In the first scenario you have a short window in which to register - 3 months from first publication. Accordingly, publication, infringement and registration would all have to occur within that 3-month window (and in that order). If the infringement or your registration happened after that window, then you lose the ability to seek the noted special damages.
In the second scenario (infringement before publication) registration would have to occur before the infringement to get the noted special damages, the 3-month window does not apply. [As you've noted above, this is your scenario against the millionaire infringer].
Under either scenario you still can register after the window for special damages closes to seek actual damages or the infringer's profits (just not the noted special damages), as is set forth in the information you pasted from the copyright office website in your previous reply. |
|
