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DPChallenge Forums >> Photography Discussion >> Confessions of a “Friend Voter”
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Showing posts 176 - 191 of 191, (reverse)
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 06/06/2007 03:52:51 PM · #176
Originally posted by NstiG8tr:
Originally posted by stdavidson:
Right now I don't have many either. ;) LOL!!!!


Sure you do Steve. Tons of them. Right now they're just rippin you a new ass.

Gee... that is nice to know. I'd just rather be right than have a new... wellll... you know. :) :) :)
 06/06/2007 03:53:13 PM · #177
Originally posted by stdavidson:

That is a good question to. There are lots of times I do not recognize the top finishing images with my votes. Does that make me wrong in those cases? I don't think so.


I often don't even _like_ the ribbon photos, but that has nothing to do with the user who took it. Just my opinion, which is based solely on the work presented.

And for the record, I still think you're a great guy, but I don't give anyone leniency. ;P
 06/06/2007 03:55:46 PM · #178
Originally posted by Buckeye_Fan:
Originally posted by Buckeye_Fan:
Steve, if there were only 2 photo, mine and your friend's, can you honestly tell me that you would give me a fair vote? Voted on the technical aspects of my photo against your friends. Are you honestly saying that no matter how good my photo is, your friend gets the higher vote just because he/she is your friend? Because, that is exactly how you are coming across.


I'm still waiting for an answer to my question.


hmmmm..still no answer. Well, I guess I know the answer.
 06/06/2007 03:56:14 PM · #179
Originally posted by keans_d:
Originally posted by chimericvisions:

Yes, it is. Regardless of whether you are "friends" with them, you know who they are and intentionally vote them higher.


BUT what if their photos are really GREAT??? Is that still friend voting?

No. but when (for example) someone votes every single photo of a given person (known to the voter) a 10, even though that photographer's average scores vary all over between 4.9 and 6.7, it does not take a statistical genius to figure out that those votes are biased by the knowledge of the photographer's identity.
 06/06/2007 03:56:30 PM · #180
Originally posted by stdavidson:
I'd just rather be right


But in this instance you are not and everyone is telling you so. My grandmother used to say to me "When it seems you are right and everyone else is wrong, it is time to rethink your position." Time to rethink...
 06/06/2007 03:57:23 PM · #181
Originally posted by keans_d:
Originally posted by chimericvisions:

Yes, it is. Regardless of whether you are "friends" with them, you know who they are and intentionally vote them higher.


BUT what if their photos are really GREAT??? Is that still friend voting?

And just like what you said, one vote shouldn't make a difference but there is a chance that I can be banned because I admire or support photographers??? *scratches head*


If the IMAGE is great...and you voted the IMAGE with a great score, then that's, er, great.

If the IMAGE is bad...and you vote the IMAGE with a great score, that's within the rules as well.

If the IMAGE is great...and you vote the IMAGE with a low score, that's fine as well.

If the IMAGE is great...and you voted a great score because you like the USER, then that is against the rules. Would it be difficult to tell that your vote was biased towards the user? Yup...but it's still not right.

If the IMAGE is brutal, but you vote HIGH or LOW because you know the USER who took the image, then that's against the rules.

That's my understanding.
06/06/2007 03:57:51 PM · #182
Originally posted by Melethia:
The rule says:

You may not offer or cast biased votes for any other user.

Perhaps we should have an stdavidson amendment:

You may not inflate (or deflate) votes based on your knowledge of the photographer of an image (also known as "friend voting".)

Or something like that.


I think that's his point for doing this.
 06/06/2007 03:58:29 PM · #183
How do you know which entries belong to your 'friends'?
 06/06/2007 03:59:29 PM · #184
I was in a perfect tie for third place for the Kitchenware challenge. If one of us had (or didn't have) a "friend" vote, it would have swayed that ribbon, right?!

The rules are defined and there is a level of trust in that. Much like many things in life that could only really be controlled by a POLICE STATE ⦠and lord knows we don't want that.
 06/06/2007 03:59:51 PM · #185
Originally posted by stdavidson:
Originally posted by pccjrose:
Okay, okay - I think I know understand your point. You want "friend voting" clearly laid out in black and white for all to see - with clearly laid out rules and no subjective language.

I think this is somewhat unreasonable.

What? You think it is OK for you to get a ticket for speeding when not even told what the speed limit is? I think NOT!.


Actually, if you went to court armed with this as a sole means of defense you would be found guilty. No one needs to tell you what the speed limit is... the onus is on you to know and keep a lookout for posted signs.

There are certain things in law that are called "Actus Reus" where the commission of the act is in itself a transgression.

Ray
 06/06/2007 04:00:23 PM · #186
Originally posted by macrothing:
How do you know which entries belong to your 'friends'?


You've seen the photo (perhaps to give opinions or ideas during processing), they're a family member, it's a self-portrait and you recognize them, they have a distinctive style, ...
 06/06/2007 04:01:27 PM · #187
Originally posted by Buckeye_Fan:
Originally posted by Buckeye_Fan:
Steve, if there were only 2 photo, mine and your friend's, can you honestly tell me that you would give me a fair vote? Voted on the technical aspects of my photo against your friends. Are you honestly saying that no matter how good my photo is, your friend gets the higher vote just because he/she is your friend? Because, that is exactly how you are coming across.


I'm still waiting for an answer to my question.

Sorry... here is what I would do...
If there were only two photos in a challenge and lets assume that I was working with the other photographer then is it possible I would give yours a lower score than theirs. Yes. But if yours were truely the better photograph do you really think yours would get a lower score just because of me? I don't think so.
 06/06/2007 04:02:56 PM · #188
Where is that popcorn icon? Last time I sat through a short discussion of this it was hotdogs.

I want popcorn!

P.S. - BTW - it was nice meeting you Steve. Hope your lifetime ban doesn't keep you from future gatherings. Was I supposed to tell you about that ban yet?

06/06/2007 04:06:00 PM · #189
Originally posted by stdavidson:
Originally posted by Buckeye_Fan:
Originally posted by Buckeye_Fan:
Steve, if there were only 2 photo, mine and your friend's, can you honestly tell me that you would give me a fair vote? Voted on the technical aspects of my photo against your friends. Are you honestly saying that no matter how good my photo is, your friend gets the higher vote just because he/she is your friend? Because, that is exactly how you are coming across.


I'm still waiting for an answer to my question.

Sorry... here is what I would do...
If there were only two photos in a challenge and lets assume that I was working with the other photographer then is it possible I would give yours a lower score than theirs. Yes. But if yours were truely the better photograph do you really think yours would get a lower score just because of me? I don't think so.


If the majority thought it was a better photo technically, wow factor, and everything inbetween you'd score me lower no matter what in the hopes that I would lose to your friend. That's being biased and unfair!

Honestly, how do you think that inflating your friend's score is helping them?? If you were my mentor and I found out you weren't being honest about how I was really doing, I'd be livid. Don't build someone up on false pretenses when the majority see it otherwise. I certainly wouldn't want you as my teacher.

There ya have it folks, in black and white. I certainly hope SC will investigate this now.

Message edited by author 2007-06-06 16:09:37.
 06/06/2007 04:11:36 PM · #190
Originally posted by stdavidson:
Originally posted by Buckeye_Fan:
Originally posted by Buckeye_Fan:
Steve, if there were only 2 photo, mine and your friend's, can you honestly tell me that you would give me a fair vote? Voted on the technical aspects of my photo against your friends. Are you honestly saying that no matter how good my photo is, your friend gets the higher vote just because he/she is your friend? Because, that is exactly how you are coming across.


I'm still waiting for an answer to my question.

Sorry... here is what I would do...
If there were only two photos in a challenge and lets assume that I was working with the other photographer then is it possible I would give yours a lower score than theirs. Yes. But if yours were truely the better photograph do you really think yours would get a lower score just because of me? I don't think so.


See.. for me this puts it in a perspective I'm hoping you can understand. (As well as anyone else that might be questioning this).

If there are only two images in a challenge, and you KNOW one image is from a certain user, and you know that you're going to give that user a higher score because you feel that it would, somehow, give them a reason to keep being a photographer, or give them a mood boost, or whatever the reasoning... the onus is on you to not vote.

This doesn't change in *any* way for challenges with 200 entries. Or 2000.

If you go ahead and give that higher vote, you are unbalancing things. You are being biased, and you are skewing the results.. in your friend's favor. Whatever good intentions lead to it, don't matter one little bit. Now multiply that by that person having one other friend do the same. Now by 5 other friends. Now by 25.

The road to hell is paved with good intentions, they say...

I'm with other people in that I think you're really only going on about this because you're getting some weird kick out of it. It's the only logical explanation now... but for some reason I can't quite help but try and put things in perspective for you, despite the fact that it isn't going to help one iota.

But.. maybe it'll help one of these phantom "most people" out there that also don't understand the rule as written that you seem to believe exist. (or, more accurately, my hope is that it will help one of the few actual people that don't quite get it, which there most likely are a few of.)
 06/06/2007 04:12:47 PM · #191
folks..I'm locking this thread. We're all going in circles. No one's mind has been changed, the discussion is going nowhere, and tempers are flaring.
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