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 03/07/2007 08:15:59 AM · #1
This is not really a suggestion, more of a complaint. Either way I wanted to know how other people felt about it.

This morning (a record 3 hour into voting) I received a proof request. I want to say that I totaly agree with the way proof is being handled, but I disagree with form. Maybe it was just my surprise but, being a paying member, I find the tone of this email offensive:


Your image in the Red II challenge, "XXXXX" needs to be validated.

Please visit the following URL within 48 hours for details on how to submit your original, unedited photograph:

//www.dpchallenge.com/proof_request.php?IMAGE_ID=XXXXXX

Remember to list the details of any post-shot editing that you performed. Note that failing to provide the camera original in a timely manner will result in your submission being disqualified. If for some reason you cannot supply your original right away, please go to the following URL to inform the Site Council:

//www.dpchallenge.com/help_contact.php

Please do not reply to this email.

Thanks,
DPChallenge


Is it just me or this messages should be more respectful? After all 99% of the times the images are according to the rules.
 03/07/2007 08:23:10 AM · #2
I have had two validation requests, and have now problem with the generic e-mail. It is clear and concise, and I can't see anything in it to take objection to.
 03/07/2007 08:25:32 AM · #3
perhaps you are too much touchy. I think that this is a standard message. It's very difficult that the SC or the admin write a new message every time that they ask the proof. I remember you that the proof can be asked to everyone every time.
 03/07/2007 08:28:27 AM · #4
I understand your point but for me a justification on the 48 hour limit and a simple phrase apologizing for the inconvenience would go a long way.

You have to see that some random user asked for the proof, for all we know he/she might not even be able to distinguish photoshop from power point.
 03/07/2007 08:30:05 AM · #5
Originally posted by Rino63:
perhaps you are too much touchy. I think that this is a standard message. It's very difficult that the SC or the admin write a new message every time that they ask the proof. I remember you that the proof can be asked to everyone every time.


I get, I don't want a personalized message, I was suggesting that the standard message be rewritten.
 03/07/2007 08:30:30 AM · #6
I don't see anything wrong with the message.

Anything short of spelling out the steps and the consequences of not following them would result in other problems.

The message is generic to apply to all users of the site from the newbies to the veterans. Those who have never gotten a validation request before may not know the procedure so it's nice to have it spelled out in the email.
 03/07/2007 08:37:08 AM · #7
Originally posted by vasc:
Originally posted by Rino63:
perhaps you are too much touchy. I think that this is a standard message. It's very difficult that the SC or the admin write a new message every time that they ask the proof. I remember you that the proof can be asked to everyone every time.


I get, I don't want a personalized message, I was suggesting that the standard message be rewritten.

why? the actual message is short, a more respectful message will be more long.
 03/07/2007 08:37:35 AM · #8
ok, I guess no one agrees with me so, maybe, I was just bitching because I never had a proof request before and my image is doing really low. So thanks for your replies ;)
 03/07/2007 08:39:45 AM · #9
I don't find any tone here to be offensive, and I've had to validate numerous times. I think it comes from an authoritive standpoint, is very non-threatening, and I don't see the need to sugarcoat things. It's short and to the point, and gives all the information needed to get the photo validated. They use the word "Please" 3 times in the email, which being polite. They also let you know that if you can't submit the original within 48 hours to let them know, and that sounds to me like they're willing to work with you a little more if you're in a bind. Nobody is saying "We think you cheated, send us the original or suffer the consequences!"

This is just my thought, but seriously, don't sweat it. It's human nature to get a little defensive when "called to the carpet" and see tones in an email that really aren't there. Hope this helps a bit, and good luck in your validation.

Edit: Sorry, typed too slow. :-)

Message edited by author 2007-03-07 08:41:00.
 03/07/2007 08:39:55 AM · #10
Well last i checked the image is always the same. And if you ever dived into the rules you know that when u click those 3 check boxes one of them is consenting to this kind of request.

But i figure u know that :-P
 03/07/2007 08:43:20 AM · #11
Originally posted by RainMotorsports:
Well last i checked the image is always the same. And if you ever dived into the rules you know that when u click those 3 check boxes one of them is consenting to this kind of request.

But i figure u know that :-P


Yes, I know that, I never said they were doing something wrong, my point was they could do it better, but you already corrected me.
 03/07/2007 08:47:25 AM · #12
Originally posted by vasc:
I understand your point but for me a justification on the 48 hour limit and a simple phrase apologizing for the inconvenience would go a long way.


The justification on the 48 hour limit is the fact that you checked a box when you submitted your photo that said this ...

"If requested, I will provide the unedited, original file from my digital camera within 48 hours."

I can't see how you need a lot more justification than that.
 03/07/2007 08:51:58 AM · #13
Also keep in mind that the SC doesn't just ask for validation every time a user flags an image as a possible rules violation. They first look at the image and see if there is any conceivable foundation for the complaint. If they think there is, they ask for the validation original. The fact that you got the message means that at least a few SC have looked at the complaint, looked at your image, and decided that they'd like to see the original just to make sure things are on the up-and-up.

I think the message is functional and to the point. I've gotten a few of them myself and I remember being nervous and a little wary the first time I got one. No worries though, it's just the business of the site.
 03/07/2007 08:52:53 AM · #14
Funny - this was the message I got when I needed a past image validated.

Your image in the Street Photography challenge, "XXXXX" needs to be validated.

Please, pretty please, visit the following URL whenever you get a spare moment for details on how to submit your original, awesome, beautiful and unedited photograph:

//www.dpchallenge.com/proof_request.php?IMAGE_ID=XXXXXX

Please, pretty please, remember to list the details of any post-shot editing that you performed, but only if you feel up to it. Note that failing to provide the camera original in a timely manner will result in your submission being disqualified, but only if thats ok with you. If for some reason you cannot supply your original right away, you just don't worry your pretty little head over it. We know that it was probably some big meanie who called you up because their image sucks and they want to take you down.

Please do not reply to this email but if you want we would love to talk with you on the phone. Also if you send us your mailing address we can get a lovely fruit basket out to you for your inconvenience.

Hugs and Kisses,
DPChallenge


;)
 03/07/2007 08:53:28 AM · #15
Originally posted by Greetmir:
Originally posted by vasc:
I understand your point but for me a justification on the 48 hour limit and a simple phrase apologizing for the inconvenience would go a long way.


The justification on the 48 hour limit is the fact that you checked a box when you submitted your photo that said this ...

"If requested, I will provide the unedited, original file from my digital camera within 48 hours."

I can't see how you need a lot more justification than that.


That is not a justification, that is a box. It doesn't say why!

but once again

Originally posted by vasc:

Yes, I know that, I never said they were doing something wrong, my point was they could do it better, but you already corrected me.
03/07/2007 08:54:49 AM · #16
Originally posted by timfythetoo:
Funny - this was the message I got when I needed a past image validated.

Your image in the Street Photography challenge, "XXXXX" needs to be validated.

Please, pretty please, visit the following URL whenever you get a spare moment for details on how to submit your original, awesome, beautiful and unedited photograph:

//www.dpchallenge.com/proof_request.php?IMAGE_ID=XXXXXX

Please, pretty please, remember to list the details of any post-shot editing that you performed, but only if you feel up to it. Note that failing to provide the camera original in a timely manner will result in your submission being disqualified, but only if thats ok with you. If for some reason you cannot supply your original right away, you just don't worry your pretty little head over it. We know that it was probably some big meanie who called you up because their image sucks and they want to take you down.

Please do not reply to this email but if you want we would love to talk with you on the phone. Also if you send us your mailing address we can get a lovely fruit basket out to you for your inconvenience.

Hugs and Kisses,
DPChallenge


;)


It would certainly be kinder ;)
 03/07/2007 09:03:33 AM · #17
On a more serious tone, I believe, and this has nothing to do with the message having the right tone or not, when you pay for a service you have the right demand changes in things you don't like.

I know your thinking: if you don't like it don't buy it, but it doesn't always have to be that way. If enough people think that the box is wrong than the box has to be changed, not the peoples mind.

Making everyone agree to a Term of Service doesn't make that TOS right nor makes it immutable. Changes should be pressed when the reason is on the side of the consumer.

This is an answer to the ones who say "you agreed to it so you shouldn't complain about it".
 03/07/2007 09:24:58 AM · #18
Originally posted by vasc:
On a more serious tone, I believe, and this has nothing to do with the message having the right tone or not, when you pay for a service you have the right demand changes in things you don't like.

I know your thinking: if you don't like it don't buy it, but it doesn't always have to be that way. If enough people think that the box is wrong than the box has to be changed, not the peoples mind.

Making everyone agree to a Term of Service doesn't make that TOS right nor makes it immutable. Changes should be pressed when the reason is on the side of the consumer.

This is an answer to the ones who say "you agreed to it so you shouldn't complain about it".

Edit - Ignore me, I'm sounding like a jerk again.

Message edited by author 2007-03-07 09:28:23.
 03/07/2007 09:27:20 AM · #19
Originally posted by vasc:

Is it just me or this messages should be more respectful? After all 99% of the times the images are according to the rules.


I have never had a validation request but if I had received that messge I wouldnt be phased by it because it is laid out in the rules before I joined and there is a check box stating that this would happen if you were required to validate. And on the section I quote, remember we "assume" that 99% of the entries are valid, we would only know this if each and every image was required to provide validation. Not wanting to open a can of worms here so please dont flame me LOL.

Edit to add : Oops sorry I think you were meaning that 99% of the entries that have validation requested are according to the rules, rather than 99% of all entries in the challenge. Scratch the above.
:-(

Message edited by author 2007-03-07 09:28:43.
 03/07/2007 09:46:58 AM · #20


This is the Website Suggestions folder. The OP has a right to offer his suggestions in a civil manner (which he did), and to expect that any discussion will be civil azs well.

If you have an opinion about the idea suggested, please feel free to voice them without attacking.Personal attacks are neither appropriate nor tolerated.



~Terry
 03/07/2007 09:54:32 AM · #21
Originally posted by vasc:
On a more serious tone, I believe, and this has nothing to do with the message having the right tone or not, when you pay for a service you have the right demand changes in things you don't like.

Actually, I don't agree with that. In my view, you are getting exactly what you paid for from this website (member challenge submissions, an online portfolio, a few other things). Whereas you have the right to make suggestions based on concerns, as you have already done, no member has the right to make demands and expect them to be fulfilled. Your money isn't paying for that. :)
 03/07/2007 10:01:34 AM · #22
Since this has degenerated into flame wars, I hope you have a nice time attacking someone else because my point is made (or rather not made). Have a nice day and thanks for those who were able to discuss in a civilized manner.
 03/07/2007 10:35:20 AM · #23
There is nothing offensive or untoward in the email.
It is simply matter of fact.
Btw, I see no flame war here just no one that really agrees with the OP.

Yes, of course as a paying member you have a right to express opinions and suggestions for change but that is not the topic of discussion here.
The topic is whether the email should "be more respectful."
And the opinions that were asked for so far seem to think not.
 03/07/2007 11:22:51 AM · #24
The only issue I see is that after you send in the validation photo I feel that you should recieve a followup e-mail stating that it was received and the reason the request was asked for. I also feel that at the end of the voting another e-mail should be sent stating the original request for the validation. It would be interesting to see if the same few people are asking for the majority of the validations.
.
I do think it's only fair for the photog to see the reason for the request and who was the accuser. After all, most "legal" systems allow the accused to know who the accusser is and what the possible crime was.
 03/07/2007 11:27:43 AM · #25
Originally posted by PhantomEWO:
The only issue I see is that after you send in the validation photo I feel that you should recieve a followup e-mail stating that it was received and the reason the request was asked for. I also feel that at the end of the voting another e-mail should be sent stating the original request for the validation. It would be interesting to see if the same few people are asking for the majority of the validations.
.
I do think it's only fair for the photog to see the reason for the request and who was the accuser. After all, most "legal" systems allow the accused to know who the accusser is and what the possible crime was.


I don't think knowing who requested the validation would be a good idea. We get enough people blaming SC because their photo was DQ'ed, we certainly don't need people PM'ing other members and telling them off because they requested a validation.
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