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10/15/2002 06:19:34 PM · #26 |
since this thread is like talking in circles ... let me add my loop into it too - hehehe
I think titles are important - but they should not over power the photograph ... a photograph should be able to stand by itself and the title should compliment it.
:) - that's my story and i'm sticking to it :)
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10/15/2002 06:23:48 PM · #27 |
Continue with Gordon's point, here's one:
Harlequin with Violin
DPc's typical comment:
"Where's the violin? 3"
"I don't get it"
"This is so offensive"
"duh"
A title can be anything. Be it one word or 30 words. It can reveal as much as it wants, or none. In this painting, the title reveals ALL but the viewer has problems seeing it.
Does this mean:
1. The title sucks cuz the viewers can't see it from the painting
2. The painting sucks cuz the viewers can't see the relevance from the title
3. The typical viewer lack the mental capacity to see it.
???? If you say #3, DPc viewers will say you're an elitist. :)
* This message has been edited by the author on 10/15/2002 6:24:44 PM.
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10/15/2002 06:29:33 PM · #28 |
<final thoughts>
i started writing this a while ago, but had to jump back into the fray a couple times
anyway, back in the Corporate Challenge, i was ripped a new one on a number of occasions for an entry that would "fail the challenge" were it not for the title
i had to agree with them - as good as I thought the pic was, it did have that shortcoming - so i kept my mouth shut, and accepted the barrage of 1's
others were not silent, and the threads of "titles vs challenge" sprang up here and there --- and as memory serves (and it could be mistaken), 95% of the postings saw nothing wrong with, if not out-right endorsing the policy of, voting down entries that couldn't stand on the merits of the photo alone - without assistance of the title
now however, i detect an almost 180 degree turn in opinion -- and why?
probably because, at my count, there are 74 entries (1 short of HALF the total) that contain the explicit name of a sin in the title
maybe i was asleep when the sentiment shifted ...
<outa here>
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10/15/2002 07:04:52 PM · #29 |
My thoughts on this issue:
1) I much prefer titles that don't tell you what to see too explicitly.
2) I greatly fear that if I don't tell you what to see explicitly then you wont "get it".
In a gallery it simply wouldn't be an issue. However, here we look at hundreds of photos a day. Like it or not titles are a way to give the time-limied voters a shortcut into understanding what you were trying to achieve.
I don't like it but there it is.
John |
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10/15/2002 07:34:48 PM · #30 |
| I have no problem with titles that help the picture to fit the challenge as long as the picture does fit. I do have a problem when it is only the title that fits the challenge. |
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10/15/2002 07:39:22 PM · #31 |
I have gotten the comment that my title doesn't fit the challenge :)
hehehehehe
Originally posted by Gina Rothfels:
I have no problem with titles that help the picture to fit the challenge [i]as long as the picture does fit. I do have a problem when it is only the title that fits the challenge.[/i]
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10/15/2002 07:52:50 PM · #32 |
In my original post , I was not saying that a title should be one word or two, I am just saying that there is limits .. weel not limits ... but
if we think (and personnaly I do not) that the viewers would need some details .. then make the details viewable.
The title should give clues , if you need to, but the title should not in my opinion explain the picture.
Sonifo : "That is stupid. Really it is, because there are some of us who for some reason wasn't given your talent. "
Well if that was for me ... THANK YOU !!!!!
Sonifo : "Sometimes I am just clueless". that's fine ... I am not saying I am giving good titles to mines, I am saying that titles like "This woman is called monalisa and if you look at her eyes .. there is something special" are not good (I know I am taking an extreme).
Sonifo: "Come on, Get off your high horse and stop being so judgemently about every nit picking thing." I wish I had a horse ;-)
Sonifo: "I do not judge the photo and the title together, this is a photography contest not a title contest! ".
I am not saying I judge the tile , I judge the picture. I am saying that if people misunderstand my picture because people do not understand it .. well I have to live with it.
When I said "A title should not be an 'advertising' description", I meant that you should not try to 'sell' your picture with the title. Support it yes, sell it no.
And by the way ... I was not talking about any specific title in a specific challenge, I was talking globally.
Gordon : "Dali's Christ of St John On the Cross
7 word title - does that make it bad ???? "
No not at all.
Gordon : "But I also find the assumption that every picture should not have any text to support it or its a bad picture' idea pretty stupid too."
Yes (even if I would have said it differently)
Alecia : "agreed. funny example. i also agree that a title shouldn't save a picture, but a nice relevant title is the icing on the cake. "
Yes definitly.
Sonia, I do not think that you understood what I was saying and maybe you took it a little too personally.
And I am not sure we have to use the word stupid when we disagree ...
but that's only me (Am I borowing someone else 'signature quote' ?)
I felt pretty chatty tonight .. my post are not usually that long.
Lionel
_______________________________________________
"If a post needs a content, then it's probably not a good post"
* This message has been edited by the author on 10/15/2002 7:52:10 PM.
* This message has been edited by the author on 10/15/2002 7:52:59 PM. |
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10/15/2002 08:12:43 PM · #33 |
Originally posted by lionelm:
but that's only me (Am I borowing someone else 'signature quote' ?)
Lionel
LoL... Feel free :) I'm sure I stole it from someone else :)
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10/15/2002 08:29:43 PM · #34 |
Originally posted by myqyl:
Originally posted by lionelm:
[i]but that's only me (Am I borowing someone else 'signature quote' ?)
Lionel
LoL... Feel free :) I'm sure I stole it from someone else :)
[/i]
I thought about you .. but I looked in that thread ... and your signature was not in your previous post .... he he he .... you did that on purpose right ? ;-)
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10/16/2002 10:08:41 AM · #35 |
Another thought on this: Titles can change the entire meaning of a
picture. But so can the challenge it was submitted for, even with the
same title:
Compare/ contrast the 'One Word' bible picture in the Garbage challenge
and the 'Cure for the seven deadly sins' bible picture in the Sins
challenge. Both pretty much show exactly the same thing, in a similar
context (give or take some technique, composition and lighting). The
titles are both equally unoffensive but the challenge context totally
changes the meaning. |
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10/16/2002 10:45:33 AM · #36 |
That would only happen on here because of the "challenge topic". If the photo was displayed in a gallery or by itself, then the only one with easily understood title would be the "Cure for the ...", which has a nice title but a boring shot.
Originally posted by Gordon:
Another thought on this: Titles can change the entire meaning of a
picture. But so can the challenge it was submitted for, even with the
same title:
Compare/ contrast the 'One Word' bible picture in the Garbage challenge
and the 'Cure for the seven deadly sins' bible picture in the Sins
challenge. Both pretty much show exactly the same thing, in a similar
context (give or take some technique, composition and lighting). The
titles are both equally unoffensive but the challenge context totally
changes the meaning.
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10/16/2002 11:13:48 AM · #37 |
I disagree. I think both are 'easily' understood :P. They just mean different things.
Originally posted by paganini:
[i] If the photo was displayed in a gallery or by itself, then the only one with easily understood title would be the "Cure for the ...", which has a nice title but a boring shot.
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10/16/2002 11:15:20 AM · #38 |
Could you tell from the "One Word" submission that it is a criticism of religion easily without the context of "Garbage submission?" I doubt it.
Originally posted by magnetic9999:
I disagree. I think both are 'easily' understood :P. They just mean different things.
Originally posted by paganini:
[i] If the photo was displayed in a gallery or by itself, then the only one with easily understood title would be the "Cure for the ...", which has a nice title but a boring shot.
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10/16/2002 11:19:09 AM · #39 |
Oh ok. Yes, that I do agree with. I would not have known that the title was sarcastic without some additional context.
Originally posted by paganini:
Could you tell from the "One Word" submission that it is a criticism of religion easily without the context of "Garbage submission?" I doubt it.
Originally posted by magnetic9999:
[i]I disagree. I think both are 'easily' understood :P. They just mean different things.
Originally posted by paganini:
[i] If the photo was displayed in a gallery or by itself, then the only one with easily understood title would be the "Cure for the ...", which has a nice title but a boring shot.
[/i]
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10/16/2002 11:35:55 AM · #40 |
Titles can be important, but they don't have to be. Generally for me, shorter titles are better (so I can remember them a little better). My last photo was not very good as you all affirmed for me. I gave it a real silly title and twenty percent of my comments made mention of my clever title (1 out of all 5 of them). I like to put little cliches in there or something reasonably clever, especially if it's a relatively unappealing picture. Someone stole MY title for the title of a movie it was so darn clever. I saw an ad for "Ghost Ship" a couple days after the reflection challenge was over which struck quite a chord. I figured, "heck it was so popular they made a movie about it."
I'm expecting a royalty check any day now. |
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10/16/2002 11:44:09 AM · #41 |
Originally posted by magnetic9999:
good lord.
title and image work together in synergy.
the title helps to provide the context. the image provides the substance.
some images may have a context that's not apparent without the descriptor. that doesn't make them necessarily poorer photographs.
humans are both visual and beings of language.
trying to narow a scope to include only one or the other is somewhat arbitrary.
These wise words were spoken WAY up in the thread. Oh, I forgot - this is dpc where Argument Is The Essence. Sometimes I wonder whether the d in dpc stands for diarrhea.
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10/16/2002 11:49:53 AM · #42 |
Originally posted by Journey:
These wise words were spoken WAY up in the thread. Oh, I forgot - this is dpc where Argument Is The Essence. Sometimes I wonder whether the d in dpc stands for diarrhea.
Why do you wonder that ? Is that what you normally take pictures of ??
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10/16/2002 11:52:15 AM · #43 |
Thanks, J.
Sometimes I wonder if someone cast an invisibility spell on my posts : ).
Or maybe it's just that people don't want to listen to reason and love to hear them selves blah blah blah, whereas i usually get right to the point ...
*sigh* maybe succinctness is getting obsolete. . . i should be more combative : ) ...
Originally posted by Journey:
Originally posted by magnetic9999:
[i]good lord.
title and image work together in synergy.
the title helps to provide the context. the image provides the substance.
some images may have a context that's not apparent without the descriptor. that doesn't make them necessarily poorer photographs.
humans are both visual and beings of language.
trying to narow a scope to include only one or the other is somewhat arbitrary.
These wise words were spoken WAY up in the thread. Oh, I forgot - this is dpc where Argument Is The Essence. Sometimes I wonder whether the d in dpc stands for diarrhea.
[/i]
* This message has been edited by the author on 10/16/2002 12:14:03 PM. |
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10/16/2002 12:16:17 PM · #44 |
Originally posted by Gordon:
Why do you wonder that ? Is that what you normally take pictures of ??
Hey, thanks Gordon, you just gave me an idea for this week's challenge. Since we are talking titles here, would "This is no BS" be a good title?
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10/16/2002 12:19:08 PM · #45 |
Originally posted by Journey:
Originally posted by Gordon:
[i]
Why do you wonder that ? Is that what you normally take pictures of ??
Hey, thanks Gordon, you just gave me an idea for this week's challenge.
[/i]
You are most very welcome
Since we are talking titles here, would "This is no BS" be a good title?
Or 'BBS or BS?' for the older techy people in the audience
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