Canon Users: Which Color Space Do You Shoot In?

11/12/2008 02:28:28 PM · #1

This is kind of a build off of this thread. But I am curious to see what you set your Camera to shoot in.

So if you could briefly tell us what your "setup" is so to speak, that would be helpful.

1. Camera (sRGB or Adobe RGB?)
2. Raw Conversion Program (sRGB 2.1 or Adobe RGB)
3. Photoshop (sRGB 2.1 or Adobe 1998 etc)

I know that's a mouthful, but I'm just trying to link what I know together with this information so I can understand this beast we call color management.

11/12/2008 02:30:15 PM · #2

1. AdobeRGB
2. ProPhotoRGB (Lightroom)
3. ProPhotoRGB (PS CS3)

Message edited by author 2008-11-12 14:31:00.

Canon EF 24-105mm f/4.0L IS

11/12/2008 02:33:19 PM · #3

Originally posted by cpanaioti:

1. AdobeRGB
2. ProPhotoRGB (Lightroom)
3. ProPhotoRGB (PS CS3)

You have been far too kind, thanks for all your help and taking the time to teach a noob in the ways of color management craziness. You have been indeed most helpful and I am most thankful.

jeger

Canon EOS-5D

11/12/2008 02:34:01 PM · #4

1. sRGB
2. Adobe RGB
3. sRGB

I am by no means an expert on the topic.

11/12/2008 02:36:24 PM · #5

Originally posted by jeger:

1. sRGB
2. Adobe RGB
3. sRGB

I am by no means an expert on the topic.

I have a question for you. Why shoot in sRGB if you're RAW conversion is in Adobe RGB?

Message edited by author 2008-11-12 14:36:46.

CEJ

Canon EF-S 18-200mm f/3.5-5.6 IS

11/12/2008 02:37:41 PM · #6

1, 2, and 3: sRGB

jeger

Canon EOS-5D

Canon EF 24-105mm f/4.0L IS

11/12/2008 02:37:59 PM · #7

Originally posted by cpanaioti:

Originally posted by jeger:
1. sRGB
2. Adobe RGB
3. sRGB

I am by no means an expert on the topic.

I have a question for you. Why shoot in sRGB if you're RAW conversion is in Adobe RGB?

The answer is because I didn't know you had to chose what format you imported images as. :)

Message edited by author 2008-11-12 17:57:05.

Davenit

Canon EOS-1D

11/12/2008 02:40:45 PM · #8

I shoot in RGB and sometimes then convert it to the 1998 profile. It really saturates colors nicely. The 1998 profile in camera doesn't do it. It has to be a conversion in PS.

zeuszen

Canon EOS-1Ds Mark II

Canon EF 24-105mm f/4.0L IS

11/12/2008 02:44:05 PM · #9

Originally posted by cpanaioti:

Originally posted by jeger:
1. sRGB
2. Adobe RGB
3. sRGB

I am by no means an expert on the topic.

I have a question for you. Why shoot in sRGB if you're RAW conversion is in Adobe RGB?

This is my take:
I your final output (your printer) asks for Adobe RGB, well, comply.
Most uses cannot utilize the spectrum offered by this space. sRGB would be the appropriate (best) means to produce or render your image.

11/12/2008 02:46:14 PM · #10

Originally posted by Davenit:

I shoot in RGB and sometimes then convert it to the 1998 profile. It really saturates colors nicely. The 1998 profile in camera doesn't do it. It has to be a conversion in PS.

That's an interesting observation. sRGB is a narrower colourspace than AdobeRGB so converting from narrow to wide means that PS has to fill in the gaps somehow. To me that is leaving something up to chance (every image will saturate differently), but I like to control everything myself. ;o)

11/12/2008 02:47:31 PM · #11

I just tried:

(Imported through Bridge)

1. Adobe RGB
2. Adobe RGB (DPP then transfer not convert)
3. Adobe 1998 (Make edits to 16-bit TIFF with Monitor RGB on and proof colors off, resize, convert to 8-bit TIFF to do 8-bit filters, then save for web, converting to sRGB)

It appeared to stay consistent this way.

I'm going to try sRGB the whole way through and see if I can get the same consistency from program to program to web as I did with the Adobe RGB way. Tricky stuff I tell ya.

Simms

Canon EOS-5D Mark II

11/12/2008 02:58:07 PM · #12

Why worry about colorspace if shooting in RAW? I was under the impression that colourspace info wasnt applied to RAW files.

11/12/2008 03:12:49 PM · #13

Originally posted by Simms:

Why worry about colorspace if shooting in RAW? I was under the impression that colourspace info wasnt applied to RAW files.

I guess that's the next thing I need to learn a little more about. Is that adjustment solely for JPEG?

Nikon AF-S DX NIKKOR 18-200mm f/3.5-5.6G ED VR II

11/12/2008 03:26:18 PM · #14

Originally posted by Simms:

Why worry about colorspace if shooting in RAW? I was under the impression that colourspace info wasnt applied to RAW files.

In camera?

dacrazyrn

Nikon D300

11/12/2008 03:27:03 PM · #15

Originally posted by Simms:

Why worry about colorspace if shooting in RAW? I was under the impression that colourspace info wasnt applied to RAW files.

You are right, it is applied to in camera jpgs and nothing on the RAW, the ACR (adobe Camera RAW) workflow tags/converts it with your selected profile. It is good to have everything set across the board and you know what it is, in case you switch to a RAW +jpg in camera, or someone messes with your camera, etc

Message edited by author 2008-11-12 15:28:05.

Nikon AF-S DX NIKKOR 18-200mm f/3.5-5.6G ED VR II

11/12/2008 03:28:17 PM · #16

Some discussion on Luminous Landscape:

//luminous-landscape.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=19625

... and some on photo.net

//photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=590180

and some local discussion

//www.dpchallenge.com/forum.php?action=read&FORUM_THREAD_ID=362803&page=1#2236122

Message edited by author 2008-11-12 15:34:11.

dacrazyrn

Nikon D300

11/12/2008 03:41:42 PM · #17

Originally posted by goinskiing:

I just tried:
(Imported through Bridge)

Something to be aware of with the Bridge/Photo Downloader, especially if you convert to DNG. Be sure to click the OPTIONS button and Preserve/Imbed Original RAW file. I got my first blue with an 8.162 (would have been the 19th highest score on DPC) score, and had switched to using DNG 6 months prior. Didn't have that embedding the ORIGINAL RAW file within the DNG and got it disqualified. WHAAAAAAAAAAA!!! I am over it now...SORTA :)

Gordon

RIM BlackBerry Curve

Canon EF 85mm f/1.8 USM

11/12/2008 03:45:50 PM · #18

I don't care what I shoot in camera.

I typically convert in RAW converter to ProPhotoRGB and work in that space (but I don't do much in the way of manipulation)

Convert (not assign) to sRGB for web display.

Use whatever colourspace I need depending on the printer.

If you are seeing significant shifts in colour or saturation when converting between colourspaces, then you are doing something odd (as the whole point of conversion is to preserve the visual appearance, while changing the underlying numbers)

There are shifts you'll see around the edges of the colourspaces and some things that need to be managed, particularly when moving to a smaller colour space, but visible shifts across the board is a sign that something is different from the normal in your workflow.

As an example of a common problem, a lot of people see their AdobeRGB images look 'washed out' when they get assigned directly to sRGB, (which save for web does in the default configuration). If those images are converted to sRGB prior to saving for the web, the conversion is managed correctly.

Message edited by author 2008-11-12 15:46:15.

11/12/2008 03:50:00 PM · #19

Originally posted by Gordon:

So you're saying to convert to sRGB after your manipulations in x-colourspace and before you save for web. How does one switch to sRGB before saving to web using CS3 when in another colourspace?

I'm going in to make it straight across the board sRGB and see what I get.

Gordon

RIM BlackBerry Curve

Canon EF 85mm f/1.8 USM

11/12/2008 04:08:11 PM · #20

Originally posted by goinskiing:

So you're saying to convert to sRGB after your manipulations in x-colourspace and before you save for web. How does one switch to sRGB before saving to web using CS3 when in another colourspace?

Use Edit Menu... Convert To and pick sRGB. You shouldn't really see any significant colour shifts in this step.
You should also not see any significant change when you do the Save For Web or view the result in a browser.

=========

The behind the scenes reason for the problem is that Save for Web throws away the colour profile. Web browsers assume that anything they get is in an sRGB colourspace and so do the equivalent of an 'assign' to colour space, rather than converting the colour values correctly.

If you convert it to sRGB, prior to saving for the web, when the profile is thrown away, the colour values are already in an sRGB space, so get displayed correctly.

A few web browsers support images with attached profiles, but that makes the files bigger and Save For Web is all about making the file sizes smaller.

11/12/2008 04:20:44 PM · #21

Okay, that makes more sense.

I think I'm getting it narrowed down, maybe someone else has noticed this. I find one of my big issues is working sRGB with DPP on my .CR2 and then transferring to photoshop (sRGB), i notice quite a large color shift, especially after adjustments in DPP. Its almost like the two sRGB spaces are different between DPP and CS3 on my Mac.

I'm going to check converting in DPP to JPG with embedded ICC and then see how it reacts in CS3.

11/12/2008 04:35:08 PM · #22

Okay, here's what I am seeing visually with my last post:

The right is what I see in DPP (sRGB) after I make my adjustments. If I either covert to JPG with embedded ICC or transfer into CS3 (sRB 2.1), I get a color shift as seen on the left. Something just seems a tad off.

11/12/2008 04:56:53 PM · #23

Originally posted by goinskiing:

Okay, here's what I am seeing visually with my last post:

The right is what I see in DPP (sRGB) after I make my adjustments. If I either covert to JPG with embedded ICC or transfer into CS3 (sRB 2.1), I get a color shift as seen on the left. Something just seems a tad off.

I think you're using the wrong profile in CS3. From what you've stated it should be sRGB, not sRGB 2.1. Or is that a typo?

Also, on you're preferences, how do you deal with profile mismatches?

11/12/2008 05:06:35 PM · #24

These are the options I have so I'm not sure if I'm using the right one, maybe the e-sRGB?