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01/19/2009 04:38:59 PM · #1 |
Is everyone afraid of giving too many high scores? I feel like my "Best of 2008" entry is waaaaay better than my "Life III" entry, but its current score is LOWER (5.1867 vs. 5.2099). How is this possible? If they were in the same challenge, this one would've fared way better. Is everyone afraid of giving out too many high scores and too few low scores? Is everyone afraid of giving an average vote of 7 or 8 because the "normal" average vote is a 5 or 6? C'mon guys, it's the "Best of" challenge - it's SUPPOSED to have a lot of high-scoring images. Is my "showcase" image* really going to get a lower score than a snapshot in a zoo*?
What's your take? How do you vote? Do you find that you're scoring "Best of" challenges with an average vote in mind, or with a lot of good images getting 2s and 3s?
*My "showcase" image is a well-exposed image with good composition and about 1 hour of post processing; my "snapshot in a zoo" (find it in my "Challenge Entries" if you wish; not trying to get pageviews here, just for comparison) wasn't really a snapshot, but it was taken over a fence, looks like a snapshot, and took about 5 minutes to edit (I think all I did was Crop, Shadows/Highlights, and Levels).
...sorry for the rant.
Message edited by author 2009-01-19 16:40:04. |
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01/19/2009 04:46:29 PM · #2 |
Well... You got what, 500 entries, give-or-take? And as a voter, you see maybe what, a dozen of them you would like to see be the winners? And another what, 30-40 you think are really damned good, compared to the competition? See what I'm getting at? It's a COMPETITION. What point would it make to rank everything at the top of the scale? So the scoring is REALLY tough in this event.
I mean, I have reasonably high standards, I made a shot I thought of as a shoo-in for my best of the year entry, and it's barely cracking 6.0... It's, in my mind, a better shot than most of my 7+ entries. So it goes....
R.
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01/19/2009 05:00:55 PM · #3 |
| I can tell you that my own average vote given is way higher than usual. I've been handing out a lot of 7's. Was looking at a mid 6 score for a while, but I guess the harsher voters are now coming out. I suppose many people rate relative to the challenge. I try to rate the image on it's own merits. |
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01/19/2009 05:02:13 PM · #4 |
| 10 does not equal 1st place... I rate the images and go from there... |
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01/19/2009 05:18:40 PM · #5 |
The way I rate all challenges, by looking at the technical aspects and composition, as well as the message conveyed in each picture.
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01/19/2009 05:39:48 PM · #6 |
Well, I give 1 ten, 1 nine, 1 eight, 1 seven, etc. The rest of you get zero's.
Nah, just kidding! |
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01/19/2009 05:48:18 PM · #7 |
| i rate everything the same, but theres just alot more great photos, so my average vote given is higher then normal. i dont feel that the amount of good photos changes each of my individual votes though |
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01/19/2009 05:53:47 PM · #8 |
I agree in what your saying, but it's also the problem. We don't have a standard 'voting' criteria. Some vote as you explained and hit the 20% requirement and stop. Then voters like myself that vote on all images on there own merit and let the winner take care of it 'self'. I'm starting to beleive because it is a competition. We need a 'voting' standard. You vote like a judge on the top 20% and stop. But the other 80% would like to be part of the competition or a least get average vote for playing.....there's problem..imo
Originally posted by Bear_Music:
Well... You got what, 500 entries, give-or-take? And as a voter, you see maybe what, a dozen of them you would like to see be the winners? And another what, 30-40 you think are really damned good, compared to the competition? See what I'm getting at? It's a COMPETITION. What point would it make to rank everything at the top of the scale? So the scoring is REALLY tough in this event.
I mean, I have reasonably high standards, I made a shot I thought of as a shoo-in for my best of the year entry, and it's barely cracking 6.0... It's, in my mind, a better shot than most of my 7+ entries. So it goes....
R. |
Message edited by author 2009-01-19 18:17:54. |
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01/19/2009 06:27:25 PM · #9 |
Originally posted by ace flyman:
You vote like a judge on the top 20% and stop. But the other 80% would like to be part of the competition or a least get average vote for playing.....there's problem..imo |
If you vote them in the order they are presented to you (as I do) then 'voting' 20% will be randomized among the voters and should still average out. If one cherry picks thumbnails, then they are indeed skewing the 'voting'. I prefer to do my 20% or so, but I do more commenting on those. |
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01/19/2009 06:28:20 PM · #10 |
I agree, I think that everyone should vote 100% I think that teh 20% is a bunch of crap.
Now for myself, on the Best of the Best for 2008 challenge, O voted as though this was the bestest photo that a person could enter, this is where they should shine as there are no boundary's bar the editing.
SO I was a little harder than I am normally, because I know that I entered a shot that I worked hard on and tried to make it as perfect as I could, |
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01/19/2009 06:41:31 PM · #11 |
nice candid, beautiful eyes, but unfortunately not strong enough for a best of 2008 image...sorry :(
There is definitely more scrutiny in this challenge but that is to be expected. I posted this comment I got because because this person felt as though I didn't choose a good enough image. Who are they to judge? They don't know my portfolio for the year, and obviously this entry was the one I thought was best. Not expecting a reaction for this, I just think voters should try to think what was going through the person's mind when the entered their image, as I try my best to do. |
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01/19/2009 06:48:50 PM · #12 |
I think that everyone posted their best shot, if that is the best that they can do then that is best they can do. But they have to remember that their best may not be the best that another person see's. there are some amazing shots out there and they will get compared to those as well.
So saying that is your best shot, well that is great, but don't get butt hurt when other people score higher because those photo are superior. |
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01/19/2009 06:51:27 PM · #13 |
I know! it's as if the voters/commenters are saying "this POS is the best you could do? Shame on you!" They don't know me!
Aside from all that noise, I expect the landscape-with-sunset group to dominate the first page. I never had a hope of rising above the last page, but I entered anyway. Somebody has to loose, right? |
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01/19/2009 06:53:00 PM · #14 |
| i wanted to get in the top 200. that was my only goal. i guess i just have to hope theres a hell of alot of 4s and 5s out there:/ |
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01/19/2009 07:00:35 PM · #15 |
I beleive the folks who vote only 20% skip the random order. I wouldn't call it cherry picking because we don't have a standard 'voting' policy other than the min. 20% rule.
Originally posted by yospiff:
Originally posted by ace flyman:
You vote like a judge on the top 20% and stop. But the other 80% would like to be part of the competition or a least get average vote for playing.....there's problem..imo |
If you vote them in the order they are presented to you (as I do) then 'voting' 20% will be randomized among the voters and should still average out. If one cherry picks thumbnails, then they are indeed skewing the 'voting'. I prefer to do my 20% or so, but I do more commenting on those. |
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01/19/2009 07:52:53 PM · #16 |
Originally posted by JulietNN:
I think that everyone posted their best shot, if that is the best that they can do then that is best they can do. But they have to remember that their best may not be the best that another person see's. there are some amazing shots out there and they will get compared to those as well.
So saying that is your best shot, well that is great, but don't get butt hurt when other people score higher because those photo are superior. |
I know my image isn't the best in the challenge (as do others), but to say that my entry isn't even good enough for the challenge is being a bit rude, don't you think? |
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01/19/2009 07:56:09 PM · #17 |
Originally posted by Blue Moon:
Originally posted by JulietNN:
I think that everyone posted their best shot, if that is the best that they can do then that is best they can do. But they have to remember that their best may not be the best that another person see's. there are some amazing shots out there and they will get compared to those as well.
So saying that is your best shot, well that is great, but don't get butt hurt when other people score higher because those photo are superior. |
I know my image isn't the best in the challenge (as do others), but to say that my entry isn't even good enough for the challenge is being a bit rude, don't you think? |
i know i am such a hypocrit for saying this, but you really cant let it bother you. some people on this site either dont care if they hurt your feelings or are just very blunt and dont realize it(usually they do). so yeh, its a rude comment. but just cuss at it a little bit and then ignore it forever
Message edited by author 2009-01-19 19:56:31. |
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01/19/2009 08:12:22 PM · #18 |
Originally posted by Blue Moon:
Originally posted by JulietNN:
I think that everyone posted their best shot, if that is the best that they can do then that is best they can do. But they have to remember that their best may not be the best that another person see's. there are some amazing shots out there and they will get compared to those as well.
So saying that is your best shot, well that is great, but don't get butt hurt when other people score higher because those photo are superior. |
I know my image isn't the best in the challenge (as do others), but to say that my entry isn't even good enough for the challenge is being a bit rude, don't you think? |
I know that i didn't say that, adn taht can be construed as rude.
But what I am saying is that some peoples best are not up to par with some of the other photos that are up there. If you didn't want to be challengened by others, then why bother.
edited to add: People are always whining about not getting comments, or getting comments that say "great shot' and always whine about not having comments that give them something to work with , something to improve their shots.
so now you have a comment and you don't like it, well isn't it better than no comment, are you not going to learn from your comment.
YOu put your best out there, deal with it without whining too much
you bothered because it was the best of your year. But you entered a shot into the Best of 2008, so you are competing with others that may or may not have had a better year and you are complaining that they don't know that this is your best shot. HOw is anyone supposed to know.
I am not trying ot be mean, but look at it from a different point of view
Message edited by author 2009-01-19 20:21:49. |
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01/19/2009 09:19:23 PM · #19 |
Originally posted by ace flyman:
I beleive the folks who vote only 20% skip the random order. I wouldn't call it cherry picking because we don't have a standard 'voting' policy other than the min. 20% rule. |
How is 'voting' the first 20% of a randomly ordered set on entries skipping? I can do it several ways:
-Vote 100% on all challenges, comment on a couple of entries I think are great, and leave it to the others to guess at why I thought their great entry was only worth a 4 or 5.
-Comment and vote heavily in fewer challenges. This deprives me, as I enjoy seeing how the different topics are approached, even if I don't see them all, I get a good sample of inspiration and ideas.
-Continue as I am doing. The PM's I receive suggest the heavy commenting is useful and appreciated, and everything I have heard before this suggests that we all get a different random order. If someone can show me that we don't get a random order and I am skewing the vote, then I may change my method.
Added: Oh, I think I understand your quoted statement now. You are suggesting most of the 20% voters are clicking and 'voting' on the thumbnails that interest them. I don't do that. In fact, sometimes I get stuck on a pic because I am giving it a 4 or 5 and I feel obligated to explain the vote. I'll then stop 'voting' and come back to it later. I'm going to leave my previous response in place even though I misunderstood what you were saying. It's still insight into why I vote the way I do. |
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01/19/2009 09:27:27 PM · #20 |
Originally posted by ace flyman:
I beleive the folks who vote only 20% skip the random order. I wouldn't call it cherry picking because we don't have a standard 'voting' policy other than the min. 20% rule. |
Umm.......I'd be willing to bet that pretty much all of the few of us who have dialup, and have a hellacious effort doing the 20% on a huge field like this, don't cherry pick!
Message edited by author 2009-01-19 21:32:11.
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01/19/2009 09:34:40 PM · #21 |
Originally posted by JulietNN:
I agree, I think that everyone should vote 100% I think that teh 20% is a bunch of crap. |
Some of us have lives.
If I had to vote 100% on every challenge, I just couldn't do it.
You'd see a major exodus, methinks.
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01/19/2009 09:37:56 PM · #22 |
Originally posted by JulietNN:
I think that everyone posted their best shot, if that is the best that they can do then that is best they can do. But they have to remember that their best may not be the best that another person see's. there are some amazing shots out there and they will get compared to those as well.
So saying that is your best shot, well that is great, but don't get butt hurt when other people score higher because those photo are superior. |
The images aren't necessarily superior just because they win here.....they just did well.......HERE.
My image is carrying a 6.1.......I'm mildly amused since it has gotten first places in a couple of contests in my local area, one of which got me a $300 prize.
What do I care if it doesn't win here?
SOB!
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01/19/2009 09:44:18 PM · #23 |
Originally posted by JulietNN:
I think that everyone posted their best shot, if that is the best that they can do then that is best they can do. But they have to remember that their best may not be the best that another person see's. there are some amazing shots out there and they will get compared to those as well.
So saying that is your best shot, well that is great, but don't get butt hurt when other people score higher because those photo are superior. |
Originally posted by Blue Moon:
I know my image isn't the best in the challenge (as do others), but to say that my entry isn't even good enough for the challenge is being a bit rude, don't you think? |
You should go read the thread on the recent Masters Challenge.
There were people right and left talking about the utter crap that was being proffered by the supposed masters of the site.
Just so warm and fuzzy here sometimes!!!!!!
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01/19/2009 09:48:59 PM · #24 |
| I just push random numbers and hope for the best. |
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01/19/2009 09:49:46 PM · #25 |
There is many reasons why folks just vote the min. 20% and like I said there is no rule so there is no cherry picking. Jeb you comment a ton and that's how you give back. I'm not a big comment person, so I contribute by 'voting' on all images. There is no right or wrong. There is two big complaints here most of the time. 1. lack of voter turn out. 2. limited amount of comments. OOPs 3rd one is low scores. Like Bear said this is a competition, so live with the lower scores, learn from it and move on.
Originally posted by NikonJeb:
Originally posted by ace flyman:
I beleive the folks who vote only 20% skip the random order. I wouldn't call it cherry picking because we don't have a standard 'voting' policy other than the min. 20% rule. |
Umm.......I'd be willing to bet that pretty much all of the few of us who have dialup, and have a hellacious effort doing the 20% on a huge field like this, don't cherry pick! |
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