Perspective - question - DPChallenge Forums

09/19/2005 11:14:10 PM · #1

Is it possible for a photo to not fit this challenge?

Message edited by author 2005-09-19 23:14:22.

Chippie19

Canon EOS-5D Mark II

Canon EF 50mm f/1.4 USM

09/19/2005 11:17:39 PM · #2

i received a comment that mine was not a "perspective" picture. a little strange of a comment, i thought, but feedback is always welcomed. everyone has their own view on what a "challenge" means to them.

Message edited by author 2005-09-19 23:18:38.

Canon EF-S 17-55mm f/2.8 IS USM

09/20/2005 12:00:58 AM · #3

IMHO, perspective and POV are two different things. Then again, I'm an architect so go figure :D

idnic

Canon EOS-60D

09/20/2005 12:10:45 AM · #4

I see a definite difference between cool POV and a feeling of perspective, though they can definitely be combined.

This was my ill-fated challenge entry (now DQ'd cause I'm a dummy, see I'm a dummy challenge thread)

I'm a dummy

BrennanOB

Canon EOS-1D Mark II

Tamron SP AF 28-75mm f/2.8 XR Di for Canon

09/20/2005 12:42:58 AM · #5

Originally posted by ggbudge:

Is it possible for a photo to not fit this challenge?

Depends on your point of view,...perspective, if you will. Any picture you take will have some perspective in it however IMHO a photograph that is ABOUT perspective is rare, and not too common in the challenge entries. Not that I belive in slamming POV shots, or just pretty pictures that are taken in a three dimentiional universe, since the do use some perspective. Those few that are concerned primarily with perspective are marked higher. Probably has to do with architectural training since Rikki seems to be the only other person who sees a strong difference btwn the 2,

Pentax DA 16-45mm f/4.0 ED AL AF

09/20/2005 12:53:33 AM · #6

hmmm.... interesting...

Could you elaborate more on the difference between the two?

I may be seeing them in too broad a sense, cuz the way I see it they're both pretty much the same. :/

bs-photos

Pentax K7

09/20/2005 12:57:35 AM · #7

stupid question, what is IMHO short for? like i said, sorry for the dumb question...

oOWonderBreadOo

Canon EOS-5D

Canon EF 16-35mm f/2.8L USM

09/20/2005 12:58:26 AM · #8

when I started voting I was looking for unusual perspective but then looked at the challenge description

Use perspective to create a dramatic effect with your photograph.

to which I said- Oh! I guess it can be ANY perspective, but still using perspective to complete the image... but it's all relative anyway right? ;0)

oOWonderBreadOo

Canon EOS-5D

Canon EF 16-35mm f/2.8L USM

09/20/2005 12:59:02 AM · #9

in my humble opinion... :0)

Samsung Galaxy S21, S21+, S21 Ultra

09/20/2005 12:59:07 AM · #10

in my humble opinion :)

There's no such thing as a stupid question. :)

Bear_Music

Sony 24-70mm F4 Vario-Tessar T* FE OSS

09/20/2005 01:15:41 AM · #11

Originally posted by ggbudge:

hmmm.... interesting...

Could you elaborate more on the difference between the two?

I may be seeing them in too broad a sense, cuz the way I see it they're both pretty much the same. :/

When an artist (or a critic) refers to perspective in relation to a work of art, s/he's nearly always talking about receding lines/vanishing points or lack of same. It can be fairly well assumed from the challenge description that this is what the challenge posters had in mind here.

Any time you render 3-dimensional space in a 2-dimensional format, you have perspective to some degree. As a broad rule of thumb, the wider-angle the shot the more extreme the perspective is, and vice versa. Extreme wide-angle shots often produce what's called "forced perspective", which is frequently very dramatic. Extreme telephot shots, on the other hand, have the effect of flattening perspective to a highly "unnatural" (to our eyes) degree.

As far as this standard definitokn of perspective goes, I see nothing in the challenge description that would suggest "forced perspective" is a "better" solution than flattened perspective, assuming each has drama and power stemming from the use of the perspective, which I take to be what the challenge was looking for. There are strong examples of both in the challenge.

However, it's obvious that a LOT of people are choosing to interpret "perspective" in its "POV" meaning, as in a unique point-of-view is synonymous with a unique perspective. I have to admit I don't see anything in the challenge description as written to proclude this approach.

I don't know whether this is a good thing or a bad thing. We're essentially int he position of having to judge apples and oranges against each other. But there's nothing unusual about that in here, LOL.

Robt.

BrennanOB

Canon EOS-1D Mark II

Tamron SP AF 28-75mm f/2.8 XR Di for Canon

09/20/2005 01:25:59 AM · #12

I would say perspective is the technique of representing three-dimensional objects and depth relationships on a two-dimensional surface.

Point of view is a position from which something is observed or considered.

In perspective drawing the point of view determines the vanishing points and the horizon line. The amount of percived perspective can be increased and manipulated by how you position the POV.

If you think of the work of the work of M C Esher you can see how central perspective is to him. The staircases that go both up and down, the shopwindow that turns itself inside out. These are studies in perspective. Rembrant used perspective, but his work wasn't about perspective, Escher's was.

Every photograph ever taken uses perspective, just as it uses light, but in the light challenge people knew that the main point of the challenge was intended to be light; the way light works on a surface, or through an object. Light was what the pictures were about, they were celebrations of light, not mearly lit objects. Not so this challenge, perspective is in all the shots, but very few are about perspective.

Brennan

09/20/2005 01:40:57 AM · #13

Originally posted by BrennanOB:

Originally posted by ggbudge:
Is it possible for a photo to not fit this challenge?

Depends on your point of view,...perspective, if you will. Any picture you take will have some perspective in it however IMHO a photograph that is ABOUT perspective is rare, and not too common in the challenge entries. Not that I belive in slamming POV shots, or just pretty pictures that are taken in a three dimentiional universe, since the do use some perspective. Those few that are concerned primarily with perspective are marked higher. Probably has to do with architectural training since Rikki seems to be the only other person who sees a strong difference btwn the 2,

I think the reason why I see perspective in a totally different way is due to training I agree. For me:

Perspective is the technique of representing three-dimensional objects and depth relationships on a two-dimensional surface.

During my years in architecture school (Go Cal Poly! That's california Polytechnic State University for non- Californians), we study perspective intensively. There are three different ways of viewing perspective. I will try to show that perspective is not only achieved through architecture.

One Point Perspectives: There is one obvious vanishing point. Here are examples:

As you can clearly see, all lines leads to one point.

Two Point Perspectives: There are two clear vanishing points that are located to the left and right of the image. Two-point perspective is slightly more complex, as both the front and back edges, and side edges, of an object must be diminished towards vanishing points. Two-point perspective is often used when drawing buildings in the landscape. The effect can be carried even further, with three-point perspective used to create impressive visual effects, such as a view from a skyscraper.

Three Point perspective: This is a development of two point perspective. Like two point it has two vanishing points somewhere on the horizon. But three point perspective also has a vanishing point somewhere above or below the horizon which the vertical vanish to.

On the other hand, Point of view is a manner of viewing things.

I'm not sure if SC will allow me to do this but since the challenge ends tomorrow... I don't think I'm compromising votes based on obviously my humble opinion.

Where's Robert (bearmusic), he's got his own humble opinions as well.

Message edited by author 2005-09-20 01:42:44.

09/20/2005 02:19:32 AM · #14

Thanks for the replies! Very interesting! I love it when I learn something new.. or can see something from a different perspective ;)

I'd like to continue this conversation after the challenge ends, so we don't break any taboos... my next just question might take us too close to that line...

Again, many many thanks for the replies.

same time, same place tomorrow gentlemen? :D

09/20/2005 02:26:58 AM · #15

same bat channel batman :D

09/20/2005 12:27:07 PM · #16

Great take on this Robert :D

soup

Canon EOS-30D

Pentax DA 16-45mm f/4.0 ED AL AF

09/20/2005 12:31:33 PM · #17

you're perspective on a given topic will likely vary from mine.

it doesn't have to be about vanishing points, or wide angle shots. though it seems the majority are voting that way ;{

glad2badad

DJI Mavic Air 2

Sears 55mm f/1.4 M42

09/20/2005 12:35:24 PM · #18

WHERE was THIS during the submission phase of this challenge?! I would have totally changed my POV!!! ;^)

Originally posted by rikki11:

...I think the reason why I see perspective in a totally different way is due to training I agree. For me:

Perspective is the technique of representing three-dimensional objects and depth relationships on a two-dimensional surface.

During my years in architecture school...

bs-photos

Pentax K7

09/20/2005 03:36:37 PM · #19

Originally posted by ggbudge:

in my humble opinion :)

There's no such thing as a stupid question. :)

Thanks, one of my comments makes much more sense now :) Thanks again!

09/20/2005 04:16:35 PM · #20

Originally posted by glad2badad:

WHERE was THIS during the submission phase of this challenge?! I would have totally changed my POV!!! ;^)

Originally posted by rikki11:
...I think the reason why I see perspective in a totally different way is due to training I agree. For me:

Perspective is the technique of representing three-dimensional objects and depth relationships on a two-dimensional surface.

During my years in architecture school...

LOL! We had this lengthy discussion about this. You must have been busy snapping photos away :) It's an intriguing topic to say the least... kinda reminds me of the high contrast challenge.

By the way, my image is tanking!

09/21/2005 12:39:30 AM · #21

Ok, back to our regularly scheduled program :)

I now have a better understanding and appreciation for perspective. As this discussion evolved last night, my wife found this site (there's probably other sites like it) which confirmed your definition of perspective.

My entry ended up in 416th place, but was my highest scoring entry to date! (4.7) :)

As you can see, there's no vanishing lines, but there are 3 different perspectives (or is that pov's?) of the ducks. Front, behind and side.

How would you classify it?

George

Samsung Galaxy S21, S21+, S21 Ultra

09/21/2005 01:04:13 AM · #22

This image does not, unfortunately, convey a stronf sense of perspective. Had they been three ducks in a row, that would have been something else.

You have to remember that there's always an inherent degree of perspective in everything we take photos of. This image is just a composed image and nothing more (unfortunately).

Congrats on your highest score to date. This site will definitely help you improve :)

Bear_Music

Sony 24-70mm F4 Vario-Tessar T* FE OSS

09/21/2005 01:26:08 AM · #23

Since the challenge was to use perspective to "create impact" in your image, this doesn't really answer the challenge very proactively. I can see where you were making the statement of "3 perspectives on a duck" but that's a little obscure for the average voter, and the image itself anyway seems a little flat and dull compositionally, so...

R.