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01/22/2008 03:13:03 PM · #976 |
I wrote something in my profile and have had other private communications about not renewing my membership. Instead of responding to everyone separately I thought I'd write my thoughts here.
I am seriously considering not renewing my membership. I am not going to cancel my account and disappear, but at the same time I don't know if I want to be a member of this site. All the positivity I've gotten from DPC has been from individual members (and registered users), not from the leadership of the site.
I realize that this is to be expected from someone who has taken on an "underground" role. But I didn't choose that role. I am just promoting a reasonable, educated approach to what "photography" and "art" really mean. Certain members of the SC look at me like I'm an alien when I suggest that photography might be more than what you see in a popular magazine. They are dedicated to a protectionist policy, but they are protecting something that I don't care about, that I don't believe even exists, i.e. their definition of "photography".
This is well beyond the Challenge Rules. It also encompasses the challenge descriptions. Have you seen the description for Frames? The decision over and over again seems to be for restrictions that limit creativity instead of the kinds of restrictions in which creativity can flower.
 skewsme and I have made and supported many challenge suggestions. They are almost never used. I was encouraged when langdon said he would post my tutorials on voting and commenting. I went through several drafts to get the wording right, to minimize my own biases and underline that I am only making suggestions. But months have passed and no tutorials.
I am not attacking the Site Council. The people who get paid have very cleverly put us in contact with the people who do not get paid. Therefore, even though those of us who are members pay to use this site, we are always stuck arguing with people who are not paid, so it always seems as though we are ingrates complaining about a free site. A clever strategy indeed.
So where does that leave me? Oh yes, in the "underground." Well, so be it. But "underground" doesn't pay to use the site. "Underground" doesn't enter challenges every single week. "Underground" doesn't give over three times as many comments as he receives. No, Underground is a Cool Cat. Underground can take it or leave it. His color is gray.
We are only happy in this world if we know where we belong. I suddenly feel like the little girl in Mommy's bedroom, caught with a face full of lipstick, who thought she was a Lady. I'm not going to keep thinking that I'm respected by people who don't respect me. That only leads to disappointment.
The Barn Cat is as happy as the House Cat, as long as he knows he's in a barn. Otherwise, he keeps mewling, looking for his litterbox. Happiness is my way. And so is the barn, apparently. |
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01/22/2008 03:23:28 PM · #977 |
| OMG Don...I don't know what to say...what will Team Suck be without its fearless leader?...:-( |
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01/22/2008 03:32:38 PM · #978 |
Originally posted by snaffles:
OMG Don...I don't know what to say...what will Team Suck be without its fearless leader?...:-( |
Barn cat, house cat, cool cat, or gray cat, Don need not be a paid member to lead Team Suck. Mary ( quiet_observation), starter of threads, is not a paid member. I will not be one in three days time (or maybe now it's two). And Don will not be when his current paid membership ends. Many have left here entirely, many good, interesting challenging photographers are simply gone, erased. I'm grateful Don will stay around at all. It makes this a better place, even if he doesn't pay to do it.
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01/22/2008 03:43:43 PM · #979 |
Originally posted by posthumous:
The Barn Cat is as happy as the House Cat, as long as he knows he's in a barn. Otherwise, he keeps mewling, looking for his litterbox. Happiness is my way. And so is the barn, apparently. |
Keep out the vermin and cover your scat, and you're welcome in my barn any day Don.
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01/22/2008 03:45:03 PM · #980 |
Originally posted by rheverly:
Originally posted by snaffles:
OMG Don...I don't know what to say...what will Team Suck be without its fearless leader?...:-( |
Barn cat, house cat, cool cat, or gray cat, Don need not be a paid member to lead Team Suck. Mary ( quiet_observation), starter of threads, is not a paid member. I will not be one in three days time (or maybe now it's two). And Don will not be when his current paid membership ends. Many have left here entirely, many good, interesting challenging photographers are simply gone, erased. I'm grateful Don will stay around at all. It makes this a better place, even if he doesn't pay to do it. |
hear, hear.
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01/22/2008 03:46:58 PM · #981 |
Originally posted by kashi:
Originally posted by posthumous:
The Barn Cat is as happy as the House Cat, as long as he knows he's in a barn. Otherwise, he keeps mewling, looking for his litterbox. Happiness is my way. And so is the barn, apparently. |
Keep out the vermin and cover your scat, and you're welcome in my barn any day Don. |
even his fleas would be welcome - they could probably recite poetry! |
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01/22/2008 04:43:30 PM · #982 |
This is a sad day indeed. :(
However it does come to mind that Team Suck is both a family and an attitude. You cannot resign from a family, you created it, you moulded it, nurtured and guided Team Suck. Don, you will always be part of it. A refreshing Team Suck attitude is part of who you are, and I know that will not change, it will just be shared more with others.
On a technical note, just because you can only enter open challenges does not mean you cannot come and hang out at the Oasis....
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01/22/2008 04:47:25 PM · #983 |
Geesh, Don. I got to think about what you said. I'm not unsympathetic (hell, I'm very sympathetic) but there's a bit of a nose-and-face going on here...
R.
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01/22/2008 04:52:45 PM · #984 |
Originally posted by krnodil:
Originally posted by kashi:
Originally posted by posthumous:
The Barn Cat is as happy as the House Cat, as long as he knows he's in a barn. Otherwise, he keeps mewling, looking for his litterbox. Happiness is my way. And so is the barn, apparently. |
Keep out the vermin and cover your scat, and you're welcome in my barn any day Don. |
even his fleas would be welcome - they could probably recite poetry! |
Is that where a Flea Circus comes from???
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01/22/2008 04:55:16 PM · #985 |
Don, your comments are great, you are a good leader, but go with what you feel. Team Suck is an extension of you and others who have no desire to gain virtual glory or infamy, your family has grown somewhat hapazardly. There is no virtue in toeing the line if it isn't your way in life.
I wish much joy with whatever you choose to do, stay, go, member or not.
There is more to life than being that a Yes man, some want adoration, constant arse kissing, you don't! You are just you and keep it that way.
Good Luck:)
Steve |
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01/22/2008 05:12:50 PM · #986 |
Originally posted by posthumous:
skewsme and I have made and supported many challenge suggestions. They are almost never used. I was encouraged when langdon said he would post my tutorials on voting and commenting. I went through several drafts to get the wording right, to minimize my own biases and underline that I am only making suggestions. But months have passed and no tutorials. |
I had a similar situation. Wrote several tutorials, submitted them to be added, nothing ever happened. I suspect Langdon doesn't have the time he'd like to commit to the site, so he over promises and as a result under delivers, on occasion. It isn't ideal.
I ended up just finding other outlets to share that sort of thing. Many of the points in your post sound familiar to me and it seems nothing much has changed in several years. There probably needs to be some more involvement with someone who can actually access the codebase and make changes, if the site is going to actually change or adopt changes. The SC don't have that sort of ability. |
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01/22/2008 05:15:31 PM · #987 |
As a change of pace - I spoke with Svetlana this morning, and let her know that her presence was being missed here at DPC.
She is in the process of preparing for an exhibition, and said that all the printing and mounting and such was keeping her very busy at the moment.
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01/22/2008 05:20:03 PM · #988 |
| Kashi, thank you for keeping us updated - that is really good news. Go Svetlana! |
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01/22/2008 06:11:07 PM · #989 |
Originally posted by Bear_Music:
Geesh, Don. I got to think about what you said. I'm not unsympathetic (hell, I'm very sympathetic) but there's a bit of a nose-and-face going on here...
R. |
yes I'm looking into the nose-and-face aspect. I'm also looking into the swelled-head aspect. Willing to think more about this. people can pm me if they don't want to clutter this thread.
And yes, if my membership expires I will become known as Fearless-Leader-In-Exile. I will stay in the Team Suck family.
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01/22/2008 06:17:40 PM · #990 |
Originally posted by posthumous:
... about not renewing my membership... |
Possibly not the best time of year to be making life-altering decisions.
It's all very muddy, and maybe that's a problem. I don't think this site has a mandate, except that we pay for membership which sort of implies mandate, but there's nothing written - at least, nothing about promoting one form or another of cultural aesthetic.
DPC's about the craft, not the art. I don't even like to think of photography as art anyway. It's a technique. I don't think there's any doubt that art can be created with the use of the technique. Where the term is applicable and by whom and how and for what reason etc is kindling to a philosophical bonfire. Turning table legs isn't art, so why should making photographs be? That doesn't stop you taking/making better photographs and table legs and/or more pleasing ones.
Then again, I think all art is craft at some level anyway, and my name is Sisyphus and here I am at the bottom of the learning curve once again.
As my now superannuated Irish friend who once taught at some important London art academy once said (you can do the Dublin accent in your own head): "You can't be an artist if you can't mix fucking paint".
Anybody's guess what that has to say for renewing membership. Yer pays yer money and yer takes yer choice. Or not. |
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01/22/2008 06:26:44 PM · #991 |
Originally posted by posthumous:
And yes, if my membership expires I will become known as Fearless-Leader-In-Exile. I will stay in the Team Suck family. |
great...the Dalai Lama of Suck. ;) |
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01/22/2008 07:12:17 PM · #992 |
Originally posted by posthumous:
And yes, if my membership expires I will become known as Fearless-Leader-In-Exile. I will stay in the Team Suck family. |
Or our FLIE on the wall...
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01/22/2008 10:12:55 PM · #993 |
| Well, I braved the 19 degree weather, slipped and slid on the ice, and got a shot that I entered in Childhood. I predict a very low 5--if I'm lucky. |
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01/23/2008 12:12:30 AM · #994 |
| Updates abound in the results thread. One of these days I'll find my camera again.. |
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01/23/2008 01:51:52 AM · #995 |
Jayson, the sexy new lens is the 100mm f/2.8. One gets to treat one's self after a half year in the desert, no? :-) Next up may be a Volkswagen. No, you can't shoot with it, but it may fit in my European sized garage whereas the truck most certainly does not, and I had to scrape windshields this morning. (In Europe, or at least Germany, you cannot fire up the car and let it sit and idle whilst the windshields defrost. You also can't leave the car unlocked... pain in the butt if you'd like to have it stolen, but otherwise probably a good idea.)
Don, dear, don't you realize that there is a whole freakin' bunch of us who do not live for the DPC ribbons or the top tens (though we don't give them back if we screw up and get them) but we DO live for the very faint and tenuous possibility of a Posthumous Ribbon, of any hue? Should you default on the paltry $25 per year feature for political reasons, there will be one less challenge a week for which we can seek that lofty and nearly unattainable goal. You won't be able to vote in member challenges. What fun will that be for the rest of us? Hmmm?
With luck, I may have internet at home this evening. I did get a phone call from an automated woman who said a lot of stuff in German, most of which I didn't catch, which included "Mittwoche" and "internet". So I'm hoping it's this Wednesday. If not, I've more books to read. I've read four in the past week. |
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01/23/2008 09:02:29 AM · #996 |
Originally posted by Melethia:
Don, dear, don't you realize that there is a whole freakin' bunch of us who do not live for the DPC ribbons or the top tens (though we don't give them back if we screw up and get them) but we DO live for the very faint and tenuous possibility of a Posthumous Ribbon, of any hue? Should you default on the paltry $25 per year feature for political reasons, there will be one less challenge a week for which we can seek that lofty and nearly unattainable goal. You won't be able to vote in member challenges. What fun will that be for the rest of us? Hmmm?
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yes! excellent point, Deb, thanks for noting it - I'd been wracking my brains for a good pro vs. con argument and you have delivered the goods. :) Don, won't you miss your Member Challenge treasure hunts?
Of course, in the end Don, you need to do what's best for yourself (especially, if as you said, you feel disrespected in your current situation), but there's no harm in a little healthy debate. |
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01/23/2008 12:24:53 PM · #997 |
This score totally cracks me up and someone in TS knows why...
Childhood Without Children II
Votes: 50
Views: 79
Avg Vote: 4.2000
Comments: 1
I really thought about the obscene version, but couldn't do it. |
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01/23/2008 12:40:07 PM · #998 |
You know you have done a bad thing with a picture when you get the comment "...advertisement for a tourism board."
The commenter liked the shot, but now I feel deflated, not sure why I entered the bestof2007 shot that I did.
BestOf2007 sitting at a 6.2... Thinking about a selfDQ at this point. |
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01/23/2008 12:48:44 PM · #999 |
A: No such thing as a self DQ ...
B: How sick are you trying to make us pulling out of a challenge with over 400 entries with a 6+?
... from another thread and I agree!
Originally posted by levyj413:
... it'd be a sad day if you stopped expressing your own vision in favor of DPC voters' desires. |
C: I just noticed that it would be your third best score ever ... hrm ... Are you dabbling with hard drugs?
Message edited by author 2008-01-23 12:54:33.
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01/23/2008 12:49:27 PM · #1000 |
Originally posted by jaysonmc:
You know you have done a bad thing with a picture when you get the comment "...advertisement for a tourism board."
The commenter liked the shot, but now I feel deflated, not sure why I entered the bestof2007 shot that I did.
BestOf2007 sitting at a 6.2... Thinking about a selfDQ at this point. |
You're thinking of self DQing a 6.2? I'd be thrilled with that. |
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