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12/26/2007 10:09:14 AM · #26 |
Call me what you like.... The other 3 shots look better to me, so if they scored higher that makes sense.
Your not real likely to get much out of the site with conversations like this one, it's been done before :-/ Like any other client, this site has it's preferences in a general sense.... If you want to score well then learn those and shoot for that.... or do what others do and just shoot what you like or for what you can learn.
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12/26/2007 10:10:28 AM · #27 |
Originally posted by fastforward:
Thank you Bear...point well made (and taken). This also explains why my Perspective shot is showing poorly at the moment (5.9 average but 2 faves) because it is a much more edgy/challenging image than this one is.
Does this mean that if I want to score well at DPC I need to shoot some more "user friendly" images? (and is this selling out artistically??!)
N |
Nick - An interesting point you raise. Think of DPC as a potential consumer. If you want to sell the image to large populous (score well), you need to give the audience what they want - inviting, pretty, colorful and simple images. If you want to be appreciated a great deal on the site and elsewhere, continue to go for the edgy and different and collect favorites and raves from other photogs.
Keep entering and keep using the qualities that you have presented so far - they are wonderful images. |
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12/26/2007 10:17:51 AM · #28 |
Originally posted by fastforward:
Does this mean that if I want to score well at DPC I need to shoot some more "user friendly" images? |
Most assuredly. Winning challenges usually means targeting your images to the expectations of the voters, whether intentionally or just because that's your natural mode of working.
Originally posted by fastforward:
(and is this selling out artistically??!) |
I'm not sure that concept has any meaning in the DPC context except, of course, whatever weight you give to it yourself. Speaking of my own goals, I stopped worrying about it. I have a handful of ribbons, a bunch of top-10's, and 50+ images that finished in the 4's and lower. Plus a totally carefree attitude. Sometimes I take "serious" pictures, sometimes I take "pretty" pictures, sometimes my pretty pictures are serious (or my serious pictures are "pretty), and most of the time I am just goofing off. But "selling out artistically" has no meaning to me. I'll never be confused with an Adams, a Cartier-Bresson, a Uelsmann, and I'm just deluding myself if I try to convince myself I'm following some hallowed artistic path that has meaning in and of itself. So I don't.
Life's too short to worry about DPC scores.
R.
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12/26/2007 10:33:12 AM · #29 |
I'm going to have a go at answering that one. It does seem to be true that there is a style of picture that does well at DPC but part of that style is technical excellence. However much you want to keep your artistic integrity, technical excellence is no bad thing.
Pictures which do well seem to be those with relatively easy to comprehend subject matter and emotional content. These are the shots which everyone, or most people at least, can react to and appreciate. These shots do well because they show things or emotions which most people have experienced at some time in their lives.
These shots do well because the fact that have near universal appeal will shift the whole bell curve higher.
Edgier shots are more difficult to comprehend. They work well when something about them appeals to the viewer, but they are much more dependent on the individual viewer's experience, memory, mood.
You get a few high scores with these shots but it won't shift the curve.
As an example, I think the picture below, by Melethia, is wonderful.
It scored 5.6 and came in 79th. I gave it a ten. There is something about the posture of the dog, the dainty smoker, (if that person is smoking), the darkness of the platform that I think is simply mesmerising. This picture seems very French to me and full of longing and nervousness. Kind of Hopperish too and noirish but I'd be at a lost to explain why I like it so much exactly, it's too personal and too instinctive. It just makes me feel stuff.
According to the scores a few other people felt the same, or at least felt strongly about it, but for most people it looks like it was just a picture. It got mostly 4, 5 6's.
Personally I just enter pictures I like but if I'm honest I do like it when they score Ok (6.1 would be nice) but that;s because I'm shallow.
Message edited by author 2007-12-26 10:37:38. |
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12/26/2007 10:47:14 AM · #30 |
I get what you;re looking for in this thread but the way you presented this (with yours and then others) is in bad taste and spirit, IMHO. It's never nice calling other shots out, even with the best of intentions. I know if one of those other shots were mine, I'd feel a bit sad that you called it out.
I agree with some of the other posts about composition and in all honesty, I really like the red streaks some as it is unlike yours and the others.
In all, a 6.1 and 41st placing is pretty outstanding. Cheers for doing so well!
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12/26/2007 11:03:17 AM · #31 |
Originally posted by raish:
Much improved by the colour, IMHO.
But with a run through shadow/highlight and partial desaturation of everything but the blues and magentas?
[thumb]625937[/thumb] |
I think this is a vast improvement. There is much more life and excitement. |
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12/26/2007 11:10:33 AM · #32 |
Originally posted by Rooster:
I get what you;re looking for in this thread but the way you presented this (with yours and then others) is in bad taste and spirit, IMHO. It's never nice calling other shots out, even with the best of intentions. I know if one of those other shots were mine, I'd feel a bit sad that you called it out. |
I'm genuinely sorry if I ruffled anyone's feathers. It really wasn't my intention to - just looking for some feedback as to why those others placed better than mine (which I've got). If someone called my shot out in the same way that I called their out, I'd be fine with it - we're not taking personal potshots at each other and I'd like to think we're all old enough and ugly enough to defend our own work without it seeming like trolling/baiting/personal digs etc. Then again I'm new around here and I'm still working out the status quo...so again, sorry if it's not the done thing around here...
I want to score well but at the same time I'm torn between shooting what I like and shooting for what I think others will like. There have been some really excellent replies here and a lot of food for thought, as well as some actual learning points to improve in the future. Thanks again.
N |
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12/26/2007 11:15:03 AM · #33 |
I just figured you were probably related to Simms, and we've learned to live with him.... :-)
See if you can shoot for score (review past challenge winners to get the secret DPC formula, or review past threads on "How to win a ribbon") then shoot what you like and see if you can find your audience. |
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12/26/2007 11:34:16 AM · #34 |
Originally posted by fastforward:
Thanks for the feedback - it is appreciated. I know you can't shine a sh!t but I've had a quick play at the colour palette on my streaming light shot...one b&w and one high saturation colour. Do you feel that either are better than the submitted one?
High Colour
[thumb]625925[/thumb]
N |
That looks already better as a thumbnail. As  JuliBoc says, it is much more excting and full of life versus the suburban, industrial look of your entry.
Message edited by author 2007-12-26 11:34:46. |
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12/26/2007 03:02:11 PM · #35 |
I was frustrated by my first few "masterpieces" that scored in the low to mid 5's. I've gotten some good feedback however, and I am learning to enjoy playing the game here, even if my score sucks.
My largest frustration is when I think I have a great entry and it does low 5's with little feedback to tell me why. My answer to that issue has been to comment on everything I vote on. The result of commenting has been that taking the time to analyze why I do or don't like others shots has been contributing to an improvement in my own photos. |
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12/26/2007 03:14:35 PM · #36 |
You're still new, so first, a 6 on DPC is a solid score. Accept that, and you will be happier. Don't compare it to any scale anywhere else. 6.5 is a terrific score, and 7+ means you're more likely to ribbon than not. Shots that routinely score 8 and higher on other sites are often in the 5s here. Your ranking is based more on how many other high-scoring shots happen to go into a challenge than the quality of your own shot.
Second, telling the world that your shot is better than other images is not helped by your adding "imho." Apparently, your opinion of your own shot isn't so humble. Arrogance isn't well-received, but genuine requests for help always are.
Third, take all comments and scores as a gift. It's useful feedback. What you do with it is then up to you. You seem to have already received some useful ideas that you agree with in this thread. Other times, you'll strongly disagree with a comment. Ultimately, you have to decide what to change in your style or in how you shoot.
Finally, relax. As others have suggested, shoot for yourself and enjoy it when you do connect with an audience. You'll undoubtedly find plenty of people who love your work. Be happy with that; it's the best any of us can hope for. And as you noted, faves rock, regardless of score. In fact, I love faves on low-scoring shots because it means I really connected intensely with some small audience.
Message edited by author 2007-12-26 15:16:26.
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12/27/2007 05:58:24 PM · #37 |
Originally posted by fastforward:
Thank you Bear...point well made (and taken). This also explains why my Perspective shot is showing poorly at the moment (5.9 average but 2 faves) because it is a much more edgy/challenging image than this one is.
N |
As others have said, even a 5.9 score is a great score for DPC. The two favs should also mean a lot more to you, as it means that you have really hit the right chord with 2 people.
You may want to take note of the score of the median score is in some of the challenges to understand the DPC scores a bit better. If you go to the first page of the results for a challenge and look on the left it will tell you that kind of info. For your long exposure challenge the median was 5.61. For the BITE challenge it was 5.479. For the free study challenges it is usually higher. For the Nov FS it was 5.7 and for Oct the FS median was 5.699.
I think you are doing very well. Be humble, there will always be those out there that are better than you are. :)
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