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02/07/2007 12:24:35 AM · #126 |
Originally posted by fotomann_forever:
So far, I really like GeneralE's idea of the Digimarc. It's invisible (mostly) and trackable. This should mean that we will know where are images are going. |
You could certainly digimarc all of your own images. Costs $499 a year if you want the tracking, which is what makes it actually useful. I suspect a site license would be about 10x that, if dpc wanted to do it for everyone. Ken Rockwell (!) doesn't have a very high opinion of it.
Message edited by author 2007-02-07 00:26:03.
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02/07/2007 12:28:10 AM · #127 |
Originally posted by Gordon:
Ken Rockwell (!) doesn't have a very high opinion of it. |
Well, that's because he's a moron... but I won't sidetrack this thread.
Yes, I could spend $500 a year... but I'm not positive it is legal in basic editing ... as it does add some pixel data.
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02/07/2007 12:35:14 AM · #128 |
Originally posted by fotomann_forever:
... I'm not positive it is legal in basic editing ... as it does add some pixel data. |
I suspect we would consider making the use of the Digimarc filter legal since it should not -- if properly applied -- change the appearance of the image. However, we've not discussed that issue yet -- thanks for raising the point. |
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02/07/2007 01:01:20 AM · #129 |
Is there not a way to have the uploaded .jpg files get a new extenstion like .dpc attached to them and then have the DPC site be able to view them while the other sites cannot without renaming them to .jpg. I know it could be defeated easily but it would seem that this would stop the "casual" theft of images. Most people are not smart enough, or way too lazy to rename extensions on images so that they can steal them.
What would be cool is if some company made an encryption for just this purpose. Say you upload a file, it becomes encrypted with a code that only that site has the key for so it would do nobody anygood to just copy it. They would have to take a screen shot which is just a lot more effort.
Just a thought. Now you guys can tell me what a stupid idea this is and how it will never work. |
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02/07/2007 01:06:35 AM · #130 |
Not stupid ideas, but they won't work ;-)
As far as the .dpc extension... the browser needs the .jpg to know what to do with the image...it has nothing really to do with the site. The site just serves the image to the browser which displays the image.
For the same reason, the encryption won't work. Well, that might work, but would need a special browser extension to work. That would take a LOT of programming and would require us all to download and install extensions and probably we'd all have to use the same browser.
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02/07/2007 01:13:47 AM · #131 |
Originally posted by fotomann_forever:
Not stupid ideas, but they won't work ;-)
As far as the .dpc extension... the browser needs the .jpg to know what to do with the image...it has nothing really to do with the site. The site just serves the image to the browser which displays the image.
For the same reason, the encryption won't work. Well, that might work, but would need a special browser extension to work. That would take a LOT of programming and would require us all to download and install extensions and probably we'd all have to use the same browser. |
Or a DPC plugin. OR better yet, JAVA or Flash.
Message edited by author 2007-02-07 01:14:59. |
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02/07/2007 01:17:36 AM · #132 |
Originally posted by boomtap:
Or a DPC plugin. OR better yet, JAVA or Flash. |
I actually would prefer Flash for voting for many reasons other than security... but I'm suer a lot of people would protest.
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02/07/2007 01:23:00 AM · #133 |
| People will protest anything. |
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02/07/2007 01:50:52 AM · #134 |
maybe this came up already, maybe not.
I LOVE smuggy's ability to implement a custom copyright watermark on pics. you can apply it or not. I'd love to have something like that I can stick on things after a challenge is over.
edit: to clarify; smuggy = smugmug.com
Message edited by author 2007-02-07 01:53:52. |
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02/07/2007 02:02:38 AM · #135 |
Originally posted by MPRPRO:
Originally posted by idnic:
I know the theives will still be there - but my point was that it doesn't take much effort at all to be a little proactive.
That took a whole 10 minutes to create and another 5 to upload to my most viewed images. |
Bottom line is if you do not register your images with the Copyright office of the United States you can not collect anything as far as financial. You can prosecute in civil court to stop the use of the image. You can not collect any damages though. |
From what I've read, even if you were not registered when the infringement occurred, you can collect damages... but you have to prove them. When registered you can collect damages up to $30k without proving that you actually had damages, under certain conditions.
Also, the copyright office could chose to go after the infringer in criminal court. This is seperate than a civil case. I guess it has to be a pretty flaggerent case to warrent criminal prosecution.
But it's best to just have your images registered. It's so much easier to collect if you find a person using your images and they are worth going after.
Mike
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02/07/2007 02:03:31 AM · #136 |
Smuggy? ;-) hehe... isn't that a bit like a pet name?
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02/07/2007 02:08:34 AM · #137 |
Originally posted by fotomann_forever:
Smuggy? ;-) hehe... isn't that a bit like a pet name? |
Well, it HAS become kinda pet like. has a cute little smiley face! and I sure am fond of it!
Yes, you CAN persue copyright infringement whether its registered or not. Its easier to do so when it is registered. You have something like 30 days to register it after you DISCOVER an infringement to register the image and still use that registration against the infringer. This is a my personal understanding. You should read on it tho'. to make sure I'm interpreting it correct. |
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02/07/2007 02:17:53 AM · #138 |
Straight from the US copyright.gov page
Copyright Registration
In general, copyright registration is a legal formality intended to make a public record of the basic facts of a particular copyright. However, registration is not a condition of copyright protection. Even though registration is not a requirement for protection, the copyright law provides several inducements or advantages to encourage copyright owners to make registration. Among these advantages are the following:
* Registration establishes a public record of the copyright claim.
* Before an infringement suit may be filed in court, registration is necessary for works of U.S. origin.
* If made before or within 5 years of publication, registration will establish prima facie evidence in court of the validity of the copyright and of the facts stated in the certificate.
* If registration is made within 3 months after publication of the work or prior to an infringement of the work, statutory damages and attorney's fees will be available to the copyright owner in court actions. Otherwise, only an award of actual damages and profits is available to the copyright owner.
* Registration allows the owner of the copyright to record the registration with the U. S. Customs Service for protection against the importation of infringing copies. For additional information, go to the U.S. Customs and Border Protection website at www.cbp.gov/xp/cgov/import. Click on “Intellectual Property Rights.”
Registration may be made at any time within the life of the copyright. Unlike the law before 1978, when a work has been registered in unpublished form, it is not necessary to make another registration when the work becomes published, although the copyright owner may register the published edition, if desired.
Edit to add: copyright.gov linky
Originally posted by MikeJ:
Originally posted by MPRPRO:
Originally posted by idnic:
I know the theives will still be there - but my point was that it doesn't take much effort at all to be a little proactive.
That took a whole 10 minutes to create and another 5 to upload to my most viewed images. |
Bottom line is if you do not register your images with the Copyright office of the United States you can not collect anything as far as financial. You can prosecute in civil court to stop the use of the image. You can not collect any damages though. |
From what I've read, even if you were not registered when the infringement occurred, you can collect damages... but you have to prove them. When registered you can collect damages up to $30k without proving that you actually had damages, under certain conditions.
Also, the copyright office could chose to go after the infringer in criminal court. This is seperate than a civil case. I guess it has to be a pretty flaggerent case to warrent criminal prosecution.
But it's best to just have your images registered. It's so much easier to collect if you find a person using your images and they are worth going after.
Mike |
Message edited by author 2007-02-07 02:19:37. |
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02/07/2007 02:24:00 AM · #139 |
I love people that state facts, instead of opinions... thanks MikeJ and Ristyz
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02/07/2007 02:33:47 AM · #140 |
Originally posted by fotomann_forever:
I love people that state facts, instead of opinions... thanks MikeJ and Ristyz |
Happy to oblige when I can!
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02/07/2007 07:36:04 AM · #141 |
| I'm just curious...I thought I read somewhere that when it comes to photography and art, there are different copyright laws. If I can find the page where I saw it before I'll paste the link. Just wondering if anyone else saw this difference somewhere? |
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02/07/2007 07:50:55 AM · #142 |
Originally posted by albc28:
I'm just curious...I thought I read somewhere that when it comes to photography and art, there are different copyright laws. If I can find the page where I saw it before I'll paste the link. Just wondering if anyone else saw this difference somewhere? |
Photography is one form of art. Different physical artistic mediums may have marginally differing rules (eg 2D v 3D, specific rules on architecture) but they are substantially all the same. Performance arts have slightly different rules.
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02/07/2007 08:18:45 AM · #143 |
Originally posted by fotomann_forever:
Originally posted by Gordon:
Ken Rockwell (!) doesn't have a very high opinion of it. |
Well, that's because he's a moron... but I won't sidetrack this thread.
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That's isn't something I'd dispute. However after a bit of searching I could only find one positive result from a company using Digimarc, other than their own press releases - and that was 4 years ago. Either nobody is using it, nobody wants to say it is working, or it doesn't do anything useful. But at least on google, the silence was deafening.
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02/07/2007 09:04:00 AM · #144 |
Originally posted by fotomann_forever:
Originally posted by boomtap:
Or a DPC plugin. OR better yet, JAVA or Flash. |
I actually would prefer Flash for voting for many reasons other than security... but I'm suer a lot of people would protest. |
Images imbeded in flash movies can still be saved by doing a screen shot (print screen) and pasting it itno an image editor! |
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02/07/2007 09:09:01 AM · #145 |
Originally posted by Gordon:
Originally posted by fotomann_forever:
Originally posted by Gordon:
Ken Rockwell (!) doesn't have a very high opinion of it. |
Well, that's because he's a moron... but I won't sidetrack this thread.
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That's isn't something I'd dispute. However after a bit of searching I could only find one positive result from a company using Digimarc, other than their own press releases - and that was 4 years ago. Either nobody is using it, nobody wants to say it is working, or it doesn't do anything useful. But at least on google, the silence was deafening. |
Since it appears to primarily be a grain pattern that would affect photo quality in a very weird way, I wouldn't prefer Digimarc either. |
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02/07/2007 09:30:15 AM · #146 |
OK this is a little beside the track, but HOW DO FIND OUT THAT PEOPLE ARE USING YOUR IMAGE? I MEAN...HOW DID IRENE FIND OUT? IS THERE SOME WAY TO MONITOR THIS?
Chris |
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02/07/2007 09:31:45 AM · #147 |
Originally posted by smyk:
OK this is a little beside the track, but HOW DO FIND OUT THAT PEOPLE ARE USING YOUR IMAGE? I MEAN...HOW DID IRENE FIND OUT? IS THERE SOME WAY TO MONITOR THIS?
Chris |
SOmeone saw it on break.com Millions of people visit sites like ebaums world, break.com, weirdspot.com. Many users on here look at it when we see a contest winner its obvious lol.
Sadly the people that view the site are the ones that drive the demand to steal more images. |
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02/07/2007 09:36:28 AM · #148 |
| Hmm, I always keep an eye for shots i've seen. This summer I saw the store "Banana Republic" use an image that looked EXACTLY like Shepets "jade" (if that's the title) shot. I notifiyed her at one but never got an answer back :( |
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02/07/2007 10:11:27 AM · #149 |
Originally posted by rainmotorsports:
Originally posted by fotomann_forever:
Originally posted by boomtap:
Or a DPC plugin. OR better yet, JAVA or Flash. |
I actually would prefer Flash for voting for many reasons other than security... but I'm suer a lot of people would protest. |
Images imbeded in flash movies can still be saved by doing a screen shot (print screen) and pasting it itno an image editor! |
Yes, but people are too lazy to do that for a low resolution image. It could prevent major theft. You would still have theft on some obscure sites, but you probably would not have alot of casual theft. |
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02/07/2007 01:48:01 PM · #150 |
Originally posted by boomtap:
Yes, but people are too lazy to do that for a low resolution image. It could prevent major theft. You would still have theft on some obscure sites, but you probably would not have alot of casual theft. |
Yes, and the one's that go to all the trouble to steal an image are the ones that I would want to prosecute, not the pre-teen with a pretty blog.
I wonder how many of the nude images here are on obscure porn sites.
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