"Frozen" studio shots? - DPChallenge Forums

Tamron SP AF 28-75mm f/2.8 XR Di for Canon

12/16/2004 12:58:11 PM · #2

im not very good at it but i do the take 100 shots and select the 1 best.

jbeazell

Nikon D3100

Nikon AF-S DX Zoom-Nikkor 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6G VR

12/16/2004 01:06:02 PM · #3

Originally posted by larus:

I don't have the link for it, but I have seen an audio device that will trigger a flash unit when it hears a sounds. Basically, you turn out all the lights, Set your camera to a long shutter exposure, like a couple seconds or Bulb, then peform your 'break the lightbulb' or similar action. When the audio device hears the noise, it fires the flash, illuminating your subject at the exact time of impact. Some of these audio devices can be 'tuned' to give some amount of delay between the noise and the flash fire.

...or you can do what the rest of us do.... take hundreds of pictures and try to get the best one possible. I'm lucky that my 602z has a pretty quick 5-shot continuous setting at 5 fps. I'm sure that you can set your continuous setting on the 10d and get the same, but much better, results :)

Message edited by author 2004-12-16 13:09:42.

Prof_Fate

12/16/2004 01:09:50 PM · #4

//hiviz.com/tools/triggers/makeown.htm#connect

They sell kits too, but the basic directiosn adn parts list and all is right there, free. I think a kit is like $10 and works with any PC-sync flash unit.

It's on my list of things to acquire.

assuming the link works, here is a cool shot of this device in action, so to speak.
//www.fujimugs.com/challenge/show_entry.php?entry=1068&challenge=13#entry

ScottK

Canon EOS-350D Rebel XT

Canon EF 28-135mm f/3.5-5.6 IS USM

12/16/2004 01:12:59 PM · #5

The closest I've come to working with timing like that are these:

And they were all cases where I just took 50-100 pictures, reviewing every 10-20, trying to get the timing down.

Oh, and there was this shot, where I failed:

My intent was to get the feather while it was gently falling. But you'd be amazed how fast (and unpredictably) these things fall when you're trying to take a picture of it. :) The closest I came to what I really wanted was this:

- but the composition just wasn't quite right for me.

crabappl3

12/16/2004 02:40:18 PM · #6

My best try. It took about 85 tries or so. I've since tried with my dSLR and haven't been as successful.

-danny

Message edited by author 2004-12-16 14:40:37.

soup

Canon EOS-30D

Nikon AF-S DX Zoom-Nikkor 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6G VR

12/16/2004 02:57:00 PM · #7

with a dSLR - if you don't see the splash in the viewfinmder - there is a good chance you captured it. if you see it - you missed it.

try and try again.

jbeazell

Nikon D3100

12/16/2004 03:18:18 PM · #8

Originally posted by soup:

with a dSLR - if you don't see the splash in the viewfinmder - there is a good chance you captured it. if you see it - you missed it.

try and try again.

...I actually thought that to myself last night whilst getting shots of my dog and some egg beaters.... "If you see the tounge frozen in the view finder, you missed it!"

:)

One quickly learns that a 3 second recycle time on a strobe can take forever!

scab-lab

Canon EOS-D60

12/16/2004 04:52:25 PM · #9

Close to 100 shots to get this. It was very hard to get the timing perfect, so there is definately some luck involved.

K-Rob

Canon EOS-20D

Canon EF 100mm f/2.8 USM Macro

12/16/2004 05:01:36 PM · #10

This one only took about 20 - 30 shots. I had the sink slowing dropping water and I got in synch with the "rythm" of the drops. I've actually been pretty lucky getting these types of shots. Maybe I have good timing about these things.

K-Rob

Canon EOS-20D

Canon EF 100mm f/2.8 USM Macro

12/16/2004 05:03:40 PM · #11

By the way, 1/2000sec isn't always necessary. You can freeze the scene with slower speeds if you have enough light/flash. The shot I posted above was shot at 1/10,000sec because I thought I needed that. I've been able to replicate it at about 1/500sec and it would probably work slower as well. For very fast moving objects then faster speeds are necessary but it would have to be pretty darn fast.

Message edited by author 2004-12-16 17:04:19.

Natator

Canon EF 70-200mm f/2.8L IS USM

12/16/2004 06:17:36 PM · #12

Ok, can someone explain .....

If your flash sync speed is 1/250, how do you catch this sort of thing using a flash?

The Canon speedlights have a "high speed sync" button. Is that what this is for? If so, does anyone know how fast something like a 500ex can sync with?

When I use studio strobes I meter for 1/250, as that is my sync speed, so don't think I could use them faster than that.

Clues anyone?

Plexxoid

Canon EOS-30D

12/16/2004 06:27:58 PM · #13

The Speedlites have high-speed sync, I was using mine yesterday, works wonderfully. Studio flashes probably don't have hi-speed sync, though some may.

Edit: Hi-speed sync allows you to use your flash at any speed. Any reason you'd want to switch to normal?

Message edited by author 2004-12-16 18:28:37.

Travis99

Canon EF 24-70mm f/2.8L USM

12/16/2004 06:34:27 PM · #14

I have a Nikon sb-600 the sync speed is 1/500 how can I increase this. If I can't, what are some other methods?

travis

doctornick

Apple iPhone 13 Pro

12/16/2004 07:19:16 PM · #15

I shoot continuously at 8fps until my buffer is full...

12/16/2004 07:49:01 PM · #16

Originally posted by Natator:

This comes down to how the shutter works....

Think of the shutter being two curtains.. (Which it is...) and for speeds including, and slower than the X-sync the first curtain opens the 'hole' all the way before the second one starts to close it up... Then they both return to the 'start' positions.

For higher speeds the first curtain starts it's trip down/up/across (Depending on brand/model of SLR) the sensor, and the second one follows up before the first curtain has reached the end, so the exposure is a 'slot' made by the gap between the two curtains travelling across the sensor/film..

X-Sync is the fastest shutter speed where the entire sensor is exposed at the same time, and therefore the fastest shutter speed you can use a standard flash with.

As for 'freezing' things with a flash... Even though the shutter speed might be 1/250th on the 20D (for e.g.) the flash light pulse itself will only last a few thousandths of a second. The 'power' of the flash is varied by varying the duration of the light pulse, so for a small amount of 'fill' flash the actual light output may only last 1/10,000th of a second... At full power it may be 1/1000th.

The Camera times the pulse of light from the flash to be bang in the middle of the time when both curtains are full open..

You can play with this using a manual flash, and set a higher shutter speed than X-sync. You'll get dark bands at the top and or bottom of the image where one or other of the curtains is not full open when the shutter fires.

High-speed sync for dedicated flashes works by extending the flash light pulse, or pulsing it at a high frequency, so there is light from the flash for the whole time the 'slot' is moving up/down/across the sensor.

If you want to 'stop' motion with a flash it's better to use X-sync and normal mode than FP/High speed sync mode. At X-sync and a 'low' flash setting you'll get really quick exposures, in the 1/20,000th area.. With high-speed sync you'll only get the shutter speed, plus motion 'slur' from the movement of the curtains down the sensor..

High speed sync is primarily for fill in flash in bright light conditions with wide apetures.. Say you're taking a portrait with the sun behind the person, shining through a tree.. You know the look, mottled light and all that..

You want a shallow DOF, so you pick F/2.8 on your L glass, ISO100 and your camera's meter says 1/2000th required... Only problem is the persons face will be in pitch black due to the contrast. If you use a non-high speed sync flash you'd have to go to F/8.0 to get 1/250th of a second exposure (Three stops). Problem is then your nice background is going to be all harsh and in focus.

The high-speed sync allows you to fill flash at 1/1000th to keep the Apeture/DOF as you wanted it. There is a bit of loss in power output using high speed sync, but with a 580ex or any other 'current' flash it's not a big deal as they can take the paint of a buick at 50 meters anyway.

Added into this is specs like on the 20D.. X-sync is 1/250th for small flashes, but 1/125th for large studio stobes. This is because some powerful strobes have longer lasting light pulses (1/500th and longer..) and are slower to fire than compact flashes so there's a chance you'll catch a curtain on the move at 1/250th.

And then there's ambient light considerations for studio work at 1/125th, and colour shifts from modelling lights... It just keeps on going and going and going...

Hope that confuses. :-).

Cheers, Me.

Edit: Typo

Message edited by author 2004-12-16 19:53:52.

Natator

Nikon AF-S DX Zoom-Nikkor 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6G VR

12/17/2004 12:50:28 AM · #17

Excellent answer there Chris, as always, thanks :)

Do you know what the absolute max speed is for the speedlights, is it 1/1000th or was just the example you used?

Prof_Fate

12/17/2004 01:05:01 AM · #18

Originally posted by Natator:

Excellent answer there Chris, as always, thanks :)

Do you know what the absolute max speed is for the speedlights, is it 1/1000th or was just the example you used?

//www.rpphoto.com/howto/hummer/humguide1.htm

The article is on how to catch a hummingbird's wings via fast flash - it goes into some detail on how that is done using canon flash and ttl and such.

jbeazell

Nikon D3100

12/17/2004 01:09:17 AM · #19

that is a fantasic answer!!

Do you know if non-mechanical shutter cams, like my 602z, would be as affected by sync speed? I have fired my good-ole Vivtar 285 at 1/10,000 at a distance of about 20 feet, and it seemed to fill the fram nicely (surprising well, in fact).

Prof_Fate

12/17/2004 01:16:51 AM · #20

Not sure of your quetion, but i have fired a quantarray on the hotshoe of mine at 1/4000 shutter speed, and got a perfeclty good image (well, a bit underexposed, duh).

the image i posted earlier, well the link, is to fujimugs.com and it is ONLY fuji cameras - i believe the image i referenced was with a 602.

Natator

Fisher Price Kid-Tough Digital

12/17/2004 02:33:10 AM · #21

Originally posted by Prof_Fate:

//www.rpphoto.com/howto/hummer/humguide1.htm

Seriously good article there. Thanks :)

LalliSig

12/17/2004 04:20:53 AM · #22

I emailed someone I know does a lot of these shots and he told me that at first he just did what most people seem to do, just shoot again and again and again but he got tired of that and found a device that uses a laser to detect movement and that is used to trigger the shutter at VERY precise times. He said he bought it about 2 years ago and paid about 600$ for it but he wasnÂ´t at home and didnÂ´t remember the brand name.

Anybody have a clue on where I could get one of these laser triggers?

12/17/2004 04:31:34 AM · #23

Originally posted by Natator:

Excellent answer there Chris, as always, thanks :)

Do you know what the absolute max speed is for the speedlights, is it 1/1000th or was just the example you used?

As in shortest flash? Dunno for the canon gear.. My 580ex manual just says '1.2ms or shorter' which is arond 1/833rd.

Assuming that's 'full' power and in manual you can go down to 1/128th of full power, it might be as fast as 9.4us or 1/106666. That is making the assumption that the exposure has a linear relationship to the duration of the flash, which is probably not correct...

Cheers, Me.

12/17/2004 04:37:40 AM · #24

Originally posted by jbeazell:

Ahhh, that's one of those 'it depends' questions...

With a non-slr it all depends on how the shutter works. With my Powershot G5 the shutter was always 'open' if you were using the LCD as the viewfinder, and with a manual flash (Vivitar 285 as well, as it happens) you could go right up to max shutter speed (1/2000th) without any problems, even though X-sync was 1/250th.

The shutter on the G5 closes after the exposure is taken, which the camera reads the info off the Sensor.

If you had the LCD off, you got similar results to an SLR at above X-sync although slightly more random. I'm assuming becaues the shutter was closed? although that wouldn't make sense, as I understand the exposure and focus sensors are all behind the shutter in the G5?

I think the rule here would be if it works, go with it. :-).

For an SLR there's no option for high-speed sync appart from a dedicated flash, that was one of the deciding things for me getting the 580ex.. That and the wanky setting wheel on it. :-). Image is everything.

Cheers, Chris H.