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 05/15/2008 06:10:30 AM · #26
Thank you, Stan...and thank you, too, Tim. Stan, I found your testimony to be a loving tribute to your father's love...BOTH of them!
I think the nay-sayers don't have your interests at heart, only their own. This is a great place to share, IMHO. A peak into your heart and mind is beneficial to anyone. Those who are offended or "saddened" can just move on.
And may I say, "God bless you".


05/15/2008 07:06:16 AM · #27
Originally posted by timfythetoo:
I just shared my personal testimony with a group of people this weekend. Thats what Stans was here. He was not preaching, he was sharing. He was sharing his life story. We hear alot of people's testimonies here at DPC and in many forms - some may just be glimpses into a smaller period of time, others a longer. Many have nothing to do with God, some do. Most of us are aware that Stan is a Christian. He is vocal about his faith (go Stan). He has just now taken an opportunity to share where he is coming from, given people a proper background as to who he is and why he acts the way he does. I must say that the comments written in disdain for what he has done, how he was raised or what he believes truly saddens me. Wouldn't it have been easier to just pass by this thread and hit ignore rather than toss in a little hand grenade in hopes of causing some damage to the OP or those that may hold his view? Stans post may not have really put him in a different light to most people, but the responses posted here have had that impact for me.

What a way and a place to play Devil's Advocate!

I'm sure someone will go there for me, so I'll save you the trip.

I got no response to my query....I hope that I wasn't being lumped in with the people "taking a shot", yet I truly would love to know on what level that humans are all depraved sinners unless they're brought into a rigorous and unbending image created by man's interpretation ofr how it "should be" in order to achieve salvation and to be considered as being.......I don't even know how to express it the concept is so alien to me.

Aren't we all supposed to be God's children?

Aren't we all supposed to be "saved" 'cause Jesus ostensibluy died for our sins?

Yet even the most good, completely unspoiled, brand new child is a vile heathen sinner 'til they "see the light"?

I want no parts of that kind of thing.

My God is a kind, loving, compassionate, guiding influence who sees all of us as his good and decent children.

If one decides to take the path of evil, non-belief, Islam, Judaism, Hindu, apathy, or whatever, why is this just the normal course of man unless they ascribe to one particular path, so designated by one splinter of the population?

What if you're wrong, and someone else's path is right?

Wouldn't you have been better off trying to live a good Christian life, and tried to treat your fellow man as if they were all inherently good instead of as clueless, depraved sinners?

I don't believe God intends for any of you to tell me how to live or to decide that I am not as good as you unless I do it your way.

How arrogant!

I'll pray to my kind God for your misguided souls.

Why don't you tell me about how God does beauteous and kind things in your life rather than what a wretched excuse for a human that I am?

Show me some of the grace of God, like what I see in a family who loves me, or what He has allowed me to see through the lens of a camera?

Show me the smile on a newborn's face at the sight of its mother, don't show me the start of the life of a sinner.......surely that smile isn't a sign of anything other than the evidence of what is good and beautiful.....the miracle of life, how is that a bad thing?
 05/15/2008 07:26:59 AM · #28
Originally posted by togtog:
I just want to say that I love DPC and am glad I decided this time to become involved in the community and not worry about the challenges. I can't say anything useful about the OP but just wanted to say that I am glad DPC is not solid photography 24/7.

:)


Huh?

I can't believe my eyes!

eta:

I paid 25 dollars for 24/7 photography on this site. Not to be preached to by fanatics! Ask me if I will be giving 25 dollars to DPC next year?

fotofight
Eyefetch
And i'm sure there are others to choose from, and they're free to join.

Message edited by author 2008-05-15 08:05:42.
 05/15/2008 07:52:49 AM · #29
Good on you Stan, I applaud you for sharing your testimony here.

Praise the Lord.
 05/15/2008 08:00:15 AM · #30
Interesting thread. This is not a subject that I claim to have much knowledge on. That being said, I had a girlfriend once, many moons ago, that found her religion in a huge way. At first it was a wonderful thing she wanted to share with me, then it was something that she wanted me to understand, and then finally something she wanted me to be a part of. When I couldn't do that our relationship withered and died, and it was one of the hardest "break ups" I've ever been through because nobody did anything wrong. Something just changed.

Several years went by, and I would run into mutual friends and we would often comment on crazy Barbara and her antics at class, etc. It seems that when someone truly finds god, it is there DUTY to try and enlighten others about it. This is often not well received, such as in this thread.

Then one day I was home from college for Christmas break, and I got a call from Barbara asking me to go to midnight mass with her family who I truly adored. I accepted, and the following day she called and asked me to lunch. I was dreading the encounter because I knew that the subject would come up and I would feel uncomfortable and pressured. What happened was something very different. Barbara asked me honestly how I felt about god, and I answered just as honestly and told her that I didn't know. That I had NO IDEA. She told me that that was OK and asked if she could send me some thing from time to time, to which agreed.

She then told me something that I will never in my whole life forget. She told me that she had prayed for me every day, and that if there was one person whom she wished could find the joy that she had found, it would be me. That was a very powerful statement that I wholly believed. I felt ashamed that i had teased and ridiculed this person behind her back, when she truly had my best interests at heart.

She sent me the materials, and I read them with an open mind. They did not change me, and I did not change. I still don't know where I stand on the issue. Maybe she is right, maybe I am, or maybe we are both wrong. There is no way to answer the question. But I can say that the experience has had a profound impact on my life, and I will remember it always.

It's unusual, and MAYBE inappropriate for someone to post something like this in a photography forum, but it is in the "personal life" section after all. I have the feeling that the OP feels a duty to share these things, and truly believes that it is for the good of others. So rather than tear him (or others like him) down, I choose to let him live his life, and me mine.

I don't know many people here yet, and this thread won't have an impact on my feelings about them. I'll probably forget about it by the end of the day. Bust some of you know each other very well, as is obvious by the use of first names, etc. And I get the feeling that some relationships have changed for the worse, and all because of some internet thread. So while I recognize my right to free speech, I also recognize that I don't ALWAYS have to exercise it.
 05/15/2008 08:13:50 AM · #31
Originally posted by 777STAN:

People may not like many things about the person that I am and the way that I live my life, but I would like to think that a world that preaches "To thine own self, Be true!" (Shakespeare) would want to be true to its own admitted principles, and honor/respect me for doing just THAT! I am being true to myself, to my Dad, to my faith by being true to message once given to the saints that "Jesus is Salvation! There is no salvation in any other!"

Just exercising my First Amendment Rights to Free Speech (at least currently in the United States.)


I have struggled since first reading this thread about whether or not to reply. In the end I have decided I will and I just hope that the DPC community can understand what I am trying to say.

Stan, I appreciate your honesty and willingness to share your life with us. I won't offer up my personal thoughts/feelings about Faith/God/Religion but I will echo the words of timfythetoo.

Most people here on DPC know about the last few years of my life. I was going through a very troubled time when I joined this community and the last 3 years have continued to be full of difficult challenges that I have strugged and continue to struggle to get through.

When my world was flipped upside down I suddenly found myself sharing my story with anyone who asked...have you ever just politely asked someone how they are and then have them actually really tell you? Well, if you bumped into me that's exactly what I would, and still do, do. When someone showed me this quote I immediately realised this was exactly how I am...

âBe who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.â

I am sure that there are people on here who thought it highly inappropriate that I shared the loss of my wonderful partner with them.

I am sure there are people on here that continue to think I should shut up about my health problems.

But, there are also people who can relate to what I am saying and understand what I have gone through and continue to go through. Those people offer me support, understanding, kindness, love and an ear whenever I need one.

Those who don't want to read about my life have the choice not to read any thread I start. But, if they do read it they can then just move on and make no comment. Honesty and a certain level of openess can make many uncomfortable but I am allowed to share as much of my life with whoever I like...it's my life!

There will also be those people who say 'but it's got nothing to do with photography'. YOU ARE WRONG!

The events in my life that I have shared here on DPC have been a HUGE influence on my photography. In my profile you will see that I dedicate all my photography to Damian to keep his passion and love for photography alive. With my health troubles I have asked many questions here on DPC, most recently I found great answers to my questions about how to make the most of photography from my wheelchair and learnt that there are others on this site that have gone through similar health situations to me.

'What's your point?' I hear you all saying...

Well, Stan is doing exactly what I have done, he is sharing his own personal story and letting us see how he has become the person he is today. If you are offended by what he says, walk away, his story is for those who want to hear it....and there are people within this community that DO want to hear it!

From visiting Stan's profile it is also quite clear that his beliefs play an important role in his photography, so, to all those who want to say 'what has this got to do with photography?', thats your answer!

I feel that I am rambling a little so I am going to stop now and just hope this has made some sense...
 05/15/2008 08:24:31 AM · #32
.. it takes all kinds of people to make up the world..
05/15/2008 08:25:17 AM · #33
Originally posted by ralph:
.. it takes all kinds of people to make up the world..


Amen :P
 05/15/2008 08:26:48 AM · #34
Everytime I see the name 777STAN, my brain makes me think 666SATAN. I dont know why but that's where it goes.

Message edited by author 2008-05-15 08:27:39.
 05/15/2008 08:30:15 AM · #35
Originally posted by NikonJeb:
I don't believe God intends for any of you to tell me how to live or to decide that I am not as good as you unless I do it your way.

How arrogant!

I'll pray to my kind God for your misguided souls.

I may be mistaken but I don't believe I did tell you how to live. But thank you for pointing out that my soul is misguided. I always appreciate someone telling me that I am living wrong. Thank you for your prayers. I hope you appreciate mine as well.
 05/15/2008 08:38:58 AM · #36
If this post had been put in the right place to start off with, it wouldn't have garnered such negative replies. SATAN oops STAN wanted controversy and that's what he's getting. He knew this would happen. Right STAN? Now we and he have no choice but to let this run its course. I give it another 4 or 5 pages and then it'll die a quiet death. But the harm has been done and there's no way to remove that.

corrected spelling

Message edited by author 2008-05-15 09:30:44.
 05/15/2008 08:42:31 AM · #37
Thanks Stan.

As for the previous poster. Well. I'm sure many will pray for you. And whether or not you agree, He does have the right to say what he wants, and he didn't attack anyone doing it. Which is a lot less than I can say for you and many others in this thread.
 05/15/2008 09:04:21 AM · #38
All I can think of when I read this post is a post that Stan made earlier" And Quote"I am a creative writer who will use as many literary tools as necessary to achieve a chosen end.

He further went on to say , that basically, he was stating a passage to get a reaction and that he was the 'mental gymnastic teacher' of all of us here.

I put to you that he is doing so again.

05/15/2008 09:48:41 AM · #39
Originally posted by Jac:
If this post had been put in the right place to start off with, it wouldn't have garnered such negative replies. SATAN oops STAN wanted controversy and that's what he's getting. He knew this would happen. Right STAN? Now we and he have no choice but to let this run its course. I give it another 4 or 5 pages and then it'll die a quiet death. But the harm has been done and there's no way to remove that.

corrected spelling


i think you're getting a wee bit dramatic here but if the whole experience is so painful for you and you feel the need to call names and such you (and many of us) might be better off if you just made that exodus to one of the free sites now
 05/15/2008 10:28:44 AM · #40
Originally posted by Jac:
I paid 25 dollars for 24/7 photography on this site. Not to be preached to by fanatics! Ask me if I will be giving 25 dollars to DPC next year?


If you paid for 24/7 photography you should probably avoid reading the personal life section, and rant section. Also titles that say "this is who I am and why ... TO WHOM IT MAY CONCERN." I'm perfectly fine with you not reading the post, and with you completely disagreeing with the op's views, but you can't really complain about being preached at, when you could've just left the thread which would've been a lot easier. I don't understand why every post on this site can't just be respected, especially ones that aren't calling anybody out. Every thread that has any particular view ends up being moved to the rant section because people have no tolerance.

05/15/2008 10:29:39 AM · #41
When I posted my testimony, I returned to the blessings, joy, honor, and appropriate treatment of my childhood by parents who gave me the BEST GIFT a child can ever receive, the Love/Respect/Awe for the God of the Universe, and the Saviour of those who choose to accept His Help/Gift in order to be saved for all Time and all Eternity!

I am being consistent with my faith, even though I am still a terribly imperfect man who sins way more than I want to sin because I don't want to sin at all.

As I pushed the POST button, I said, "Okay, LORD! Here goes!" With that I willingly walked as Daniel into the lion's den, and Hananiah, Mishael, and Azariah into the firey furnace. Those three Hebrew young man who refused to bow to the statue of popularity in ancient Babylon (i.e. civil disobedience) made this statement to their detractors and I now repeat it to you, "The God whom we serve is able to deliver us from the burning firey furnace, but know this! Even if He chooses not to deliver us, we will still not bow to your statue!"

I know now that from the viewpoint of some, my words of this very post look like an attack, but it is no more nor less than a defense, standing my ground against the evils of uniformity.

(BTW4 the "Here-we-go-Again" crowd is a new wrinkle, the negative responses being heard here are so OLD! You might want to tell your "spirit-guides" to get some new material, too.)

Message edited by author 2008-05-15 10:31:10.
 05/15/2008 11:22:53 AM · #42
Originally posted by smardaz:
Originally posted by Jac:
If this post had been put in the right place to start off with, it wouldn't have garnered such negative replies. SATAN oops STAN wanted controversy and that's what he's getting. He knew this would happen. Right STAN? Now we and he have no choice but to let this run its course. I give it another 4 or 5 pages and then it'll die a quiet death. But the harm has been done and there's no way to remove that.

corrected spelling


i think you're getting a wee bit dramatic here but if the whole experience is so painful for you and you feel the need to call names and such you (and many of us) might be better off if you just made that exodus to one of the free sites now

That's a shitty thing to say. If you are so offended by "drive by comments" in this thread, what would you call this? Counselling members to move elsewhere is never good, no matter what your personal opinions of them are. You should reconsider before posting that kind of message.
 05/15/2008 11:24:07 AM · #43
Originally posted by 777STAN:
I willingly walked as Daniel into the lion's den, and Hananiah, Mishael, and Azariah into the firey furnace....

(...the negative responses being heard here are so OLD! You might want to tell your "spirit-guides" to get some new material, too.)

Laughably ironic given your ancient analogies.

Stan, while I understand your personal desire to "spread the Good Newsâ¢" I also recognize that rational adults do not suddenly discover spirituality in the words of a zealot, but in the wonder of life and nature, and nothing weakens faith more than those who seem to think their god needs human help to instill basic belief. It saddens me to find in this century people taught from birth to believe so fervently that belief itself literally consumes their lives, or worse, who learn to welcome death as a gateway to "real" life. People who can think of nothing but the next life contribute nothing to this one and form the volunteer pool for suicide belts. Life is short, and I will devote as much of my time as possible appreciating this world rather than worrying about any god that humans imagine as so petty and impotent that he can't get most of a single planet to even agree he exists while jealously damning those who worship a "nonexistent" competition-

"I prayed to the Lord Buddha, 'please save us from another cyclone. Not just me but all of Burma,'" said Min Min, a rickshaw driver, whose house was destroyed in Cyclone Nargis."
 05/15/2008 11:30:33 AM · #44
Originally posted by 777STAN:
(BTW4 the "Here-we-go-Again" crowd is a new wrinkle, the negative responses being heard here are so OLD!

What's old is your style in approacing your "faith", your admonishments to people you think of as lesser beings because they don't believe what you believe (irrespective of how you've rationalized this viewpoint), and your innately absurd conviction that all non-believers are merely stubborn Christians waiting to happen. Once again, Stan, you've managed to offend.

And, to those who think Stan has a right to open a post in a public forum and be free of criticism of all stripes simply because it concerns his religious beliefs, please be careful what you say in response to those who think Stan should have taken it to a more appropriate place. Pots and kettles.
 05/15/2008 12:06:58 PM · #45
Originally posted by NikonJeb:
I don't believe God intends for any of you to tell me how to live or to decide that I am not as good as you unless I do it your way.

How arrogant!

I'll pray to my kind God for your misguided souls.

Originally posted by timfythetoo:
I may be mistaken but I don't believe I did tell you how to live. But thank you for pointing out that my soul is misguided. I always appreciate someone telling me that I am living wrong. Thank you for your prayers. I hope you appreciate mine as well.

In the first place, I didn't say that YOU did, Tim, I was using the euphemistic "you" that would be those people who will, and with little or no provocation, tell me I'm living wrong because I don't live "The Right Way" as evidenced by their belief system.

That DOES make them misguided because nobody has ANY right to tell me how to live......well, my wife does, but that's a whole different discussion.

And my whole prayer comment was a little pointed and a lot tongue-in-cheek because praying for people that do not respect my individual faith, belief, and rights really pisses me off because I am not a great, forgiving man.

I am human, fallible, and though I do my best to live decently and compassionately, I don't much care for people who go after me in any way.

I have tried NOT to be argumentative, but I won't back away from genuinely questioning any belief system that involves hate, terrorism, guilt, and/or causing distress to another human being in the name of God, religion, or just plain living right.

And if what I say makes you uncomfortable, ask yourself is it me, or is it the questions YOU have that maybe I'm asking......which of course, are not being dealt with, merely dodged and ignored.

In my God's eyes, as I understand Him, I have *NO* right to tell you how to be, or that your way is not "The Way"......not that even on a human level I feel that way either.

I also can differentiate between what someone says, and them as a person.....just because I don't agree with one thing that you say, does NOT mean that I think everything you say is wrong, or misguided.......and I am fully aware that I may be wrong as well.

I very rarely deal in absolutes, I'm open, and enthusiatic to hear other points of view......but I want to back away, fast, from anyone who can't be as open, and consequently, reasonable to the possibility that they could be mistaken as well.

My point is, and what I really want to know, is why some people think that they HAVE to sway others to their line of thinking, or believing, at the complete expense of their credibility, and their individuality, and in some cases, sanity.

And to write it all off by making such a statement as, "Well, I'm doing God's work, so if I'm persecuted, it's okay because I'm doing the right thing.".

I'm sorry, but in my belief system that is just suicidal on many levels. I don't buy it. And i pretty much cancels out any chance of swaying my thinking when someone goes over the edge.....which is also, of course, a judgement call as well. It makes no sense to me to alienate the people that you'd like to see finding solace, faith, what have you.

I see too much grace and beauty that is to me evidence of God, I see too much heartache and misery at the hand of man....I choose to believe in the fundamental good of God's world, not the shitty things than man does to one another.

So when I see evidence of God's grace, which I do all around me, I have no problem distinguishing that from some loudmouth who is trying to tell me to send him all my money for MY salvation because he's God's emissary.

And just because he's not asking for money doesn't make him any better.....in a way that televangelist is at least honest that he's trying to "sell" me salvation.

I guess I just want to know why so many can't just respect each other's faith and beliefs and let God take care of the rest.

I've made a bunch of bad decisions, exercised abysmal judgement, lived hedonistically, thought only of myself, and in general been a foul, heathen slut for much of my time here......evidence of man's ability, my own in particular, to exercise his own will and be a "sinner"....or just make himself miserable and self-centered.

My God has, for whatever reason, maybe because He's compassionate and kind, allowed me a little clarity, and the chance to do something with the time I have left.

He's also allowing me to attempt to find a path towards Him without telling me how to be, but allowing me to choose to try and live as a decent man. Guidance is there, but I must do the work to strive for it.

I hope that in your way, once again the euphemistic "you", can find peace, inspiration, and guidance in whatever way you believe.
 05/15/2008 01:10:11 PM · #46
Hey Jeb - I took it as directed towards me as the only thing that was quoted was my post.
 05/15/2008 02:22:49 PM · #47
Originally posted by STAN777:
I know now that my doubts have always been about the quality of my faith, NEVER AND I MEAN NEVER about the quality of my Saviour!


This makes your religion very unattractive to me. There are other religions that allow people to doubt.

It's too bad, because I'm pretty sure that this FAITH/DOUBT stuff was superimposed on the actual teachings of Jesus a hundred years after the fact. Jesus Himself seemed much more concerned with morality. When he did talk about faith, it was the size of a mustard seed, not something that had to be rigorously maintained 24 hours a day.
 05/15/2008 03:05:59 PM · #48
Originally posted by timfythetoo:
Hey Jeb - I took it as directed towards me as the only thing that was quoted was my post.

Sorry....it happens a lot in my ramblings that I wander down many rabbit holes....8>)
 05/15/2008 03:16:38 PM · #49
Originally posted by posthumous:
When he did talk about faith, it was the size of a mustard seed, not something that had to be rigorously maintained 24 hours a day.


!exactly, i and many other remember it this way .. and not as something with CAPITAL and BOLD wording/lettering ...

05/15/2008 04:02:59 PM · #50
Originally posted by smardaz:
Originally posted by LanndonKane:
Yeah, my car had problems last week but it turned out to be loose wiring.


quite a few rude and uncalled for comments, but i had to laugh at this as it was so random.

But seriously if anyone just wants to make a comment that is rude/sarcastic just for the sake of being so, why bother?


Becuase i'm a smard az
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