Night Shot V - Frustrations. - DPChallenge Forums

Canon EF 24-105mm f/4.0L IS

03/18/2010 01:31:58 PM · #1

Well here we are in the middle of voting. I'm on track for the my Personal Worst here on DPC.

I'm really frustrated though cause I'm not getting any comments.. Clearly most of the scores are 4 or less. I use this site like a school on photography. I get an assignment I do my best with that assignment. In this case "Night IV" apparently I'm getting an F, but the teachers won't tell me why.

... Just had to vent a little ...

jeger

Canon EOS-5D

03/18/2010 01:36:42 PM · #2

When the challenge is over, ask for some feedback in the forum. I'm sure there are many people willing to help.

freakin_hilarious

Canon EOS-550D Rebel T2i

Tamron SP AF 28-75mm f/2.8 XR Di for Canon

03/18/2010 01:36:46 PM · #3

During the challenge is the worst time to get comments. Just start a thread after the challenge ends asking for honest critiques and you'll learn exactly what people thought, good and bad.

Canon EF 85mm f/1.2L II USM

03/18/2010 01:46:21 PM · #4

It's hard to get that sort of feedback during a challenge. A lot of reasons. Some people have gotten hate mail after leaving critiques and no longer comment unless they have something good to say. Some people are on a quest for photographic gems and leaving feedback is unimportant. Others just don't know what to say, so they don't. Some are blissfully unaware of how much their feedback would be appreciated.

I do feel that I must point out you have cast almost 3,000 votes but you have only left 4 comments. Many of those were surely low votes, So, what is your reason for not commenting more? If you examine your own reasons, you may then understand why others are not commenting on yours.

Message edited by author 2010-03-18 14:57:22.

Cory

Canon EOS-1D Mark IV

03/18/2010 03:02:48 PM · #5

I have a method for this...

Every time I get a comment, I go out and make 2-3 comments in return.

GeneralE

Canon PowerShot S3 IS

Canon 12x IS USM (S3 IS built-in Lens) -- 36-432mm (35mm EQ)

03/18/2010 03:11:21 PM · #6

Originally posted by coryboehne:

I have a method for this...

Every time I get a comment, I go out and make 2-3 comments in return.

Most people find that they learn more from the (thoughtful) comments they make than from those they receive -- it helps you zero in on what you think makes a good photograph, so that you can apply those criteria to your own efforts.

03/18/2010 03:37:07 PM · #7

Originally posted by Yo_Spiff:

I do feel that I must point out you have cast almost 3,000 votes but you have only left 4 comments. Many of those were surely low votes, So, what is your reason for not commenting more? If you examine your own reasons, you may then understand why others are not commenting on yours.

I know I'm not very good at photography, it's a hobby. So speaking to why I don't leave comments, it's my lack the confidence in saying what I think, cause in the end I'm really not any kind of expert.

So if that's the reason for everyone else not leaving a comment man do we all need a dose of confidence or what.. grin.

03/18/2010 03:51:28 PM · #8

I just got done doing my voting on Night Shot V, and I have to admit if I compare my photo to the group... it deserves to be low.

So.. how about this..

As this is my first night shot attempt, what are things you all do to do night shots.

I did do a tripod, it was almost a full second on the exposure.. If I can't get comments on the photo, give me your tricks here in the thread.. grin..

03/18/2010 03:54:28 PM · #9

GeneralE said earlier, commenting is a great way of homing in on what you do and don't like, and learning where you want to take your own photography. If you are diplomatic about why you don't care for an entry, most members will appreciate that feedback. Comments don't always need to be compliments or critiques either. I enjoy leaving idiotic and entertaining comments when something strikes my funnybone. I even seem to have developed a recurring character in my comments, Grog the caveman.

Canon 12x IS USM (S3 IS built-in Lens) -- 36-432mm (35mm EQ)

03/18/2010 04:00:08 PM · #10

Originally posted by Aarthek:

As this is my first night shot attempt, what are things you all do to do night shots.

I did do a tripod, it was almost a full second on the exposure.. If I can't get comments on the photo, give me your tricks here in the thread.. grin..

I think one of the big breakthroughs for me, which applies to any photograph, was learning to see the light as much as I saw the subject. Night shots can be tougher to pull off, but when you do, they can be wonderful eye candy.

Another thing I've realized is that this site proves you can't please everyone. In spite of my own night shot doing fairly well, it is also finding it's fair share of people who think it is not very good.

GeneralE

Canon PowerShot S3 IS

03/18/2010 04:02:25 PM · #11

Originally posted by Aarthek:

I did do a tripod, it was almost a full second on the exposure.. If I can't get comments on the photo, give me your tricks here in the thread.. grin..

I've gotten pretty positive comments on an image* shot at 2-second exposure, f8.0, ISO 80 -- used the timer to minimize camera shake. Main idea (worked!) was to minimize the noise by using a long exposure at low ISO setting.

You might also bracket your exposures for each setup (aperture, framing and zoom) -- I shot at 1, 2, 3.5, and 4 seconds for most of mine.

* Unfortunately, this image is not in the Night Shot Challenge ... :-(

kleski

Canon EOS-7D

Canon EF 28-135mm f/3.5-5.6 IS USM

03/18/2010 04:16:18 PM · #12

Originally posted by Aarthek:

Tripod is a must for long exposure of course...I like playing with the ISO and aperture as well. Some of my best night shots have been with a closed aperture and long exposure.

Notice the aperture is at 22, the ISO is at it's lowest setting for the Pentax K100d and the exposure is 10 seconds. Out of all my night shots this one is my favorite...

Nikon AF-S DX Zoom-Nikkor 55-200mm f/4-5.6G IF-ED VR

03/18/2010 04:19:28 PM · #13

Originally posted by kleski:

Originally posted by Aarthek:

As this is my first night shot attempt, what are things you all do to do night shots.

I did do a tripod, it was almost a full second on the exposure.. If I can't get comments on the photo, give me your tricks here in the thread.. grin..

Tripod is a must for long exposure of course...I like playing with the ISO and aperture as well. Some of my best night shots have been with a closed aperture and long exposure.

Notice the aperture is at 22, the ISO is at it's lowest setting for the Pentax K100d and the exposure is 10 seconds. Out of all my night shots this one is my favorite...

and just hope the horse doesn't move... grin

Luci11e

Nikon D40

03/18/2010 05:26:38 PM · #14

Originally posted by Aarthek:

Originally posted by Yo_Spiff:

I do feel that I must point out you have cast almost 3,000 votes but you have only left 4 comments. Many of those were surely low votes, So, what is your reason for not commenting more? If you examine your own reasons, you may then understand why others are not commenting on yours.

I know I'm not very good at photography, it's a hobby. So speaking to why I don't leave comments, it's my lack the confidence in saying what I think, cause in the end I'm really not any kind of expert.

So if that's the reason for everyone else not leaving a comment man do we all need a dose of confidence or what.. grin.

Aarthek,
When I first joined (not too long ago) I was intimdated at the thought of leaving comments as well - except on anything except "nice shot" comments. But I think I've gained alot in learning how to make a comment; to let someone know what I think could make their shot better; even if it's just my opinion; someone might learn something from it - you just never know! Sometimes it's hard to figure out exactly what your trying to say and you learn alot by that. And if there is a photo where I linger to try and make a decent comment (even though it may not turn out that way) I usually score that photo a little higher. After all, the photographer did catch my attention.

As for what I do on night shots (which I havent' done very many) I think it's helpful if you are able to acutally see what you're shooting first in the day light - that way you have a jump on the composure of the shot. If you have a helper they can also shine a light toward your subject so that you can see it through the viewfinder before snapping; but of course you have your camera on a tri-pod so sometimes you can do this for yourself.

OK, I'm done now except to say - go look at the branches challenge, pick out mine and leave a comment cause I only got one so far and I'm dying to know why this picture sucks so badly! I really thought it was pretty decent!

Cory

Canon EOS-1D Mark IV

Canon EF 85mm f/1.2L II USM

03/18/2010 05:33:41 PM · #15

Originally posted by GeneralE:

Originally posted by coryboehne:
I have a method for this...

Every time I get a comment, I go out and make 2-3 comments in return.

Most people find that they learn more from the (thoughtful) comments they make than from those they receive -- it helps you zero in on what you think makes a good photograph, so that you can apply those criteria to your own efforts.

Absolutely, and my thought is that if everyone left 2-3 comments for each one received, that would quickly snowball into one hell-of-a-lot of comments.

Too bad not many people realize this, instead, they make very few comments and then wonder why no-one else comments.. Essentially it's called a social feedback mechanism. *sigh*.

pedrobop

Canon PowerShot SX100 IS

Canon EF-S 18-135mm f/3.5-5.6 IS STM

03/18/2010 05:55:06 PM · #16

If i had the time i would comment every shot. But i voted in all 164 entries and left some comments. PM me or something after the challenge and i'll leave you a comment, helpfull or not :D!

kaiser_chief

Nikon D90

Nikon AF Zoom-Nikkor 28-105mm f/3.5-4.5D

03/18/2010 06:19:29 PM · #17

OK, first of all, night shots are something that I never used to be able to do, and marvelled at how others could. So when I got the D90, I went out and played around to see what I could get, and what all the different options were........Now I am a little better at them and still try a few things when shooting...........Many of my photos are 4sec or greater.....I always shoot on ISO200 (the lowest proper ISO the D90 does) at about F18......seems to work better than previous.

As for your image, start a thread after the voting finishes and you should get some comments. PM me (when the challenge finishes) as well cause I might miss the thread (a little busy at times) so I will then make sure I give feedback on your image.

Comments. When I started here I was a little hesitant, but then I got over that. I now try to keep my Comments Given to Comments received at a 3:1 ratio (or better)...while putting images into side challenges to get more comments. Best way to start with comments (IMHO) is tell the photographer
a) What you like about the image
b) What you don't like about the image
c) What you think could be improved so that you like the image more
Remember, even though you don't know all the technicals, it doesn't mean that your opinion is any less important. Some of my favourite images intentionally break many of the 'Rules'. If an image makes you think, then tell them that, because often that was the aim..........Give your impressions of the image and you will start then to analyse WHY you like images, and therefore what YOU want to do with your photography.

And always remember, your opinion is your opinion, it has no more meaning to me than anyone elses. You are telling the photographer WHY you do or don't like the image.........Some of the best Technical images here that I have seen I have hated, some of the worst technical images here I have Loved..........

Get out there and comment, learn and have fun.

GeneralE

Canon PowerShot S3 IS

Canon 12x IS USM (S3 IS built-in Lens) -- 36-432mm (35mm EQ)

03/18/2010 06:32:41 PM · #18

For those of you new to or hesitant about commenting, you might want to read these two site tutorials:
9 Guidelines for Giving and Receiving Feedback

Commenting For Beginners (A Non-Analytical Approach)

Basically, your opinions are sacrosanct, your advice less so. If this was your landscape/sky photo, "feel" the difference between

Originally posted by Comment Comparison #1:

"You should do some Dodging/Burning to add detail to the clouds"
and
"On my monitor the clouds look a bit more washed-out than I'd prefer -- I find them an important part of the composition"

Originally posted by Comment Comparison #2:

"Poor composition -- this photo begs for a square crop"
and
"I think a tighter crop on the ___ on the left -- maybe even a square crop -- would help draw me into this image; as it is, I find the ___ on the right distracting"

I think it's fine to comment on whether or not you like something, or how it makes you feel, but I never assume that anything is a "mistake" -- either the photographer intended it to look exactly as it does, or found it impossible to "fix" within the applicable DPC ruleset.

In a similar fashion to how we apply the Request Validatation rule (request & vote as if legal), I consider any "flaws" (blown highlights, OOF, too dark/light, etc.) to be deliberate choices, not mistakes. If later the photographer wants/needs suggestions for fixing anything, they can start a thread on "How Do I Keep The Clouds From Washing-Out?" or whatever.

If you take even minimal care to phrase your opinions politely (and as opinions), and refrain from telling people what they've "done wrong" and how to fix it, I can almost guarantee that you will not receive any "hate-mail" PMs. If you do, simply report it (via the Ticket system" and delete it from your inbox -- such a PM would violate site rules and the SC will deal with the miscreant ...

03/18/2010 07:10:09 PM · #19

Originally posted by GeneralE:

If you take even minimal care to phrase your opinions politely (and as opinions), and refrain from telling people what they've "done wrong" and how to fix it, I can almost guarantee that you will not receive any "hate-mail" PMs.

I agree. I've either been diplomatic or just lucky. The general knows I've left my share of critiques and I have not yet gotten any nastygrams. I have gotten a few thank you's for letting someone know why their entry was bombing out. (Now I'll probably receive a PM cussing me out for a comment later tonight!)