Bob's Most Underrated 'Nostalgia' Award...

09/17/2003 07:30:26 AM · #1

This is the Bob's Most Underrated 'Nostalgia' Award... the ORIGINAL underrated award, all others are IMITATORS, beware!!! ;-)
As always, worked out by looking at the lowest scoring picture I gave an 8 to.
This challenge, the honour goes to:

Nostalgia On The Wall
by carsten
140th place with an
average vote of 4.961

Maybe it could have done with more sharpening, but there's nothing wrong with the focus straight out of the camera. Maybe we are used to seeing oversharpened pictures here, and I know I'm a culprit.
The hues and saturations are what makes this photo stand out for me... the colour of the wood is gorgeous and the objects are beautifully saturated without looking over the top.
There's something about the love and care that has gone into arranging this cupboard of assorted china, toys and ornaments that is the most interesting thing in this picture. The fact that we are being presented with a photo in an artistic challenge of these items in a beautiful wooden environment gives a delicious post-modern feel to this artwork.

09/17/2003 07:43:07 AM · #2

I just made a version of this photo which I applied USM to, I hope carsten doesn't mind... please let me know if you want me to delete this off my system.
This should show there was NOTHING wrong with the way the photo was taken.

USM applied.

Message edited by author 2003-09-17 07:44:42.

joshua

Canon EOS-500D Rebel T1i

Canon EF 50mm f/1.8 II

09/17/2003 08:06:13 AM · #3

that certainly is a great improvement

09/17/2003 08:12:19 AM · #4

Originally posted by achiral:

that certainly is a great improvement

I think I prefer the original though...

glimpses

Sony DSC-F707

09/17/2003 09:10:47 AM · #5

Originally posted by BobsterLobster:

Originally posted by achiral:
that certainly is a great improvement

I think I prefer the original though...

That's a major mistery to me, Bob..

If you prefer the original, why did you modify it AND post the modification online?????

Canon EF-S 17-85mm f/4-5.6 IS USM

09/17/2003 09:31:02 AM · #6

Originally posted by glimpses:

That's a major mistery to me, Bob..

If you prefer the original, why did you modify it AND post the modification online?????

I thought that was obvious...
many people scored it down because it wasn't in focus. Some people thought it was because the photo was taken badly.
I wanted to show that there was nothing wrong with the photo, and with some sharpening it could look as sharp as any other photo on the site.
I thought it would benefit people to realise the original was not out of focus.

ps, could you throw any more question marks in there??????????!!!!!

Message edited by author 2003-09-17 09:31:52.

Imagineer

Canon EOS-5D Mark II

09/17/2003 09:49:47 AM · #7

That was a great take on the challenge. Utterly unjust result. Just goes to show...

Your USM would have improved it though Bob - it's the little things sometimes that can tip the balance. Personally, I think my shot should have won - but hey - who am I to judge? ;D

09/17/2003 09:54:44 AM · #8

I think that, based on threads like this, you should post how you voted on all the challenge photos before the challenge is over so we will know how we should have voted the images.

09/17/2003 09:56:29 AM · #9

Originally posted by jmsetzler:

I think that, based on threads like this, you should post how you voted on all the challenge photos before the challenge is over so we will know how we should have voted the images.

I'm sorry?!
Have I offended you?

I can't see what on earth prompted this attack.

09/17/2003 09:59:29 AM · #10

Originally posted by BobsterLobster:

Originally posted by jmsetzler:
I think that, based on threads like this, you should post how you voted on all the challenge photos before the challenge is over so we will know how we should have voted the images.

I'm sorry?!
Have I offended you?

I can't see what on earth prompted this attack.

It's not you. It's the concept.

09/17/2003 10:00:25 AM · #11

It was my concept.

09/17/2003 10:01:50 AM · #12

Originally posted by BobsterLobster:

It was my concept.

There are about 3 other threads going on the same idea.

09/17/2003 10:01:58 AM · #13

I should add that my concept was to highlight a photo that in my opinion had gone unrecognised. The idea came after many threads in which people were complaining that their photos had done badly and deserved better. I believed I was responding in a positive way to a need. I feel this is a good and generous concept. Please explain your problem with it.

glimpses

Sony DSC-F707

09/17/2003 10:02:30 AM · #14

Originally posted by BobsterLobster:

Sorry Bob, but let me disagree... it became in focus AFTER you applied USM.

Last night I reposted my same picture on "Life" just after reading the article about USM which was posted here.

I tried three different kind of USM techniques and, while two introduced noise, one (the lighter one) was IMO a clear improvement.

Basically, don't you see that you are asking the viewer to judge a pic based on how it would look ok AFTER applying USM to it?

I mean.. if you give it a second tought, you will realize that is not so natural, is it?

And I avoided more marks because: I used them in the first place because I was really surprised. Now I understand that you didn't really get my point like I did not get yours before.

09/17/2003 10:03:01 AM · #15

Sorry to harp on, but I believe I was the first person to start with this concept of singling out an underrated photo per challenge... which is why I couldn't understand why you attacked this particular thread first.

Message edited by author 2003-09-17 10:03:25.

09/17/2003 10:04:31 AM · #16

Originally posted by BobsterLobster:

I cannot explain myself. It would be pointless. However, I feel that 'underrated' is the wrong term to use and i'll leave it at that :)

Sigma 18-125mm f/3.5-5.6 DC for Canon

09/17/2003 10:06:56 AM · #17

Originally posted by glimpses:

Originally posted by BobsterLobster:

I thought that was obvious...
many people scored it down because it wasn't in focus. Some people thought it was because the photo was taken badly.
I wanted to show that there was nothing wrong with the photo, and with some sharpening it could look as sharp as any other photo on the site.
I thought it would benefit people to realise the original was not out of focus.

ps, could you throw any more question marks in there??????????!!!!!

Sorry Bob, but let me disagree... it became in focus AFTER you applied USM.

Last night I reposted my same picture on "Life" just after reading the article about USM which was posted here.

I tried three different kind of USM techniques and, while two introduced noise, one (the lighter one) was IMO a clear improvement.

Basically, don't you see that you are asking the viewer to judge a pic based on how it would look ok AFTER applying USM to it?

I mean.. if you give it a second tought, you will realize that is not so natural, is it?

And I avoided more marks because: I used them in the first place because I was really surprised. Now I understand that you didn't really get my point like I did not get yours before.

I'm not expecting people to vote on it as if USM had been applied. I'm saying that maybe people are used to a lot of sharpening. I don't think lots of sharpening suited this shot particularly. I merely speculated that perhaps people automatically voted it down without thinking because it didn't conform to the usual amount of sharpening. And I will stop defending this picture now, and leave the whole underrated concept which people seem to have had enough of.

Kavey

Canon EOS-400D Rebel XTi

09/17/2003 10:19:02 AM · #18

Originally posted by jmsetzler:

Originally posted by BobsterLobster:
Sorry to harp on, but I believe I was the first person to start with this concept of singling out an underrated photo per challenge... which is why I couldn't understand why you attacked this particular thread first.

I cannot explain myself. It would be pointless. However, I feel that 'underrated' is the wrong term to use and i'll leave it at that :)

I'll give it a go, though I certainly don't want my words construed as an attack. They aren't. They are my opinion.

I really like the idea of using the forums to draw attention to images that one or more of us particularly like or identify with. I quite often join in with threads which seek to highlight photos that have touched people in this way.

What I dislike is the suggestion that a given image has not received the mark it "deserved".

To me this communicates that the individual who is posting (to tell us that an image has not received the result that it deserves) thinks that their evaluation of the entries is somehow more valid than anyone else's.

This all centres around what we think of when we talk about "deserve".

To me an entry deserves to rank highly only if it appeals strongly to a very broad range of voters. It deserves to win only if the majority of voters (whether they be harsh, generous, strictly literal according to challenge or highly artistic and open to all interpretations) think so. Because all the ranking actually is, after all, is a list according to the average vote received by an image.

What these threads seem to imply is that some people believe an entry deserves to win just because it is their personal favourite.

And that's where the problem I have with this comes into play. Why would anyone think that their opinion is more valid than the opinion shown by the actual results?

So it's all down to the semantics, for me.

If someone says, "here, look at these images, I liked them a great deal for xyz reasons and was surprised that the general voting public didn't agree/ didn't rate them more highly" then I'm cool with that.

If someone says, "The voters were wrong, the results were unjust, this image should have rated more highly/ scored a ribbon" I'm not so cool with it.

I can't speak for John but would be curious to know if that articulates his feelings on it also.

Kavey

Message edited by author 2003-09-17 10:23:03.

Sigma 18-125mm f/3.5-5.6 DC for Canon

09/17/2003 10:22:45 AM · #19

KV, thats on target for sure. I just didn't feel like explaining myself today :)

Kavey

Canon EOS-400D Rebel XTi

09/17/2003 10:23:51 AM · #20

:D Sure thing.
I'm having a day off work so... I had time to kill...

Sigma 18-125mm f/3.5-5.6 DC for Canon

09/17/2003 10:25:23 AM · #21

Wow, thanks for taking the time to explain your feelings Kavey,
I'd like to reply to some of those points...
Firstly, that's why these threads have always been called 'BOB'S most underrated...'. That way, I'm saying that these shots are underrated in MY opinion, and not that everybody has been wrong.
Like I said before, some people are upset when they feel their photo hasn't received a score they 'deserved', and so my threads were an effort to make at least one person per challenge feel better about a photo which IN MY OPINION should have done better.
So I'm not saying my opinion is better that anyone else's,
but I feel I have a right to express that opinion without being attacked,
and if it makes someone feel better, then I really stand behind my right to self-expression.
After all, I've seen an awful lot of flags here recently,
isn't this what it's all about?! ;-)

Kavey

Canon EOS-400D Rebel XTi

09/17/2003 10:27:57 AM · #22

Bob, you're welcome. And actually, I don't generally have a problem with the way you highlight images because you don't harp on about voters not voting fairly or voters being blind, you just tell us why you liked the shot. I still take (very minor) issue with the use of the word "underrated" which does imply (to me) that you feel others should also have rated the image more highly but I don't find the way you post offensive in any way.

Some of the other threads "like" this are quite different in nature and seem not only to be putting forward a picture the poster likes but also berating other voters for not recognising what they feel is the best image.

Message edited by author 2003-09-17 10:28:35.

09/17/2003 11:48:02 AM · #23

Originally posted by jmsetzler:

I think that, based on threads like this, you should post how you voted on all the challenge photos before the challenge is over so we will know how we should have voted the images.

I cannot believe what I'm seeing. After all the comments in the other thread and the above attack, we now have a Setzler's Favorite: Nostalgia thread.
I'm speechless.