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05/08/2003 12:16:26 PM · #26 |
Note: Matrix...opps what I mean is Wesak day is on the 15 of May.
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05/08/2003 12:20:04 PM · #27 |
Originally posted by Jacko:
I'm a Roman Catholic; non practising. Most of our objects are boring, but some other Religions like Buddhism and Hinduism have pretty funky stuff. However, I'd have a hard time finding any of those in small town Eastern Canada where I live.
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Jacko, it doesn't have to be YOUR religion. I'm officially Catholic, but have not set foot in a church in MANY years. Still i love shooting things like this.
ps. I am also a follower of your new religion. "Beer, helping ugly people have sex since 3000 B.C." Now that's a religion!
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05/08/2003 12:27:21 PM · #28 |
fair enough.
Message edited by author 2003-05-08 13:48:57.
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05/08/2003 01:10:45 PM · #29 |
Mavrik, you made many good points in your post and i know that i should evaluate such pictures on their technical and artistic merits only. But i can't! I can't because i relate to images on an emotional level. And the message given is part of the overall image that invokes my response. My own feelings about institutionalized religion are rather cynical and, call me narrow-minded, that view will creep into my appraisal of the pictures.
Let me give an example that has nothing to do with religion. Whenever i see movie clips of Leni Reifenstahl who made those propaganda movies for Hitler (such as the big Neurenberg (?) rally and the 1936 Olympics) i get the total creeps. Why? Because she was such a great artist who was also a nazi opportunist and just because she had so much talent she managed to portray this horrible era in a glorious, heroic light. My mind cannot divorce the message from the art and revolts. Do you understand that?
Another example: i think Mapplethorpe was a great artist. Some of his images i rather don't see though.
I believe that a religion challenge would be a bad idea.
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05/08/2003 01:15:36 PM · #30 |
Emotional responses guide my voting quite a bit also. Photos that strike a good emotional repsonse from me score better than ones that don't. I think this is normal. There is nothing wrong with letting emotions guide your voting.
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05/08/2003 01:55:10 PM · #31 |
What if we simply had a 'Faith' challenge? Photograph examples where we exhibit our confidence or trust in a person or thing without actually having proof of the outcome. There would be many examples of this, outside of religion, that we could all draw from. i.e. A parachute, a doctor, your barber, etc.
Message edited by author 2003-05-08 13:55:50.
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05/08/2003 02:04:20 PM · #32 |
I have a friend whose middle name is "Zenjiro", but we all just call him Zen, would he count?
Originally posted by magnetic9999:
i think we should all do a picture of something and call it "..Zen"
;D |
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05/08/2003 02:06:01 PM · #33 |
Offensive to you, but interpretation of a religion neverthless. I could expressing the simple fact that throughout the ages men have been using Christianity to do pretty evil things. And i'll bet if you ask Hitler if he thinks he's a Christian, he'll probably tell you he is.
I can also display a Nazi flag in front of a Hindu God and call it "The New World Order", as it is an interpretation of Himmler himself -- who was actually very interested in Hinduism because of the caste structure -- the Germans would of course be the Man-Gods or the "PRiests" in the Hindu structure and anyone outside of Western Europe would be considered as "Untouchables". Himmler likes it because he feels the religion fits in the way of the Third Reich. But i'll bet people will find that to be offensive.
This is why a religion challenge would be a bad idea.
Originally posted by OneSweetSin:
Originally posted by paganini:
If magnetic999 takes a photo and call it Zen, i guess i'll have to sneak my way into a local KKK rally and take photos of hooded guys with burning crosses and call it Christian Men Meditation :) |
Now that is what could be very offensive. |
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05/08/2003 02:13:45 PM · #34 |
| Not bad, only two pages on relgion before Godwin's Law should be invoked. |
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05/08/2003 02:16:32 PM · #35 |
Yes... Godwin's law should now be put into effect... lol .. where is CJ?
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05/08/2003 02:31:37 PM · #36 |
You all beat me to it. Godwin's Law has indeed been invoked.
-Terry
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05/08/2003 03:00:59 PM · #37 |
Originally posted by ClubJuggle:
You all beat me to it. Godwin's Law has indeed been invoked.
-Terry |
LOL I didn't say make that reference!
=o) Now for my true comment on religion taken from the movie "Bull Durham" "Baseball is like religion"...go ahead make that the subject for a challenge and I swear I will do a direct quote from that movie for the title, and my photo will be a baseball photo for the challenge. I believe the comment made went something like this... "There are 109 beads on the rosary and 109 games in the average season..." Yeap there you have it, if the challenge is religion my religion is baseball. |
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05/08/2003 03:52:36 PM · #38 |
Mavrik, just noted that your post was severely edited, to put it mildly. There was lots of wisdom in your post and i enjoyed the debate. All i meant to say was that i can't look at pictures with total objectivity, like a robot. Hope i didn't offend you.
Look, yesterday we were discussing the bias of dpc voters against dark images, soft images, and also B&W. Now, you also want them to look without any religious bias. Dreamer ! :)
In a previous post, i stated that i respond emotionally to any message. Actually, thus far at dpc there have been very few that really aimed to bring a message.
I do recall, however, that one picture in particular ticked me off. Don't remember the challenge but the image was of a woman crawling naked on all fours in some sort of a cage. I gave it a 1 and a nasty comment and didn't bother to really look whether the image had any merit otherwise. I didn't care!
A religion challenge might well invite similar reactions or that i end up trying to vote on two favorite pictures one of which i love the artisticity but hate the message and another where i love the message but find the shot mediocre. Just don't want to vote on a challenge that would contain that many dilemmas.
And if you go the baseball=my religion route, which may be a convenient cop out, then the strong believers in our midst will feel you trivialize their faith.
Conclusion: with a religion challenge, we will have not only endless rants, very nasty comments but also a WAR ! No ! No ! No ! :) |
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05/08/2003 03:55:46 PM · #39 |
Originally posted by Journey:
Conclusion: with a religion challenge, we will have not only endless rants, very nasty comments but also a WAR ! No ! No ! No ! :) |
Just like real life... |
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05/08/2003 04:05:27 PM · #40 |
Originally posted by GeneralE:
Originally posted by Journey:
Conclusion: with a religion challenge, we will have not only endless rants, very nasty comments but also a WAR ! No ! No ! No ! :) |
Just like real life... |
AMEN...for a lack of better words! I have been trying to say this all day long here. |
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05/08/2003 07:20:03 PM · #41 |
Personally, I would look forward to the entries by all you devil worshipers out there. ;)
Message edited by author 2003-05-08 19:20:50.
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05/08/2003 08:22:31 PM · #42 |
I don't care which religion it is,just a beautiful architectural piece!
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05/08/2003 08:38:28 PM · #43 |
Originally posted by OneSweetSin:
This is such a touchy subject that I think maybe the subject should be very loosely defined allowing photos of places of worship as well as artifacts and idol type things.
I really don't think this is actually that good of an idea cause there is such a diversified group here, and what a Christian would photograph would might be offensive to a Buddist and vice versa.
There are two things that should not be discussed in the workplace...RELIGION and POLITICS, and even though this is not a work place I have learned that it follows through here. Religion doesn't belong somewhere where the opinions differ as much as they do here. |
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05/08/2003 08:45:54 PM · #44 |
I couldn't see this as a challenge. How could it when so many people can't take a little fake blood be able to take viewing images of things that might go against their whole way of life and score them objectively? If it does become a challenge I'm going to love to see the scores. Definitely be the lowest scoring challenge yet.
Message edited by author 2003-05-08 20:49:15. |
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05/08/2003 08:53:54 PM · #45 |
Nah, a Canada vs US hockey game....... not there's controversy for you
And just to stir the pot, what about a Vancouver / Ottawa Stanley Cup final?
Message edited by author 2003-05-08 20:58:36.
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05/08/2003 08:55:04 PM · #46 |
I think people are more afraid of trying to create an emotive photo than the actual concept of it being a religion theme...
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05/08/2003 09:47:28 PM · #47 |
i think what people are afraid of are images that are
a) critical
and/or
b) "blasphemous"
witness one person's reaction to a pleasant and positive picture that is actually a tribute to a philosophy that i and my wife personally identify with. i did no more than identify that philosophy by name in the picture, ie my 'circle of zen', yet that was enough to arouse the vehement outcry of apparently one person (admittedly some kind of oversensitive outlier - the comments can be read on the image page itself).
multiply that by 100 though if you start posting images criticising christianity or islam, though, and you start to see the implications.
if we can't even take a pretty picture of a statue or artifact in the name of a religion or philosophy we even endorse, there's no WAY we can take pictures that make any kind of negative or ironic statement. :)
thoughts?
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05/08/2003 10:17:09 PM · #48 |
I have found that when I take offense at something, if I step back and look at it as objectively as possible, I find that I have taken offense because there was some truth in it, and that truth "hurts."
I, for one, would love to see a challenge on religion/faith. I think it would be interesting to see how everyone depicts it.
And the forums?? Woohoo. Talk about lively!!!
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05/08/2003 10:26:08 PM · #49 |
This is a decent example of not being able to see the photograph because of what is in it.
Anytime you choose a subject that is centered around issues like this, several things are gonna happen...
1 - you will see some extremely emotive and well executed images
2 - you will see some images designed to create controversy.
3 - you will have people (as seen before) that create their own controversy when none exists.
Some of the most famous art in the history of the world is based on religion of some sort. I'm no art student, but the beginnings of my interest in that type of art start with the ancient greek and roman statues. They aren't religion as we see it today, but it's a religion.
This site normally chooses challenge topics that are geared towards multicultural societies and non offensive themes. I think it would be a nice change of pace to introduce a few challenge themes where the emotive aspect of the challenge topic is the key.
I think you would see scores drop even on good photos though. People here like pretty pictures. That, in itself, sorta puzzles me when I keep hearing the word 'art' tossed around.
I'm ready for 'religion' or any other topics that would make some changes in the way people approach making photographs.
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05/09/2003 12:01:31 AM · #50 |
Again, please keep religion and politics out of the challenges. If there were a religion challenge, not only would i not submit nor vote, i even would not LOOK at the submissions.
As to emotive challenge topics, i recall the Fear challenge. Most submissions portrayed faked or clichéd emotions. Ditto with the Seven Deadly Sins challenge. With a few exceptions (Greenem, Hokie, KarenB, i believe) anyone submitting a darker or more symbolic interpretation of the challenge got misunderstood and poor scores.
With every challenge, however, there are some emotive submissions. That's because those submitters have something 'to say' and have the technical know-how to do it. Even in generic Glass, there were a couple with a nice emotive quality rather than just portraying a bit of (pretty) glass. Even in texture, there was a wonderfully emotive submission, Storm and Darkly Night. But those emotions were real, they came from the heart, not something fake put together to meet a challenge.
My preference is to continue in the same vein as before. And anyone who wants to submit a highly original, emotional, provocative, or controversial interpretation is welcome to do so.
PS
With a religion challenge, probably half the submissions will be about Places of Worship, i.e. Architecture more than Emotive per sé. The other submissions can be divided into two groups: those of faith ticking off the atheists & agnostics and vice versa. And it is my impression, not just from dpc, that it is okay to offend the atheists/agnostics but the other way around is a serious faux pas. No thanks.
Message edited by author 2003-05-09 00:33:45. |
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