Canned Comments Revisited - DPChallenge Forums

Nikon MF 180mm f/2.8 ED AIS

07/23/2002 10:57:26 AM · #1

Canned Comments:

Maybe it would be worth a try to allow the voter to select a â��cannedâ�� comment when voting. We briefly discussed this before and I think the general consensus was that we didnâ��t want the comment if the voter wasnâ��t sincere enough about the effort to type the comment in.

As a suggestion, maybe the voting page could list these comments, or ones like them, with radio buttons that would allow the user to select a comment to be tagged on automatically. These canned comments would give the voter a really easy opportunity to give the photographer some feedback about how he/she feels about the photo.

Canned Comment Suggestions:

[ ] â�� User defined comment (user types in whatever he wants instead of selecting a canned comment)

[ ] â�� Technically and subjectively excellent work. This photo is very strong in all aspects and I canâ��t see much, if any, room for improvement.

[ ] â�� Technically excellent work. The subject matter of the photo does not grab my attention.

[ ] â�� Subjectively excellent work. The technical quality could use some improvement.

[ ] â�� This is an average photograph. The technical and subjective content is ok, but both could be better.

[ ] â�� The technical quality of this photograph is poor, but the subjective content is ok (could be better).

[ ] â�� The subjective content of this photo is poor, but the technical quality is ok (could be better).

[ ] â�� The subjective and technical content of this photo is poor. Both areas need major improvement.

I really believe that I could live with some of these comments being placed on my photos if users who do not normally comment would use this feature to provide feedback. This would be one extra mouse click to provide feedback.

I believe that this list does cover the basic â��feelingâ�� levels of a voter without being specific. I also believe that it could possibly foster some extra typed comments. The voter may feel that the canned comment doesnâ��t really say enough, thus inspiring the voter to give a comment.

Anyone want to discuss the merits or the pitfalls of this concept?

mcmurma

Canon EOS-300D Rebel

07/23/2002 11:28:28 AM · #2

Excellent idea. I would use such a system. I feel it does nothing to detract from the comment process, and would likely encourage more. If, as you said, the voter felt a given comment wasn't quite right. Especially if we're allowed to append an existing "canned" comment to fit a particular image.

One thing though, you have listed a few too many choices in my opinion. A few less possibilites with the option to append would work better for most, I think.

Canon EF-S 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6 IS

07/23/2002 11:28:28 AM · #3

the only thing i see wrong with that is that it's all in the specifics.

for example, when one says something like "[ ] â�� The technical quality of this photograph is poor, but the subjective content is ok (could be better)." it begs the question: which ASPECT of the technique is poor? the exposure? the focus? the white balance? cropping? framing?

etc.

unless you have sub buttons to add those details, I don't think this goes far enough ..

But a great effort :)

Zeissman

Canon EOS-500D Rebel T1i

07/23/2002 11:29:06 AM · #4

It seems to me that this is what the score is for.

I really do not want someone telling my my photo is average or below average unless they give me a way to improve it.

Canon EF 28-135mm f/3.5-5.6 IS USM

07/23/2002 11:31:16 AM · #5

Magnetic and Zeiss,

I agree, but this is more feedback than you had to start with, right?

Agamemnon

Olympus C-700UZ

07/23/2002 11:31:45 AM · #6

I think this just repeats the scoring process also, and that it might make people who would give specific feedback simply give generic feedback.

ClubJuggle

Canon EOS-400D Rebel XTi

07/23/2002 11:32:06 AM · #7

I, for one, would not like to see this. The most frustrating comments I receive are the ones that say things like "composition could be better." Well, HOW?

Unless a person is going to give me suggestions for improvement or at the very least tell me what they did or didn''t like, I''d rather they not comment at all.

-Terry

* This message has been edited by the author on 7/23/2002 11:31:49 AM.

ClubJuggle

Canon EOS-400D Rebel XTi

Canon EF 28-135mm f/3.5-5.6 IS USM

07/23/2002 11:33:08 AM · #8

Originally posted by jmsetzler:
Magnetic and Zeiss,

I agree, but this is more feedback than you had to start with, right?

Not really. It might be less, actually, as people who might otherwise comment specifically could use the buttons to save time.

07/23/2002 11:33:49 AM · #9

I understand your points... my point is that some feedback is better than none, and the feedback I get now that is manually typed is RARELY specific.. do you all get much specific feedback? I surely do not.

These suggested canned comments are not designed to be specific. I feel better knowing what these comments say rather than seeing nothing at all.

Nikon AF-S DX Zoom-Nikkor 17-55mm f/2.8G IF-ED

07/23/2002 11:35:26 AM · #10

then why not go for sub buttons? if we really want to adopt this kind of a system, we should make it as specific and useful as possible :)

Agamemnon

Olympus C-700UZ

07/23/2002 11:36:41 AM · #11

I understand your point also, and would not be really against this being added to the site. I do worry a little it will cut back on useful feedback though... just don't see much point in adding more lines of feedback that is not helpful.

hokie

Nikon D2X

07/23/2002 11:38:15 AM · #12

John, one thing I like about your idea.

It might lead people to think about why they are voting the way they are.

If they have to choose a comment, many new people will be able to put into words what they might not normally be able or willing to.

My take on any change is that the first concern of any change should be to help the new digital phtographer.

The more experienced people like yourself or magnetic or dozens of others here don't NEED comments as much as a brand new photog to continue to improve. You have ideas of what you can or can't do to improve photos and votes and comments help verify your ideas and you are active in the forums and other websites.

New people here who use this site and the voting as their main source for improvement NEED the technical/subjective feedback a lot more I feel. Also, new photographers and non-photgraphers could benefit more from a guide to help them put into words what they may be thinking but feel hindered by lack of experience or unsure wording.

So if the change will help new people I am all for it.

As for me? Whatever happens...happens :-)

mcmurma

Canon EOS-300D Rebel

Nikon MF 180mm f/2.8 ED AIS

07/23/2002 11:40:07 AM · #13

The bottom line for me is that the voting process is tedious enough as it is. While I'd love to have only 25 images to vote on where I could offer constructive comments to everyone, I've voted on two challenges now, each time over 150+ images.

I think we need a specific area outside the challenge for people to solicit comments. Maybe a "Love it or Hate it but Please tell me why..." kind of forum.

07/23/2002 11:40:09 AM · #14

I got 57 comments on my photo last week. Six of them had suggestions for improvement in them. The others were either 'good shot' or 'good shot' and I like these things about the photo...

The 'attaboy' comments are always nice but the comments I really pay attention to are the ones that suggest improvement...

These canned comments at least tell me what area the particular voter thinks I need improvement...

Canon EF 28-135mm f/3.5-5.6 IS USM

07/23/2002 11:42:17 AM · #15

thanks for the vote of confidence hokie but I really am not that experienced AND I need *all the help I can get* :)

ClubJuggle

Canon EOS-400D Rebel XTi

07/23/2002 11:47:03 AM · #16

Originally posted by jmsetzler:
I understand your points... my point is that some feedback is better than none, and the feedback I get now that is manually typed is RARELY specific.. do you all get much specific feedback? I surely do not.

These suggested canned comments are not designed to be specific. I feel better knowing what these comments say rather than seeing nothing at all.

Actually, I often do. Part of the problem may be, quite honestly, that your photos are so good that we don't have much to offer for improvement. Try submitting a photo with obvious technical flaws this week and we'll try harder. ;-)

-Terry

Nikon AF-S DX Zoom-Nikkor 17-55mm f/2.8G IF-ED

07/23/2002 11:50:21 AM · #17

I think Hokie's point about the value of these comments to the photographers who get very few comments is a VERY valid point. Go look at the number of comments that some of the mid to lower range photos get each week....

These canned comments would at least tell these photographers where they need to start looking to improve their efforts...

hokie

Nikon D2X

07/23/2002 11:52:28 AM · #18

Originally posted by magnetic9999:
thanks for the vote of confidence hokie but I really am not that experienced AND I need *all the help I can get* :)

Well magnetic, I am not saying you are perfect ;-)

I don''t comment anymore. If I had buttons I might use them. But I don''t feel inclined to comment beyond my vote.

Emotionally I get too involved in defending my thinking and I always feel as if I may be imposing my view on someone else.

If people like my take on photography or whatever and want my opinion I will be happy to have discussions with them but I will not discuss other peoples photos in the forums or in the voting any longer. I find open internet discussions about art or specific photo style too distracting and it''s like one person said, "Preists arguing over angels on a pin".

So canned buttons might encourage SOME response from me that I do not have to invest too much emotion into :-)

* This message has been edited by the author on 7/23/2002 11:52:26 AM.

Canon EF-S 60mm f/2.8 Macro USM

07/23/2002 12:08:56 PM · #19

Originally posted by hokie:
Originally posted by magnetic9999:
[i]thanks for the vote of confidence hokie but I really am not that experienced AND I need *all the help I can get* :)

Emotionally I get too involved in defending my thinking and I always feel as if I may be imposing my view on someone else.

[/i]

Don't think of it as 'imposing'... it's sharing :)

Gene L.

Canon EOS-350D Rebel XT

07/23/2002 12:14:47 PM · #20

What I like about the canned reply is that it gives license to say that a photo is technically good, but not an interesting subject. I usually refrain from such a comment because of the risk of stepping on someone's toes.

If one thinks it is inappropriate to judge a photo as interesting or not, then it could be upsetting to have their technically perfect photo judged as uninteresting. If it is stated as a valid response to a photo, then everyone knows what voters are looking for.

07/23/2002 12:16:31 PM · #21

Originally posted by Gene L.:
What I like about the canned reply is that it gives license to say that a photo is technically good, but not an interesting subject. I usually refrain from such a comment because of the risk of stepping on someone's toes.

If one thinks it is inappropriate to judge a photo as interesting or not, then it could be upsetting to have their technically perfect photo judged as uninteresting. If it is stated as a valid response to a photo, then everyone knows what voters are looking for.

I agree.. I don't have a lot of support for this idea tho :(

07/23/2002 12:23:12 PM · #22

we like your view. i miss your comments. and thanks for saying i am not perfect. otherwise my wife would prolly have to come talk to you ;)..

Originally posted by hokie:
Originally posted by magnetic9999:
[i]thanks for the vote of confidence hokie but I really am not that experienced AND I need *all the help I can get* :)

Well magnetic, I am not saying you are perfect ;-)
[/i]

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