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03/16/2008 01:00:44 AM · #1 |
Encouraging people to comment for the sake of commenting has little value to those receiving the comments.
 JUDI providing ribbons for 100% commenting, while well intentioned, seems only to serve the purpose of allowing people to get a virtual ribbon that is even less valuable than the the "official" top three ribbons.
This has been brought up several times before in other forum threads but I couldn't find one dedicated specifically to this topic.
I am part of the problem. As a general rule, I check off the box that indicates the comment I've received is HELPFUL, even when it's not. The thought was that not checking the little box would insult those that took the time to comment and discourage them from commenting in future challenges. The expectation (I assume) was that commenting skills and photography skills went hand in hand and would evolve and improve together.
I've only been here for a year but even I can tell when I've received a comment not because someone was genuinely interested enough to comment on my image, but because they determined that there were going to vote on X percentage of images. I may be more cynical then most, but when I get "some" comments that don't seem to pass the smell test, I will check later to see if they've bragged somewhere else that they commented on all 100% of the entries in a contest.
Of course, by posting this thread, I leave myself open to others who will go over every comment I've ever made and question the quantity and quality. I may leave comments that are perhaps less then helpful but at least the majority of them indicate I've least given the act of commenting some thought. Hell, I've spent a great deal of time thinking of comments to leave a particular image (and even tying them out) and deciding that not leaving a comment was the best course of action.
Am I alone in my thinking?
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03/16/2008 01:05:08 AM · #2 |
Sometimes a person has to start somewhere. If you look at the majority of the people that received 'virtual' ribbons in the Commenting thread, their initial comments may have been basic. But look at how their confidence has grown and how their commenting and photographic skills have grown.
When you walk on a stage you are nervous...but over time the confidence builds. The same goes in nearly every part of life.
Granted there are some people who cheat in their comments...but who are they cheating...you? No...they are only cheating themselves. Look past the bad and find the good in everything you do. You will be a lot happier for it.
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03/16/2008 01:12:59 AM · #3 |
I'm actually very proud of getting to 100% comments recently. It took me a long time and I tried my best to comment intelligently.
Everyone gets comments that are not actually helpful and we check it off in the same way we respond to people who casually ask, "Hey, how are you doing?" We say, "Fine thanks" or something of the sort rather than judging the real value of the question.
Sure, it would be nice if every comment was painstakingly thought out, but sometimes it actually is nice to have someone say, "Nice shot!" rather than no comment at all. No one should be afraid to say something simple for fear of not being helpful IMHO |
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03/16/2008 01:18:20 AM · #4 |
Originally posted by Judi:
Sometimes a person has to start somewhere. If you look at the majority of the people that received 'virtual' ribbons in the Commenting thread, their initial comments may have been basic. But look at how their confidence has grown and how their commenting and photographic skills have grown.
When you walk on a stage you are nervous...but over time the confidence builds. The same goes in nearly every part of life.
Granted there are some people who cheat in their comments...but who are they cheating...you? No...they are only cheating themselves. Look past the bad and find the good in everything you do. You will be a lot happier for it. |
I am perfectly happy. Back off. :)
BTW, while I mentioned you by name, it wasn't a criticism of you. Stop taking things personally. You'll be a lot happier for it. |
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03/16/2008 01:21:37 AM · #5 |
Originally posted by marttila:
I'm actually very proud of getting to 100% comments recently. It took me a long time and I tried my best to comment intelligently.
Everyone gets comments that are not actually helpful and we check it off in the same way we respond to people who casually ask, "Hey, how are you doing?" We say, "Fine thanks" or something of the sort rather than judging the real value of the question.
Sure, it would be nice if every comment was painstakingly thought out, but sometimes it actually is nice to have someone say, "Nice shot!" rather than no comment at all. No one should be afraid to say something simple for fear of not being helpful IMHO |
I have no problem with someone saying "nice shot". I have a problem with someone saying "nice shot" 200 times and expecting a pat on the back.
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03/16/2008 01:24:14 AM · #6 |
Also consider that many, many people have repeatedly said they learn far more from the comments they give rather than from those they receive. Efforts like the 100% comments club are probably exercises to hone commenting skills, rather than simple vanity exercises as you suggest.
Message edited by author 2008-03-16 01:25:00. |
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03/16/2008 01:32:57 AM · #7 |
still better than getting "crappy shot" 200 times or nothing at all,dont you think?
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03/16/2008 01:33:42 AM · #8 |
Originally posted by Louis:
Also consider that many, many people have repeatedly said they learn far more from the comments they give rather than from those they receive. Efforts like the 100% comments club are probably exercises to hone commenting skills, rather than simple vanity exercises as you suggest. |
I do consider that many people say that. It's not true, but I do consider it. |
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03/16/2008 01:37:13 AM · #9 |
Originally posted by jonnienye:
still better than getting "crappy shot" 200 times or nothing at all,dont you think? |
Nope. I'd rather get one "crappy shot" with an explanation rather than 200 "nice shots" |
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03/16/2008 01:46:39 AM · #10 |
I spent 3 hours of my time today giving out comments, and as I said on another thread... I think I learned more than anyone I commented on. I'm brand new to the "art" of photography (I've had a point and shoot for years) and I tried to give as many good comments as I could. If the picture was way beyond anything I could have done, I praised it and told the photographer so. Other than that, I basically put down the first sentence or two that came to mind looking at the photo.
I've made a goal to myself to comment on 100% at least once a month, more for my own learning than anything else. It was amazing to see what I was looking for in photos and It actually made me score most photos higher tan usual. My average vote given overall is about 5.7 and for Peek a boo its 6.4. I'll continue to do it this way, and apologize if any comment I made on your photo wasn't creative enough or heartfelt enough. But in the meantime... I'll post Judi's ribbon proudly on my profile. (when I get it)
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03/16/2008 01:57:38 AM · #11 |
Ok. I apologize for offending people who comment on 100% of photos. I will accept that viewing and thinking about the images you're viewing helps you become better photographers.
How does "commenting" help. Are your thoughts any less real or valid if you think them, but don't hit the POST button to send them?
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03/16/2008 02:02:21 AM · #12 |
Originally posted by jonejess:
How does "commenting" help. Are your thoughts any less real or valid if you think them, but don't hit the POST button to send them? |
While they may be the big brass ring so highly sought after, they aren't always meant as a formal critique. Just sometimes it's nice to be acknowledged and know that they appreciated seeing your efforts. Kind of the same when someone passes you by on the street and have someone look up and say "Hi! How are ya?", regardless if you know them or not. |
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03/16/2008 02:04:14 AM · #13 |
Originally posted by jonejess:
How does "commenting" help. Are your thoughts any less real or valid if you think them, but don't hit the POST button to send them? |
Thoughts tend to be more coherent and considered when written down or typed out. It takes more time, you might actually give it more thought and it has a tendency to actually cement the notions in your head if you commit them to paper or keyboard. You could delete every single one of them after writing it, but you'll still get a lot further if you get it out of your head, one way or another.
Ever had something spinning around in your head, stopping you getting to sleep, until you write it down ? Or felt disorganized and wrote a list ? Wanted to express how you felt and wrote a letter ? Surely those thoughts were just as real or valid before you wrote them down ?
I've never been able to summon up the will or desire to comment 100% I think commenting on pictures that you have a strong reaction to one way or another can help you refine your views, likes and dislikes. I can never manage to comment on images that are forgettable, even when I'm looking at them. My hat is off to people that comment 100%, just for the achievement of finding something to say. |
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03/16/2008 02:11:26 AM · #14 |
I agree with  Gordon . If you write out anything in your head it makes you look at it differently. In the time it takes too look at the photo, acknowledge your first reaction and then put it in to words I have seen something else that I like or dislike about the photo. And if I have come across a forgettable photo, I think of a way to make it slightly less forgettable.
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03/16/2008 02:28:19 AM · #15 |
| Me too: writing something down is very different from thinking, although I keep having to remind myself of this, and not just with respect to DPC commenting. Good commenting, commenting to the point, is not at all easy, and I don't see that much is gained by beating ourselves too much over the head about it. Sometimes there will be a photo I very much like, but no significant words arise. We do what we can, and sometimes a wonderful comment is born. Sort of like taking pictures. |
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03/16/2008 02:37:52 AM · #16 |
I agree. Gordon nailed the reason.
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03/16/2008 10:00:23 AM · #17 |
People complain because they don't get comments. Now people are complaining because they DO get comments. Can't win, can we?
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03/16/2008 10:03:19 AM · #18 |
Originally posted by jonejess:
I have no problem with someone saying "nice shot". I have a problem with someone saying "nice shot" 200 times and expecting a pat on the back. |
I too don't have a problem with a "nice shot" comment, and I agree about that being said over and over by the commenter. But, that is the thing. It is purely a comment. Going into the 'why' it was a "nice shot" and showing the details of 'why' it was a "nice shot" is a critique.
Comments and Critiques are two different horses pulling the same wagon.
Message edited by author 2008-03-16 10:05:56.
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03/16/2008 10:03:21 AM · #19 |
Originally posted by jonejess:
Ok. I apologize for offending people who comment on 100% of photos. ... |
I wouldn't. You're not that far off track IMO.
Originally posted by jonejess:
I will accept that viewing and thinking about the images you're viewing helps you become better photographers. ... |
This is different from commenting, unless you meant to say "viewing, thinking, and commenting"...
Those that make comments in earnest will gain from the experience, especially if they've slowed down enough to consider the image in front of them.
I agree that there is a difference between "commenting" and "critiquing" and the comment box is for comments after all. However, repeating a version of "nice shot", or "nice lines", etc...over and over to hit 100% is fruitless in many cases. With all due respect to the point that Judi makes earlier about confidence building - there's no confidence building going on for those zipping thru with the short notes because there's no thought behind it.
For those attempting the 100% comment goal - if you're doing it in earnest I applaud you, absolutely. Thank you. If you're just zipping thru and can't remember a thing about the last few images you've viewed, nor put any thought into the "nice shot" comment - well, I'd prefer you kept it to yourself.
Seeing the comment number increase on any challenge entry of mine doesn't mean nearly as much anymore. Used to be fun & exciting to see what someone had to say...now in many cases it's just another 100% zipster passing thru.
Originally posted by jonejess:
"Comments - Dime a Dozen" |
Jon - you hit the nail on the head. |
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