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08/18/2008 10:26:05 AM · #26 |
| I used to manage a warehouse and this shot does fit what the day shift feels the night shift does all night so even though I did not vote I did get a chuckle out of the photo. Also it helps that I understand the shot to be a loading dock rather than a garage and the irony of having someone lying around on a couch reading a book while they should be working is not lost on me.....:). I am not sure I would score it much higher but I appreciate the idea. |
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08/18/2008 10:27:07 AM · #27 |
Originally posted by Phil:
Originally posted by Eyesup:
Originally posted by Patsfan:
You are wrong, should be happy with a 5.2. |
I'm never happy with average (even if average on this site equals more than average elsewhere.)...
Phil:
If we all looks at this objectively it would be a science not an art, and we wouldn't relly have to discuss it... I would be told where the formular was wrong, I would correct it and get a 10 next time... however because this is are it's a slow (ans sometimes painful) progression... I dont really every want to be able to look at my work stricktly objectivly |
Then you'll stay where you're at. |
Thanks Phil... if you took a look at my early entries last year compared to this year, you would see that is not true... but again, thanks |
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08/18/2008 10:59:25 AM · #28 |
Originally posted by Eyesup:
Originally posted by Phil:
Originally posted by Eyesup:
Originally posted by Patsfan:
You are wrong, should be happy with a 5.2. |
I'm never happy with average (even if average on this site equals more than average elsewhere.)...
Phil:
If we all looks at this objectively it would be a science not an art, and we wouldn't relly have to discuss it... I would be told where the formular was wrong, I would correct it and get a 10 next time... however because this is are it's a slow (ans sometimes painful) progression... I dont really every want to be able to look at my work stricktly objectivly |
Then you'll stay where you're at. |
Thanks Phil... if you took a look at my early entries last year compared to this year, you would see that is not true... but again, thanks |
Yeah, okay. |
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08/18/2008 11:11:20 AM · #29 |
Last time there was a woody challenge I took a picture of a woody 'behind bars' of a staircase and called it Tom Joad got out of the old McAllester pen. Judging by comments, the vast majority of voters didn't know who Tom Joad was and probably didn't catch the allusion to Woody Guthrie either. This time around I've referenced yet another thing that flies right by mr. and mrs. voter.
Voters don't 'get' much. There's usually one or more that do though, so if you're not desperate for votes, that makes up for it all. If you are desperate for votes, which seems to be your problem, then do yourself a favour and stop being so damned smart.
It's a nice idea and a lousy not so good picture. K.I.S.S. |
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08/18/2008 11:11:23 AM · #30 |
Originally posted by Phil:
Originally posted by Eyesup:
Originally posted by Patsfan:
You are wrong, should be happy with a 5.2. |
I'm never happy with average (even if average on this site equals more than average elsewhere.)...
Phil:
If we all looks at this objectively it would be a science not an art, and we wouldn't relly have to discuss it... I would be told where the formular was wrong, I would correct it and get a 10 next time... however because this is are it's a slow (ans sometimes painful) progression... I dont really every want to be able to look at my work stricktly objectivly |
Then you'll stay where you're at. |
I think Phil has it right... In our heads we have a vision. Then we try to translate the vision in our heads, into a photograph that represents the vision we had. Finally we share the photograph with others, to share the vision.
Art is never totally objective, but we have to have the ability to see what we have really created, warts and all. So that next time we can do better.
There are two kinds of photography.
That which we shoot to show and please others.
And that which we shoot purely to please ourselves.
Most people do some of both. Just don't get them confused. If you are shooting purely for personal satisfaction, it is probably not an image to enter into a challenge. If an image is like your child, keep it home where it is safe. If the image is to please others, and go into a challenge, shoot for the lowest common demnominator. Arm it with mass appeal, sheild it with an uncontroversial subject, and sent it out into the world to do battle. |
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08/18/2008 11:59:18 AM · #31 |
Originally posted by Eyesup:
ok so the lighing wasn't super... it wa after hours, and I didn't have a full studio setup at my disposal... just my sb800 (we didn't have a lot of latitude for how long we could be and what we could use and do) |
My two cents (4.135 Canadian): don't feel you need a studio's worth of equipment to achieve dramatic lighting. In this particular case instead of "just my sb800" think "I have ambient light and an sb800, how can I can maximize the lighting to make the most impact". It takes a little practice but once mastered you will have never look at one sb800 as a limitation but rather perhaps the greatest asset in your photographic bag-o-tricks.
I suggest checking out the flickr group One Strobe Pony as a starting point to see what can be done with one strobe.
Also, I *super-strongly* suggest checking out David Hobby's Strobist blog and Strobist flickr sites, you have a truly *awesome* lighting arsenal with "just your sb800".
Peace. |
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08/18/2008 12:07:23 PM · #32 |
Originally posted by alfresco:
My two cents (4.135 Canadian |
0.02119 Canadian :-P |
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08/18/2008 12:12:16 PM · #33 |
Originally posted by ambaker:
Originally posted by Phil:
Originally posted by Eyesup:
Originally posted by Patsfan:
You are wrong, should be happy with a 5.2. |
I'm never happy with average (even if average on this site equals more than average elsewhere.)...
Phil:
If we all looks at this objectively it would be a science not an art, and we wouldn't relly have to discuss it... I would be told where the formular was wrong, I would correct it and get a 10 next time... however because this is are it's a slow (ans sometimes painful) progression... I dont really every want to be able to look at my work stricktly objectivly |
Then you'll stay where you're at. |
I think Phil has it right... In our heads we have a vision. Then we try to translate the vision in our heads, into a photograph that represents the vision we had. Finally we share the photograph with others, to share the vision.
Art is never totally objective, but we have to have the ability to see what we have really created, warts and all. So that next time we can do better.
There are two kinds of photography.
That which we shoot to show and please others.
And that which we shoot purely to please ourselves.
Most people do some of both. Just don't get them confused. If you are shooting purely for personal satisfaction, it is probably not an image to enter into a challenge. If an image is like your child, keep it home where it is safe. If the image is to please others, and go into a challenge, shoot for the lowest common demnominator. Arm it with mass appeal, sheild it with an uncontroversial subject, and sent it out into the world to do battle. |
Battles are won with the extraordinary... Art flourishes when boundaries are pushed not when we cower at the gates of mass apeal.
Alfresco: Thanks, and ya I could probably do a bit better with the lighting... This was well after sunset, so ambient light was... well it wasn't... I'm more used to shooting either in my studio or in much better outdoor light. |
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08/18/2008 12:19:44 PM · #34 |
Originally posted by Patsfan:
You are wrong, should be happy with a 5.2. |
From the mouths of babes... I concur. Also - whining about your score, man, that's not cool. |
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08/18/2008 12:20:46 PM · #35 |
Originally posted by Wenders11:
Eh, I thought my evening shot was going to do better than it did too. You win some you lose some. |
I know I'm off topic, but I thought that your evening shot was fantastic!
But back to the topic at hand, you win some you lose some. Not only do you have to shoot for yourself, but you also must submit something that appeals to the voters. |
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08/18/2008 12:29:02 PM · #36 |
Originally posted by redjulep:
Originally posted by Patsfan:
You are wrong, should be happy with a 5.2. |
From the mouths of babes... I concur. Also - whining about your score, man, that's not cool. |
Actually I was 'whining' about my place not score :)
and not really whining, I just thought it was better then just about last
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08/18/2008 12:34:28 PM · #37 |
Originally posted by Eyesup:
Battles are won with the extraordinary... Art flourishes when boundaries are pushed not when we cower at the gates of mass apeal. |
This image isn't pushing any boundaries. It's actually quite flat and boring. |
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08/18/2008 12:35:29 PM · #38 |
Originally posted by Eyesup:
Battles are won with the extraordinary... Art flourishes when boundaries are pushed not when we cower at the gates of mass apeal.
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All that sounds great until you start telling the masses how much they don't understand your art. After that it's just a cop out. |
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08/18/2008 12:47:31 PM · #39 |
Originally posted by Phil:
Originally posted by Eyesup:
Battles are won with the extraordinary... Art flourishes when boundaries are pushed not when we cower at the gates of mass apeal.
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All that sounds great until you start telling the masses how much they don't understand your art. After that it's just a cop out. |
All I said is that I'm tying... not that I've succeded or anything... I originally said I though the photo didn't deserve it's position... guess I was wrong... accepted.
Should I be happy with 5.2 Maybe... it's not that bad of a score for this site anyway... should Canada be happy with 7 medals? ya maybe, cause hey we're not really a summer sport country...
Well... I will be happy with constant improvement (which I am achieving to a point), and when I don't think my performace was either apreciated (for lack of a better work) or was sub-part ot what I thought it should be, I'll ask questions... and every once and awhile I may complain
I apologize for the complaining... |
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08/18/2008 01:10:33 PM · #40 |
Originally posted by Eyesup:
I apologize for the complaining... |
Jumping in a little late to just say that it should be " f*****g " :P |
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08/18/2008 01:13:07 PM · #41 |
Originally posted by Art Roflmao:
Originally posted by Eyesup:
I apologize for the complaining... |
Jumping in a little late to just say that it should be " f*****g " :P |
or f****n' :P |
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08/18/2008 01:13:41 PM · #42 |
Originally posted by Art Roflmao:
Originally posted by Eyesup:
I apologize for the complaining... |
Jumping in a little late to just say that it should be " f*****g " :P |
Actually... not that I'v had my coffee I asked the SC to take that out of the title...
not to mention is porper grammer and spelling sort of redundant with slang anyway? lol |
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08/18/2008 01:16:50 PM · #43 |
From a secret paragraph buried in the DPC Terms of Use:
"...agree not to post prior to having your morning coffee,..." |
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08/18/2008 01:20:19 PM · #44 |
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08/18/2008 01:48:22 PM · #45 |
Originally posted by Patrick_R:
Amen |
Ya Ya... everyone has their day... and I just cashed in one of mine...
I did apologies... at least for the crankiness :) |
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08/18/2008 01:54:31 PM · #46 |
Originally posted by Eyesup:
Battles are won with the extraordinary... Art flourishes when boundaries are pushed not when we cower at the gates of mass apeal. |
That's a noble and lofty thought, but you have to accept that your interpretation of art, and others', may very well be different.
If you feel that you "get" something that the masses don't, then what difference does it make if you know it's art? Why enter it at all?
I don't necessarily agree that art and mass appeal are mutually exclusive. Most great works have great appeal as well. It's the ones that skirt the edges and are controversial that mean that you'll have to take what you get.
You want to push the boundaries, then enter the Free Studies, not a directed challenge......ultimately, you'll have to be comfortable with your own work for your own reasons.....voters be damned.
I have had to learn all this the hard way here......and have, by discovering that images that I've sold and won photography contests with sometimes get slammed in voting here.
This is a great place to learn, and to get feedback......just remember that not all feedback is constructive or what you WANT to hear.
Just another FIY, if you care......I would have voted that image a 4 or 5. So....is that me not getting it, or you not communicating to me?
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08/18/2008 01:55:00 PM · #47 |
Originally posted by Eyesup:
All I said is that I'm tying... not that I've succeded or anything... I originally said I though the photo didn't deserve it's position... guess I was wrong... accepted.
Should I be happy with 5.2 Maybe... it's not that bad of a score for this site anyway... should Canada be happy with 7 medals? ya maybe, cause hey we're not really a summer sport country...
Well... I will be happy with constant improvement (which I am achieving to a point), and when I don't think my performace was either apreciated (for lack of a better work) or was sub-part ot what I thought it should be, I'll ask questions... and every once and awhile I may complain
I apologize for the complaining... |
It's cool dude.
But while you originally stated that the photo didn't deserve it's position you then said:
"Ouch... Note to self:
"Stop trying to be creative. No one gets it"
Adendum:
"do not mess with colours, people don't get i"
And:
"when shooting for a challenge unless your photo SCREAMS the challenge theme, don't bother... no one will get it"
..which some prolly took offense to. I wasn't one of those but I am one of those that thinks it placed where it should've.
Nothing wrong with asking questions but you gotta know that it's not always that voters didn't understand what you were trying to do with your creativity. Maybe they just didn't think you pulled it off? |
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08/18/2008 02:12:43 PM · #48 |
Originally posted by Phil:
Originally posted by Eyesup:
All I said is that I'm tying... not that I've succeded or anything... I originally said I though the photo didn't deserve it's position... guess I was wrong... accepted.
Should I be happy with 5.2 Maybe... it's not that bad of a score for this site anyway... should Canada be happy with 7 medals? ya maybe, cause hey we're not really a summer sport country...
Well... I will be happy with constant improvement (which I am achieving to a point), and when I don't think my performace was either apreciated (for lack of a better work) or was sub-part ot what I thought it should be, I'll ask questions... and every once and awhile I may complain
I apologize for the complaining... |
It's cool dude.
But while you originally stated that the photo didn't deserve it's position you then said:
"Ouch... Note to self:
"Stop trying to be creative. No one gets it"
Adendum:
"do not mess with colours, people don't get i"
And:
"when shooting for a challenge unless your photo SCREAMS the challenge theme, don't bother... no one will get it"
..which some prolly took offense to. I wasn't one of those but I am one of those that thinks it placed where it should've.
Nothing wrong with asking questions but you gotta know that it's not always that voters didn't understand what you were trying to do with your creativity. Maybe they just didn't think you pulled it off? |
many may take offence to that, but I do think that is a truism of the site, that (for better or for worse) often the truely creative and out of the box material is trampled over in favor of stuff with more "Mass Appeal" (for lack of better words), and this really isn't referencing my work (cause a I've been told it's flat and boring). |
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08/18/2008 02:13:41 PM · #49 |
| Thanks to the SC for changing the title :) |
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08/18/2008 02:17:12 PM · #50 |
Originally posted by Eyesup:
Battles are won with the extraordinary... Art flourishes when boundaries are pushed not when we cower at the gates of mass apeal.
Alfresco: Thanks, and ya I could probably do a bit better with the lighting... This was well after sunset, so ambient light was... well it wasn't... I'm more used to shooting either in my studio or in much better outdoor light. |
...and there is the rub. I am not trying to say that the winning photos each week are pushing the boundaries. (Nor am I saying they are produced by cowards.) But, you appear to have confused personal art, and challenge entries. The images here are judged by the masses, and voted upon by the masses.
Hence no mass appeal, no high score. If you are offended by a score lower than you had hoped, then the solution as distasteful to you as it may be, is to shoot for a greater mass appeal. If you don't care about scores, then shoot as you please, and perhaps the comments and suggestions from photographers you respect will be enough. Like it or not, that's the deal, them's the cards we have to play.
Message edited by author 2008-08-18 14:19:42.
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