Avg. Vote Received? - DPChallenge Forums

04/06/2008 02:05:37 PM · #1

I was looking at my scores today and I've entered 2 challenges (well, and a third that's not complete yet)

My scores in those challenges were:
6.0107
6.0101

Yet my average vote received is only 5.7319
What gives?

ZeppKash

Samsung Pro815

04/06/2008 02:09:27 PM · #2

From the DNMC scores thread:

Originally posted by DjFenzl:

Votes: 98
Views: 211
Avg Vote: 4.5918
Comments: 19

Thats what gives, the current challenge counts.

SaraR

Sony Alpha a7R III

Sony FE 24-70mm f/2.8 GM

04/06/2008 02:09:33 PM · #3

That you had two really good first challenges, but your entry to the third is scoring in the level of mediocrity? ;Â¬P
(Average score is real time, rather than just completed challenges.)

Edit: beaten to it by ZeppKash.

Message edited by author 2008-04-06 14:10:46.

Canon EF 70-300mm f/4.5-5.6 DO IS USM

04/06/2008 02:13:06 PM · #4

With my score in the current challenge my avg. score would be lower than that.

cpanaioti

Canon EOS-40D

04/06/2008 02:14:21 PM · #5

Originally posted by DjFenzl:

With my score in the current challenge my avg. score would be lower than that.

Average vote received is based on the total votes cast not the average from each challenge. (If that makes a difference)

04/06/2008 02:16:10 PM · #6

Originally posted by cpanaioti:

Originally posted by DjFenzl:
With my score in the current challenge my avg. score would be lower than that.

Average vote received is based on the total votes cast not the average from each challenge. (If that makes a difference)

Ah yes - so it's a weighted average. That makes sense.

Thanks everyone for the help. ;)

04/06/2008 02:19:29 PM · #7

Originally posted by DjFenzl:

With my score in the current challenge my avg. score would be lower than that.

The key is that the statistic is average vote received, not average score received. This will usually result in a slight difference. We sum up all your votes received and divide them by the total number of votes received.

~Terry

04/06/2008 02:20:57 PM · #8

Hmmmm... I think the totals in your profile reflect "live" votes! Maybe they shouldn't.... because if they do, I believe I can calculate your current challenge entry values as follows:

#1 votes 281 avg 6.0107 value 1689
#2 votes 199 avg 6.0101 value 1196
#3 votes 593 avg 5.7319 value 3399
===============================
#4 votes 113 avg 4.5487 value 514

#1 is your score on Say Cheese
#2 is your score on Burn Village Burn
#3 is your current votes and average shown on your profile
#4 is what I calculated your current challenge entry to be

Is it right?

Canon EF 70-200mm f/2.8L IS USM

04/06/2008 02:25:31 PM · #9

Originally posted by dwterry:

You are exactly right.

roba

Canon EOS-5D Mark II

04/06/2008 02:28:32 PM · #10

...and David opens up Pandora's box. Wow.

04/06/2008 02:29:15 PM · #11

Originally posted by dwterry:

From a security perspective I see this as a marginal concern because:

- There is no way to determine which challenge(s) the person has entered
- It will not work if the person has more than one active challenge entry
- The ability to calculate another user's score with any level of precision drops as entries and votes received increase.

While you may technically be correct, I doubt that this is enough of an issue to justify the database overhead and additional calculation time at rollover needed to change it.

~Terry

Message edited by author 2008-04-06 14:29:29.

Canon RF 24-70mm f/2.8 L IS

04/06/2008 02:32:05 PM · #12

All I think you really need to do, is not include current challenges in the profile totals. Wait until the challenge ends to add those totals to the profile.

I do agree that the more challenges you enter, the harder it is to arrive at this information. And in the end, it's really not all that secret, but still....

SaraR

Sony Alpha a7R III

Sony FE 24-70mm f/2.8 GM

04/06/2008 02:32:46 PM · #13

David "Sleuth" Terry - you are clearly in the wrong profession!

kirbic

Canon EOS R5

04/06/2008 03:38:15 PM · #14

We've been aware of the statistical "information leak" referred to by David for a long time, however for the reasons Terry stated, we regarded it as a non-issue. It would be too bad if we had to ditch a "live" stat because of the small potential for "score snooping."

Tamron AF 28-300mm f/3.5-6.3 XR Di LD Aspherical IF for Canon

04/06/2008 04:11:48 PM · #15

I've noticed this a while back. But its not really a concern. If a user has say a has 100 challenges entered your only going to see a few 1000ths of change in their average score during a challenge. Not enough to calculate their current score unless you have a loooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooot of time on your hands. Especially since DPC rounds of challenge at 4 decimal points.

04/06/2008 04:15:22 PM · #16

Originally posted by SDW:

Actually you could just copy and paste all their scores from their profile and have excel do the work for you, couldn't you?

Tamron AF 28-300mm f/3.5-6.3 XR Di LD Aspherical IF for Canon

04/06/2008 04:25:37 PM · #17

Technically but with DPC rounding off at 4 decimal points you don't get the exact score. And with 100 or more challenges you are going to need the exact score to even get close to the current avg of an entry in the voting stage.

Your welcome to try determining my current score. I have only one entry (Free Study 03). I have entered 111 previous challenges. To get my stats you can go to my profile. Lets see if anyone can come close to my current score. It would be interesting.

Message edited by author 2008-04-06 16:26:38.

04/06/2008 04:32:49 PM · #18

Originally posted by DjFenzl:

Originally posted by SDW:
I've noticed this a while back. But its not really a concern. If a user has say a has 100 challenges entered your only going to see a few 1000ths of change in their average score during a challenge. Not enough to calculate their current score unless you have a loooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooot of time on your hands. Especially since DPC rounds of challenge at 4 decimal points.

Actually you could just copy and paste all their scores from their profile and have excel do the work for you, couldn't you?

You also need to consider the number of votes received on each of those 100 entries, which involves going to the image pages for each one. Number of votes received is not shown on the profile page.

~Terry

04/06/2008 04:33:20 PM · #19

Originally posted by SDW:

It would also be interesting to note how long it takes to come up with a guess.

~Terry

Tamron AF 28-300mm f/3.5-6.3 XR Di LD Aspherical IF for Canon

04/06/2008 04:39:38 PM · #20

Originally posted by ClubJuggle:

Originally posted by SDW:
Technically but with DPC rounding off at 4 decimal points you don't get the exact score. And with 100 or more challenges you are going to need the exact score to even get close to the current avg of an entry in the voting stage.

Your welcome to try determining my current score. I have only one entry (Free Study 03). I have entered 111 previous challenges. To get my stats you can go to my profile. Lets see if anyone can come close to my current score. It would be interesting.

It would also be interesting to note how long it takes to come up with a guess.

~Terry

Exactly! and whats the point? I don't see where this is a concern or problem IMO. What good is it going to do someone to know another's score.

yanko

Canon EOS-5D Mark II

Carl Zeiss 50mm ZE f/1.4 Planar T for Canon

04/06/2008 04:46:12 PM · #21

Originally posted by SDW:

Originally posted by ClubJuggle:

Originally posted by SDW:
Technically but with DPC rounding off at 4 decimal points you don't get the exact score. And with 100 or more challenges you are going to need the exact score to even get close to the current avg of an entry in the voting stage.

Your welcome to try determining my current score. I have only one entry (Free Study 03). I have entered 111 previous challenges. To get my stats you can go to my profile. Lets see if anyone can come close to my current score. It would be interesting.

It would also be interesting to note how long it takes to come up with a guess.

~Terry

Exactly! and whats the point? I don't see where this is a concern or problem IMO. What good is it going to do someone to know another's score.

What???? Once you know the score you mix it in your witch's brew. How else can one put a spell on the entry without knowing the score????

BAMartin

Apple iPhone 5

04/06/2008 04:47:09 PM · #22

Originally posted by SDW:

Exactly! and whats the point? I don't see where this is a concern or problem IMO. What good is it going to do someone to know another's score.

Not only that, but people are posting their scores in the forums all the time anyway. What is the big secret?

04/06/2008 05:16:04 PM · #23

@SDW My guess is:

Current number of votes: 128
Current average: 5.6484

How close did I come?

04/06/2008 05:19:40 PM · #24

I'm guessing that I'm within 0.039 of your average on your current challenge. This, of course, assumes that I didn't typo anything.

Message edited by author 2008-04-06 17:19:50.