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01/14/2009 07:48:24 PM · #26 |
| When this challenge was first announced I questioned whether people would DNMC just food. Those who replied felt there would be those who voted that way. I wasn't going to enter but at almost the last minute I did. I now have my second highest score on this site (6.2198) Not great for most here but pretty darn good for me. So if people are voting down just food they haven't effected my score. I did receive one comment indicating the photo was not of "cooking". |
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01/14/2009 07:53:11 PM · #27 |
| Maybe the challenge description could have been more clear-cut. For example, IMAGE MUST PORTRAY ACT OF COOKING. Im not really b*tching. I was just making idle chat about the challenge. There are several really great images, most of just food. So, we'll see how the cookie crumbles (pun intended...) |
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01/14/2009 08:30:13 PM · #28 |
"Act" is the correct word if they wanted to lend meaning to the Challenge. Now there's nothing. "Art" was a very slight loophole if you were looking for one, even though the Challenge was pretty clear. Cooking is cooking but the word art blew a very, very thin cloud over what was otherwise a straightforward, no brainer. If you are trying to teach people how to do a specific type/style of shot...a Stock image like "People Eating" or "Cooking", it's a business call and it could have been a great Challenge based on that, IF they stuck to it. I read the description and it's clear what they were looking for.
To the SC that said ".... What you SHOULD take from it is that the challenge is the topic, and the description is usually less important- often irrelevant, and sometimes even contradictory" I would say don't waste peoples time with descriptions because some people actually spend time and energy adhering them and it's an insult when anything goes, in the end. I won't bother with Challenges. They're ridiculous if they have no direction.
You stick to a description, author it well and get better results. Otherwise the whole exercise is a joke.
Take a Grilled Chicken Caesar Salad, to make a point. There's ONE shot in the final product but in creating the dish....yeah, COOKING(!) you could have a picture of
Grilling the Chicken
Making the dressing
Squeezing the Lemon
Shaving the Parmesan
Cutting the Romaine
Washing the Romaine (Hey! A Waterdrop Opportunity...go figure)
Dressing the Salad
Tossing the Salad
Plating the Salad
anything else...?
All cool shots and in the preparation of one simple dish alone, there's an 8 to 1 shot ratio, prep to the "final plate". Cooking all by itself couldn't have been more wide open. To every final dish there are hundreds of moves and techniques.
Did I limit anybody there? Box anybody in? Don't think so. Not to mention they are ALL highly valuable stock shots. Look at any Red Lobster, Olive Garden, Burger King Ads... Print, Internet or TV commercial and you'll see that entire shot list back and forth.
That's a learning experience, that pays. It was a Stock Challenge...wasn't it?
All for now.
Message edited by author 2009-01-14 21:19:26. |
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01/14/2009 09:53:16 PM · #29 |
Originally posted by pawdrix:
"Act" is the correct word if they wanted to lend meaning to the Challenge. Now there's nothing. "Art" was a very slight loophole if you were looking for one, even though the Challenge was pretty clear. Cooking is cooking but the word art blew a very, very thin cloud over what was otherwise a straightforward, no brainer. If you are trying to teach people how to do a specific type/style of shot...a Stock image like "People Eating" or "Cooking", it's a business call and it could have been a great Challenge based on that, IF they stuck to it. I read the description and it's clear what they were looking for.
To the SC that said ".... What you SHOULD take from it is that the challenge is the topic, and the description is usually less important- often irrelevant, and sometimes even contradictory" I would say don't waste peoples time with descriptions because some people actually spend time and energy adhering them and it's an insult when anything goes, in the end. I won't bother with Challenges. They're ridiculous if they have no direction.
You stick to a description, author it well and get better results. Otherwise the whole exercise is a joke.
Take a Grilled Chicken Caesar Salad, to make a point. There's ONE shot in the final product but in creating the dish....yeah, COOKING(!) you could have a picture of
Grilling the Chicken
Making the dressing
Squeezing the Lemon
Shaving the Parmesan
Cutting the Romaine
Washing the Romaine (Hey! A Waterdrop Opportunity...go figure)
Dressing the Salad
Tossing the Salad
Plating the Salad
anything else...?
All cool shots and in the preparation of one simple dish alone, there's an 8 to 1 shot ratio, prep to the "final plate". Cooking all by itself couldn't have been more wide open. To every final dish there are hundreds of moves and techniques.
Did I limit anybody there? Box anybody in? Don't think so. Not to mention they are ALL highly valuable stock shots. Look at any Red Lobster, Olive Garden, Burger King Ads... Print, Internet or TV commercial and you'll see that entire shot list back and forth.
That's a learning experience, that pays. It was a Stock Challenge...wasn't it?
All for now. |
But could also include the ingredients on display -- that is 150% appropriate to the theme.
Basically this is a food open challenge and should be voted that way. So long as it's a "STOCK" worthy photo. |
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01/14/2009 10:23:14 PM · #30 |
Originally posted by HawkeyeLonewolf:
But could also include the ingredients on display -- that is 150% appropriate to the theme.
Basically this is a food open challenge and should be voted that way. So long as it's a "STOCK" worthy photo. |
I disagree with you here. I don't see how this could be considered an open food challenge when the description is very specific. The challenge description says nothing about ingredients, so I don't understand how that would help show the art of cooking... unless they were being sautéed or something.
I had a great shot I wanted to enter, but when I actually read the challenge description last night I didn't enter it because it wasn't being cooked.
I want to pop up the description on more time and focus on two words... LESS POPULAR
A LESS POPULAR stock topic, but necessary nonetheless: Cooking. Come up with a unique and effective way to capture the art of cooking (food) such that it could be used on a website or on a brochure.
It seems pretty clear to me that they are asking for stock images of the LESS POPULAR process of cooking and not the basic POPULAR food images. Do a simple search on istock for cooking and you will see how LESS POPULAR actual cooking images are... bad English I know, but I was trying to prove a point...
I am usually VERY open minded about challenge entries, but I am guessing most people didn't read the description for this one or just figured the voters wouldn't pay attention or care. That being said, I think DNMC comments are warranted for the majority of images in this particular challenge.
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01/14/2009 10:40:20 PM · #31 |
Maybe SC should take a look and some of this thread can be moved to the rant section.
Back to scores people - after all this is a SCORES thread and you can't argue with that. (although you probably will)
Votes: 106
Views: 185
Avg Vote: 6.4057
Comments: 12
Favorites: 0
Wish Lists: 0
Updated: 01/14/09 10:35 pm |
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01/14/2009 11:17:58 PM · #32 |
Originally posted by toddhead:
Originally posted by HawkeyeLonewolf:
But could also include the ingredients on display -- that is 150% appropriate to the theme.
Basically this is a food open challenge and should be voted that way. So long as it's a "STOCK" worthy photo. |
I disagree with you here. I don't see how this could be considered an open food challenge when the description is very specific. The challenge description says nothing about ingredients, so I don't understand how that would help show the art of cooking... unless they were being sautéed or something.
I had a great shot I wanted to enter, but when I actually read the challenge description last night I didn't enter it because it wasn't being cooked.
I want to pop up the description on more time and focus on two words... LESS POPULAR
A LESS POPULAR stock topic, but necessary nonetheless: Cooking. Come up with a unique and effective way to capture the art of cooking (food) such that it could be used on a website or on a brochure.
It seems pretty clear to me that they are asking for stock images of the LESS POPULAR process of cooking and not the basic POPULAR food images. Do a simple search on istock for cooking and you will see how LESS POPULAR actual cooking images are... bad English I know, but I was trying to prove a point...
I am usually VERY open minded about challenge entries, but I am guessing most people didn't read the description for this one or just figured the voters wouldn't pay attention or care. That being said, I think DNMC comments are warranted for the majority of images in this particular challenge. |
Do you or do you not use ingredients in cooking? You certainly do. A recipe begins with a list of ingredients. So I don't see how anyone could possibly force such a narrow definition of the general theme given.
"A less popular stock topic, but necessary nonetheless: Cooking. Come up with a unique and effective way to capture the art of cooking (food) such that it could be used on a website or on a brochure."
There are many aspects to cooking, not just mixing things in a pan.
Ingredients, preparation, plating, serving -- all CLEARLY part of cooking. Look at ANY cooking show, book, magazine.
One thing of interest, since someone started whining on this thread, it seems that scores have been dropping as people think they are being forced into a narrow-minded view of the challenge. |
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01/15/2009 07:24:10 AM · #33 |
I am torn on this subject...the description did say "the art" of cooking. But, when it comes to a stock photo regarding cooking, it covers all of food...shots of the ingredients, the preparation, the actual cooking and the finished product. Look at a site like Martha Stewarts...she has each of those stages of cooking images spread all over.
But, what a stock buyer is usually looking for is most likely something very broad that could fit most situations of their cooking subject. A finished product is very specific...almost like a menu item.
So, it looks like I am not helping here...it turns out, as usual, the answer is very subjective!!!
Message edited by author 2009-01-15 08:01:13. |
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01/15/2009 07:30:14 AM · #34 |
Originally posted by mileskea:
Well so far so good:
Votes: 15
Views: 26
Avg Vote: 5.8667
Comments: 0
Favorites: 0
Wish Lists: 0
Long way to go though! |
Slipped but not much:
Votes: 109
Views: 164
Avg Vote: 5.7523
Comments: 1
Favorites: 1
Picked up a favourite!!
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01/15/2009 11:06:25 AM · #35 |
Originally posted by HawkeyeLonewolf:
Originally posted by toddhead:
[quote=HawkeyeLonewolf]
I want to pop up the description on more time and focus on two words... LESS POPULAR
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Do you or do you not use ingredients in cooking? You certainly do. A recipe begins with a list of ingredients. So I don't see how anyone could possibly force such a narrow definition of the general theme given.
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Todd hit it on the head, when he brings forth the words "Less Popular" simply because Food and Food Prduct shots are exremely popular. People can mangle it any way the want apparently but it's clear what they were looking for with or without the word "art".
A straight picture of a Tomato would not be an example of "cooking" tomatoes. The Challenge is about the act of cooking.
I'm a Chef. I buy products from catalogues, specialty purveyors and I do culinary related photography, as well. I've also developed sales materials (menus, websites, brochures) and I knew exactly what they meant and the role the specific image needed to play the instant the Challenge was announced.
If a client that's opening a Computer Training Center was looking for stock shots of Classroom Teaching for a website, a picture of a book would not satisfy his need. Cooking is cooking, eating is eating, shoping is shoping, ingredients are ingredients and FWIW the act of cooking is an art.
Another example would be a shot of a people eating (enjoying food)..."Eating". I guess some folks think a picture of a fork would work? Big difference.
Message edited by author 2009-01-15 11:30:51. |
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01/15/2009 11:16:08 AM · #36 |
Originally posted by pawdrix:
Originally posted by HawkeyeLonewolf:
Originally posted by toddhead:
[quote=HawkeyeLonewolf]
I want to pop up the description on more time and focus on two words... LESS POPULAR
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Do you or do you not use ingredients in cooking? You certainly do. A recipe begins with a list of ingredients. So I don't see how anyone could possibly force such a narrow definition of the general theme given.
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Todd hit it on the head, when he brings forth the words "Less Popular" simple because Food and Food Prduct shots are exremely popular. People can mangle it any way the want apparently but it's clear what they were looking for with or without the word "art".
A straight picture of a Tomato would not be an example of "cooking" tomatoes. The Challenge is about the act of cooking.
I'm a Chef. I buy products from catalogues, specialty purveyors and I do culinary related photography, as well. I've also developed sales materials (menus, websites, brochures) and I knew exactly what they meant and the role the specific image needed to play the instant the Challenge was announced.
If a client that's opening a Computer Training Center was looking for stock shots of Classroom Teaching for a website, a picture of a book would not satisfy his need. Cooking is cooking, eating is eating, shoping is shoping, ingredients are ingredients and FWIW the act of cooking is an art.
Another example would be a shot of a people eating (enjoying food)..."Eating". I guess some folks think a picture of a fork would work? Big difference. |
Welcome to the world of narrow views. |
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01/15/2009 11:35:07 AM · #37 |
Originally posted by HawkeyeLonewolf:
Welcome to the world of narrow views. |
Uhhh, NO!
Between the two of us, I happen to make a living at this topic and I know the difference between a noun and a verb.
eta: If you read my earlier post I also pointed out hundreds of potential cooking image possibilities and within those hundred are even more takes on the act of cooking. I'm not narrow...just following instructions.
Applt Tarte/Pie...
Peeling Apples
Sliceing/Dicing Apples
Rolling Dough
Cutting Dough Strips
Measuring the ingredients
Mixing Dough
Crimping the edges of the pie
Making a Lattice Pattern w/Dough
taking the hot product from the oven...
Get the picture. That's a large set of possibilities though "Less Popular" than the finished product and not too terribly narrow if you think about it. There's a lot to shoot so narrowness doesn't come into play. Some people just want to call the act of cooking whatever they want but from my experience, shooting for actual clients, in hope of getting a pay check, at the end of the day it's a specific thing (genre) and the essence of the Challenge. Shoot an ingredient...just stick a knife through it first.
Also as Todd noted the reason why the searches turned up less images of people cooking is exactly because they ARE "less popular" so here was an opportunity to expolre why and how to make a buck shooting action shots.
Good Luck.
Message edited by author 2009-01-15 13:06:19. |
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01/15/2009 01:15:39 PM · #38 |
Originally posted by pawdrix:
Originally posted by HawkeyeLonewolf:
Welcome to the world of narrow views. |
Uhhh, NO!
Between the two of us, I happen to make a living at this topic and I know the difference between a noun and a verb.
eta: If you read my earlier post I also pointed out hundreds of potential cooking image possibilities and within those hundred are even more takes on the act of cooking. I'm not narrow...just following instructions.
Applt Tarte/Pie...
Peeling Apples
Sliceing/Dicing Apples
Rolling Dough
Cutting Dough Strips
Measuring the ingredients
Mixing Dough
Crimping the edges of the pie
Making a Lattice Pattern w/Dough
taking the hot product from the oven...
Get the picture. That's a large set of possibilities though "Less Popular" than the finished product and not too terribly narrow if you think about it. There's a lot to shoot so narrowness doesn't come into play. Some people just want to call the act of cooking whatever they want but from my experience, shooting for actual clients, in hope of getting a pay check, at the end of the day it's a specific thing (genre) and the essence of the Challenge. Shoot an ingredient...just stick a knife through it first.
Also as Todd noted the reason why the searches turned up less images of people cooking is exactly because they ARE "less popular" so here was an opportunity to expolre why and how to make a buck shooting action shots.
Good Luck. |
And you were corrected on this matter... In the common general sense the ART OF COOKING involves prep, ingredients, applying "heat" or "cold", plating, serving, etc... If you go to cooking school, do they not teach you prep and ingredient selection and properties? If so, then how dare they call it a COOKING school (by your narrow view).
In the NARROW sense cooking involved the actual act of cooking, which the topic theme did NOT specify, as we've seen by reading the text of it. And if we stick to your NARROW view, then Baking would obviously be excluded, since I've heard countless chefs decry that they cannot bake but they can cook because they are different.
No, no matter how you slice it, you took the challenge theme and applied a narrow definition, which I've always contended would be your right. I just hope you're not poisoning the rest of the voters with your narrow view.
A quick search of actual stock photo sites reveals this to be true... Actual cooking, prep, ingredients, etc...
//us.fotolia.com/search?k=cooking&order=relevance
//www.istockphoto.com/file_search.php?text=cooking&action=file
//www.shutterstock.com/cat.mhtml?lang=en&searchterm=cooking&anyorall=all&search_cat=&search_group=photos&orient=all&photographer_name=&searchtermx=&color= |
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01/15/2009 01:28:59 PM · #39 |
Originally posted by HawkeyeLonewolf:
Welcome to the world of narrow views. |
Because I can read and understand a description my views are narrow? I think you are the one being narrow minded here. You won't even consider the fact that the challenge might have actually been designed to get actual cooking shots.
I'll tell you what... if you can convince me that a basic stock shot of a red pepper or an apple isn't a POPULAR shot I will change my mind and come over to your side. |
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01/15/2009 01:30:50 PM · #40 |
Originally posted by toddhead:
Originally posted by HawkeyeLonewolf:
Welcome to the world of narrow views. |
Because I can read and understand a description my views are narrow? I think you are the one being narrow minded here. You won't even consider the fact that the challenge might have actually been designed to get actual cooking shots.
I'll tell you what... if you can convince me that a basic stock shot of a red pepper or an apple isn't a POPULAR shot I will change my mind and come over to your side. |
Sorry, I'm just going by the description in the challenge and it's been explained in other posts. I don't need to convince YOU, just put up a valid position so that other voters don't get misled. |
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01/15/2009 02:15:04 PM · #41 |
Originally posted by HawkeyeLonewolf:
just put up a valid position so that other voters don't get misled. |
Sorry if you think your score is suffering because of DNMC's, but PERSONALLY I think you are misleading voters. |
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01/15/2009 02:41:00 PM · #42 |
Originally posted by HawkeyeLonewolf:
And you were corrected on this matter... In the common general sense the ART OF COOKING involves prep, ingredients, applying "heat" or "cold", plating, serving, etc... If you go to cooking school, do they not teach you prep and ingredient selection and properties? If so, then how dare they call it a COOKING school (by your narrow view).
In the NARROW sense cooking involved the actual act of cooking, which the topic theme did NOT specify, as we've seen by reading the text of it. And if we stick to your NARROW view, then Baking would obviously be excluded, since I've heard countless chefs decry that they cannot bake but they can cook because they are different.
No, no matter how you slice it, you took the challenge theme and applied a narrow definition, which I've always contended would be your right. I just hope you're not poisoning the rest of the voters with your narrow view.
A quick search of actual stock photo sites reveals this to be true... Actual cooking, prep, ingredients, etc... |
I wasn't corrected. All those cheapo stock searches show is how people keyword or use meta data...INCORRECTLY. It only shows how to get hits in a random search.
The art of anything involves many things but those things don't necessarily represent the action itself. Outside of that I won't bother to unravel the logic that led to your cooking school statement.
I spoke no less than 10 minutes ago with a guy I know from Grey Advertising (now freelancing) who's starting a small production company and he mentioned a photog friend that did a job that needed an entire reshoot because he didn't get what he wanted. The guy didn't listen and at a $1000 a day that doesn't fly. Dare I mention...DARE I mention he wanted images of people working and those were what he didn't get. He got some exec portraits...some exteriors...and some product but fell short on the Cooking.
No I have a job. You're telling me my business and I'm telling you you're wrong.
Good Luck with your mantra...
Message edited by author 2009-01-15 14:43:45. |
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01/15/2009 02:51:00 PM · #43 |
I dont mean to interupt the food fight and I do have some mashed potatos left over from dinner last night if I have to defend myself but I would just like to post scores if I can.
Votes: 123
Views: 195
Avg Vote: 6.6341
Comments: 8
(What is so weird about this is it is the exact score of my Life picture other then the last number in Life being a 9 (6.6349). The votes are almost the same to. My Life is at 126.) |
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01/15/2009 02:52:25 PM · #44 |
Originally posted by toddhead:
Originally posted by HawkeyeLonewolf:
just put up a valid position so that other voters don't get misled. |
Sorry if you think your score is suffering because of DNMC's, but PERSONALLY I think you are misleading voters. |
So far, no DNMC. But thanks. |
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01/15/2009 02:53:23 PM · #45 |
Originally posted by pawdrix:
Originally posted by HawkeyeLonewolf:
And you were corrected on this matter... In the common general sense the ART OF COOKING involves prep, ingredients, applying "heat" or "cold", plating, serving, etc... If you go to cooking school, do they not teach you prep and ingredient selection and properties? If so, then how dare they call it a COOKING school (by your narrow view).
In the NARROW sense cooking involved the actual act of cooking, which the topic theme did NOT specify, as we've seen by reading the text of it. And if we stick to your NARROW view, then Baking would obviously be excluded, since I've heard countless chefs decry that they cannot bake but they can cook because they are different.
No, no matter how you slice it, you took the challenge theme and applied a narrow definition, which I've always contended would be your right. I just hope you're not poisoning the rest of the voters with your narrow view.
A quick search of actual stock photo sites reveals this to be true... Actual cooking, prep, ingredients, etc... |
I wasn't corrected. All those cheapo stock searches show is how people keyword or use meta data...INCORRECTLY. It only shows how to get hits in a random search.
The art of anything involves many things but those things don't necessarily represent the action itself. Outside of that I won't bother to unravel the logic that led to your cooking school statement.
I spoke no less than 10 minutes ago with a guy I know from Grey Advertising (now freelancing) who's starting a small production company and he mentioned a photog friend that did a job that needed an entire reshoot because he didn't get what he wanted. The guy didn't listen and at a $1000 a day that doesn't fly. Dare I mention...DARE I mention he wanted images of people working and those were what he didn't get. He got some exec portraits...some exteriors...and some product but fell short on the Cooking.
No I have a job. You're telling me my business and I'm telling you you're wrong.
Good Luck with your mantra... |
Sorry, you're still wrong. THe MAIN theme was STOCK, the subtheme was Cooking. So clearly it should be, based on the description, a STOCK PHOTO ABOUT COOKING.
Enough said. |
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01/15/2009 03:00:41 PM · #46 |
"A less popular stock topic, but necessary nonetheless: Cooking. Come up with a unique and effective way to capture the art of cooking (food) such that it could be used on a website or on a brochure".
Hmmm....
If one wanted photos of the "Act of Photography" then a photo of a lens on a desk wouldn't cut it. And since the challenge says "Art of.." I guess I wouldn't expect a photo of a lens would depict the Art of Photography either.... A photo of the "act of creating the art" might fly, if well done and clear. But a photo of a lens or lens cleaning brush or a memory card wouldn't cut it.
So, in general, I think that since the challenge description clearly states "...art of cooking" it could very reasonably be interpreted to include the action (implying/depicting artistic skill), the artist, and/or the result. Photos of ingredients or say, a shopping list (none in the challenge, so not singling anyone out), seem like a wider interpretation of the theme--if very well done, will still probably do okay on scores, though.
I am not a member of the small but vocal DNMC Police Squad, and so I don't worry about it much--the voters generally do recognize the difference between an obvious shoehorn entry and a well-done, creative interpretation of the theme, and the DNMC Squad has little impact on the results.
Message edited by author 2009-01-15 15:03:51. |
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01/15/2009 03:09:07 PM · #47 |
Originally posted by HawkeyeLonewolf:
Sorry, you're still wrong. THe MAIN theme was STOCK, the subtheme was Cooking. So clearly it should be, based on the description, a STOCK PHOTO ABOUT COOKING.
Enough said. |
You're lost in the sauce but stick to it. I'll take my paycheck. Between the two of us probably the only one who's actually done this work for money, so I'll leave it at that.
I'm done with you. |
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01/15/2009 03:10:59 PM · #48 |
Originally posted by chromeydome:
"A less popular stock topic, but necessary nonetheless: Cooking. Come up with a unique and effective way to capture the art of cooking (food) such that it could be used on a website or on a brochure".
Hmmm....
If one wanted photos of the "Act of Photography" then a photo of a lens on a desk wouldn't cut it. And since the challenge says "Art of.." I guess I wouldn't expect a photo of a lens would depict the Art of Photography either.... A photo of the "act of creating the art" might fly, if well done and clear. But a photo of a lens or lens cleaning brush or a memory card wouldn't cut it.
So, in general, I think that since the challenge description clearly states "...art of cooking" it could very reasonably be interpreted to include the action (implying/depicting artistic skill), the artist, and/or the result. Photos of ingredients or say, a shopping list (none in the challenge, so not singling anyone out), seem like a wider interpretation of the theme--if very well done, will still probably do okay on scores, though.
I am not a member of the small but vocal DNMC Police Squad, and so I don't worry about it much--the voters generally do recognize the difference between an obvious shoehorn entry and a well-done, creative interpretation of the theme, and the DNMC Squad has little impact on the results. |
You almost got it...
Had it said ACT of cooking, then pawdrix and toddhead would be correct.
Since it says ART of cooking, then clearly it pertains to things related to the art that is cooking.
Your photography example supports this as well.
What's ironic is that *I'M* the one who will vote DNMC when the challenge is clear yet gives leeway when it's not. In this case, and based on the actual stock photo sites (of which this challenge is primarily based, otherwise it would have been "Art of Cooking"), the challenge description is quite general and first and foremost your shot should be of stock photo quality. |
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01/15/2009 03:12:29 PM · #49 |
Originally posted by pawdrix:
Originally posted by HawkeyeLonewolf:
Sorry, you're still wrong. THe MAIN theme was STOCK, the subtheme was Cooking. So clearly it should be, based on the description, a STOCK PHOTO ABOUT COOKING.
Enough said. |
You're lost in the sauce but stick to it. I'll take my paycheck. Between the two of us probably the only one who's actually done this work for money, so I'll leave it at that.
I'm done with you. |
What do you being a cook have to do with the general interpretation of the challenge theme? Nothing. It just means you get to make your own interpretation of the theme. Your opinion on this is no more valid than a business person's would be in the sister challenge.
Wow, you have an ego. |
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01/15/2009 03:14:13 PM · #50 |
I'm with the "ingredients count" faction of this particular debate. I see what others are saying, particularly pawdrix. It's just that I don't agree lol. I'm not going to expand on that as I've got nothing new to add to this discussion, everything I've got to say has been said before.
Can we all agree to disagree, resolve to take into account others' interpretations of challenges when voting, play nicely and keep this thread back as a scores thread? No-one's going to change anyone else's mind by continuing the argument as we're all equally passionate about opposite sides.
Apologies if I sound brusque :-)
Anyway, scores:
Votes: 120
Views: 180
Avg Vote: 5.7583 |
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