Confessions of a “Friend Voter”

Fujifilm XF 55-200mm f/3.5-4.8 R LM OIS

06/06/2007 03:25:28 PM · #151

Originally posted by scalvert:

Originally posted by stdavidson:
And how does encouraging a developing photographer turn this into a popularity contest?

Encourage a developing photographer with comments and suggestions. Voting high on a photo that doesn't deserve it serves no purpose but to give a false sense of accomplishment IMO. If my early entries had all scored over 6, I wouldn't have had as much incentive to try and improve.

You are an exception, not the rule. Your accomplishments validate that.

Now what does that have to do with how I chose to score? How does that relate to the rules as they currently exist?

ursula

Fujifilm X-T2

06/06/2007 03:27:07 PM · #152

Originally posted by keans_d:

I am a very big fan of joey lawrence, silverfoxx, librodo and ursula but they are not really my friends and I can identify their works and I give them 10 almost all the time because I want to see their photos get ribbons, SO does that make me a friend voter?

And what is the difference of that to people giving whiterook a 10 to spoil his quest for a brown ribbon?

I'm nobody's friend :)

Trying to joke a bit, BTW. I really hope you're not doing this. It would be very embarrasing.

I strongly believe that people should be able to vote their mind (whatever that means). I also think we'd be better off spending less energy on this and more on making images.

hopper

Canon EOS-80D

Canon EF 35mm f/2 IS USM

06/06/2007 03:27:36 PM · #153

you quoted his comments on your logic, not his comments regarding the rules

Originally posted by stdavidson:

Originally posted by scalvert:

Originally posted by stdavidson:
And how does encouraging a developing photographer turn this into a popularity contest?

Encourage a developing photographer with comments and suggestions. Voting high on a photo that doesn't deserve it serves no purpose but to give a false sense of accomplishment IMO. If my early entries had all scored over 6, I wouldn't have had as much incentive to try and improve.

You are an exception, not the rule. Your accomplishments validate that.

Now what does that have to do with how I chose to score? How does that relate to the rules as they currently exist?

Bud

Canon EOS-550D Rebel T2i

Sigma 18-250mm f/3.5-6.3 DC OS HSM

06/06/2007 03:28:41 PM · #154

Dang, I don't even have a friend...

GeneralE

Canon PowerShot S3 IS

Canon 12x IS USM (S3 IS built-in Lens) -- 36-432mm (35mm EQ)

06/06/2007 03:33:44 PM · #155

Originally posted by stdavidson:

Now what does that have to do with how I chose to score? How does that relate to the rules as they currently exist?

You agree to abide by the site terms of use and site rules when you register and participate. If you don't understand the voting rules, then perhaps you shouldn't be voting at all until you do.

I gave you a perfectly workable definition of both "friend voting" and "troll voting" a while ago, which you have so far refused to acknowledge. Until you read those and explain to me just what you continue to find "unclear" about the rule, I have to look at your continuing protestations as disingenuous.

Message edited by author 2007-06-06 15:34:34.

hihosilver

Nikon D200

Nikon AF-S Zoom-Nikkor 28-70mm f/2.8D IF-ED

06/06/2007 03:33:52 PM · #156

Originally posted by pccjrose:

You may not:
give an entry a lower score because you believe it violates the Challenge Rules.
recommend an entry for disqualification for not meeting the challenge.
vote on an entry based on its server-generated thumbnail.
vote on your own entry.
vote in a manner that suggests an intent to disrupt the voting system.
offer or cast biased votes for any other user.

[quote=pccjrose]

I'm so very grateful to read the rules posted here. I recently entered a photo where I received a score of 3.8xxx and landed in the bottom 0% out of 550 photos. During the challenge, I received 26 comments of which every single one stated that my photo did not meet the challenge. (6 of the commenters were nice enough to say they still liked my photo (THANKS!), but no one else had anything else to say...)

Out of the 227 voters on that image...2 people gave me a 10. Guess what? Those single votes did not carry much relevance now did they? The weight of the majority still carried the day...(and I still like my photo anyways even if it came in 2nd to last place...Damn that

Whiterook who stole my Crown of Brown!).

The moral of the story: A single vote of 10 does not carry much relevance. So, Steve, Dear...if you want to play the sacrificial lamb today, the assassination of your character will be marked only by the graveyard statement "Rest in Peace" (Obviously, you will live to be a very old man...for only the "good" and unbiased voters die young...;-)).

I would like to think that a higher moral ground exists here, but where we all stand on that ground lies within our own character. My average vote given is 6.9xx and has been high from day one because I like everyone's work here at DPC and I think your work deserves a high score. Clearly, I stand on a higher range of voting ground that everyone else (I'm an orphan on the statistical twin thread!)

On the serious side, I'm 100% certain that my score means absolutely nothing if taken outside of the context of the vast majority which I am by nature as evidenced by my average score given.

Steve, it's your vote and your comment to give...however you may define that for yourself. We own our own characters and as well as our votes.

-M

P.S. (Steve, If you need some vacation time from DPC, come to LA for a photo safari... and place your true talents in the proper arena of photography and out of the arena of righteousness).

As an artist, your work carries far more relevance than your single vote.

Relevance is all.

keans_d

Mattel Barbie Photo Designer Digital Camera

06/06/2007 03:34:02 PM · #157

Originally posted by ursula:

That is SO sweet and a cute reply! Thank you Ursula! Now I am a bigger fan! ;)

Canon 12x IS USM (S3 IS built-in Lens) -- 36-432mm (35mm EQ)

06/06/2007 03:34:32 PM · #158

If there is a rule that forbids the way I vote then I will adhere to it. What is it? It can't be the "biased" voter rule since that really does not mean anything since every vote is biased in some way. That rule needs to be reworked if "biased" voting is to be forbidden.

Originally posted by hopper:

you quoted his comments on your logic, not his comments regarding the rules

Originally posted by stdavidson:

Originally posted by scalvert:

Originally posted by stdavidson:
And how does encouraging a developing photographer turn this into a popularity contest?

Encourage a developing photographer with comments and suggestions. Voting high on a photo that doesn't deserve it serves no purpose but to give a false sense of accomplishment IMO. If my early entries had all scored over 6, I wouldn't have had as much incentive to try and improve.

You are an exception, not the rule. Your accomplishments validate that.

Now what does that have to do with how I chose to score? How does that relate to the rules as they currently exist?

GeneralE

Canon PowerShot S3 IS

06/06/2007 03:36:51 PM · #159

Originally posted by stdavidson:

If there is a rule that forbids the way I vote then I will adhere to it. What is it?

Still waiting ...

Melethia

Canon EOS-80D

06/06/2007 03:37:24 PM · #160

The rule says:

You may not offer or cast biased votes for any other user.

Perhaps we should have an stdavidson amendment:

You may not inflate (or deflate) votes based on your knowledge of the photographer of an image (also known as "friend voting".)

Or something like that.

chimericvisions

Canon EF 24-70mm f/2.8L II

06/06/2007 03:38:28 PM · #161

Originally posted by hihosilver:

The moral of the story: A single vote of 10 does not carry much relevance. So, Steve, Dear...if you want to play the sacrificial lamb today, the assassination of your character will be marked only by the graveyard statement "Rest in Peace" (Obviously, you will live to be a very old man...for only the "good" and unbiased voters die young...;-)).

A single ten does carry weight - especially if a photo is in the running for a ribbon. All the difference in the world rests with a single vote. In the case where there are so many ones and twos that a single ten raises the average by .005, sure it doesn't seem like a change, because it likely won't effect final placement. For those at the head (and even in the middle) of the pack, it will. Does the difference between 140/300 and 139/300 make a difference in the long run? Generally speaking, no.

The problem with friend voting is that if you have 30 friends and get 30 tens, that makes a *significant* difference in the overall placement.

06/06/2007 03:39:50 PM · #162

Originally posted by ursula:

I strongly believe that people should be able to vote their mind (whatever that means). I also think we'd be better off spending less energy on this and more on making images.

No surprise... I agree with this view as well.

chimericvisions

Canon EF 24-70mm f/2.8L II

06/06/2007 03:40:17 PM · #163

Originally posted by stdavidson:

Steve, you keep ignoring the most important part of the rule. The rule is not "offer or cast biased votes", it's "offer or cast biased votes for any other user." For a user. It is very specific about USER.

idnic

Canon EF-S 17-55mm f/2.8 IS USM

06/06/2007 03:40:54 PM · #164

This thread comes across as a pathetic grab for attention, which unfortunately it is getting. I think the DPC majority have stated their opinions and that they are consistent is the only good thing I've gotten from this thread.

I'll shut the door behind me.

OdysseyF22

Panasonic DC-G9

Olympus 12-45mm f/4.0 Pro

06/06/2007 03:41:44 PM · #165

Originally posted by stdavidson:

How many more, different ways does it need to be said? The rule prohibits a biased vote for another user. It says nothing about a bias of content or subject, as those are still technical criteria relating to the photograph itself.

Bias towards a user, however, does not reflect the photo or entry, and are therefore against the rules. So the rule does mean exactly what it states. You simply choose not to accept that.

Buckeye_Fan

06/06/2007 03:42:37 PM · #166

Originally posted by Buckeye_Fan:

Steve, if there were only 2 photo, mine and your friend's, can you honestly tell me that you would give me a fair vote? Voted on the technical aspects of my photo against your friends. Are you honestly saying that no matter how good my photo is, your friend gets the higher vote just because he/she is your friend? Because, that is exactly how you are coming across.

I'm still waiting for an answer to my question.

SDW

Tamron AF 28-300mm f/3.5-6.3 XR Di LD Aspherical IF for Canon

06/06/2007 03:42:40 PM · #167

Simplified:

Youâ��re a judge (voter) at the Olympic games (DPChallenge). A gymnast (friend) starts her routine (takes a picture) on the balance beam (enters a challenge). She has an average routine (photograph), she bobbled a few times (photo not technically sound), didnâ��t go for a high difficulty performance (took a dull photograph) and she didnâ��t stick her dismount (had no wow factor). But yet you give her a 10 (I would call that a bias 10 vote).

Message edited by author 2007-06-06 15:44:40.

keans_d

Mattel Barbie Photo Designer Digital Camera

06/06/2007 03:44:08 PM · #168

Originally posted by chimericvisions:

Yes, it is. Regardless of whether you are "friends" with them, you know who they are and intentionally vote them higher.

BUT what if their photos are really GREAT??? Is that still friend voting?

And just like what you said, one vote shouldn't make a difference but there is a chance that I can be banned because I admire or support photographers??? *scratches head*

Fujifilm XF 23mm f/2 R WR

06/06/2007 03:46:47 PM · #169

Originally posted by aguapreta:

Dang, I don't even have a friend...

Right now I don't have many either. ;) LOL!!!!

aznym

Fujifilm X-T3

06/06/2007 03:47:21 PM · #170

DO you come here to scratch your head?

NstiG8tr

Canon EOS-5D Mark IV

Canon EF 85mm f/1.2L II USM

06/06/2007 03:48:36 PM · #171

Originally posted by keans_d:

*scratches head*

Good way to get a bald spot!!

keans_d

Mattel Barbie Photo Designer Digital Camera

06/06/2007 03:49:42 PM · #172

Originally posted by xion:

DO you come here to scratch your head?

Yes, for the most part! LOL!

Canon EF 85mm f/1.2L II USM

06/06/2007 03:49:44 PM · #173

Originally posted by keans_d:

Originally posted by chimericvisions:

Yes, it is. Regardless of whether you are "friends" with them, you know who they are and intentionally vote them higher.

BUT what if their photos are really GREAT??? Is that still friend voting?

That is a good question to. There are lots of times I do not recognize the top finishing images with my votes. Does that make me wrong in those cases? I don't think so.

Message edited by author 2007-06-06 15:50:31.

NstiG8tr

Canon EOS-5D Mark IV

06/06/2007 03:50:19 PM · #174

Originally posted by stdavidson:

Right now I don't have many either. ;) LOL!!!!

Sure you do Steve. Tons of them. Right now they're just rippin you a new ass.

chimericvisions