About to buy Canon 300D, but need help with lenses

Canon EF-S 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6 IS

10/04/2003 07:19:23 AM · #1

I've decided to get a dSLR camera, main reasons being, I want some decent zoom, and ability to control what happens in the photo, but I don't understand how to tell what zoom a lense is.

I have used a SLR camera many years ago (still have camera and lense, but camera is broken), it had 28-80mm lense, and was a very nice general purpose lense. from what I've been reading, the included lense is about equivelent (28 to 90mm 35mm equivelent)

I really don;t know if that is the correct way to compare, as a compared the kodak ls443 (worst images, not reccomended) and its a 35mm-105mm equiv, the 35mm would be about correct, but the 105mm is the same as the 80mm on the slr lense.

Anyway, using the ls443's 35mm as 1x zoom... I am after something around the 60x - 400x zoom, after going through a 2x, so I have 30x range covered aswell.

I don't care for autofocus on the large zoom, as if theres an optional, I'd prefer to pay the lesser.

Also a macro lense, that would allow me to enlarge something about the size of a watch face to full size.

Can anyone help me with a way of understanding the mm aspect of lenses, or what would suit me best?

Konador

Canon EOS-500D Rebel T1i

10/04/2003 07:49:33 AM · #2

To get the amount of zoom, you take the mm, times it by 1.6 (crop factor on the 300D), then divide by 32.

eg

75mm-300mm lens = 300mm x 1.6 / 32mm = 15x zoom.

Message edited by author 2003-10-04 07:49:58.

Azrifel

Fujifilm X100VI

10/04/2003 09:36:01 AM · #3

Also be sure to check out this thread:
//www.dpchallenge.com/forum.php?action=read&FORUM_THREAD_ID=42536
when you are looking for new lenses.

ddmckinney1954

Canon EOS-300D Rebel

10/04/2003 10:43:25 AM · #4

I have the 300D Canon EOS Digital Rebel and love it. Why not consider a mirror reflex lens if you don't care anything about auto focus. You can pick those up fairly cheaply. Check ebay...but deal with a dealer.
A 500 mm mirror reflex will give you the equivalent of 800mm.
I bought a 28mm-200mm Sigma for 164.00. Some of the Sigma lenses will need to be sent back to Sigma for a modification for the 300D and 10D Canon EOS cameras. You will need to call Sigma to find out if which ones. They do the modification for free but takes 2-3 weeks.
Diana

jimmythefish

10/04/2003 11:26:04 AM · #5

Zoom factor on digital cameras is just a ratio between the short end and the long end. A Sony F7x7 has a 5x zoom because its long end is a 190mm equivalent, and the short end is a 38mm equivalent...190/38 = 5. The zoom factor doesn't really help with determining the absolute magnification, as the short end varies - eg. Canon's 35-350mm is a 10x zoom and the 100-400 is a 4x zoom. The latter's reach, however, is greater.

A much better way to get an idea is to multiply by 1.6 and compare to a traditional 35mm camera. A 70-200mm lens is a 112-320mm equivalent field of view on a 10D/300D.

The only lenses designed to work with the 300D are EF-mount lenses, and they're all autofocus lenses. YOu can toggle them to manual focus, but if you're in a position where you don't want to spend money on decent lenses you might just be better off with the F707. Figure that you'll spend more money on lenses than you will on the body.

Originally posted by Konador:

To get the amount of zoom, you take the mm, times it by 1.6 (crop factor on the 300D), then divide by 32.

eg

75mm-300mm lens = 300mm x 1.6 / 32mm = 15x zoom.

Message edited by author 2003-10-04 11:27:54.

10/04/2003 02:28:16 PM · #6

there is a new mount style that only fits the 300d the EF-S mount
not sure if those lenses will be cheaper than the standard EF lenses or
more money
they only fit the 300D
i think they fit farther into the camera body - giving a shorter overall
lense length - maybe to balance the light weight body with the heavier lenses you can add...

soup

jimmythefish

10/04/2003 02:42:25 PM · #7

The only lens that will be an EF-S lens is the 18-55, according to Canon. It's designed to make a smaller imaging area to fit the 1.6x crop, and doesn't work on the 10D or any other EOS camera because of the different mirror mechanism. I might have considered one, given the convenience as a general walkaround at a very, very cheap price compared to the 17-40, which is the only superwide zoom option from Canon. Sigma has other options...

Originally posted by soup:

Message edited by author 2003-10-04 15:02:54.

10/04/2003 02:56:54 PM · #8

the article i read made it seem as though they we testing the EF-S style out on the 300D - didnt know it was a one of a kind design
for that particular lense only...
it wasnt a very in depth piece of info
and i dont remember where i picked it up

soup

10/05/2003 04:02:14 AM · #9

Thanks for the replies..

I have picked out the following, with my questions next to them..

Sigma AF 70-300mm f4-5.6 DL Macro Super Lens for Canon <-- is the apature ok?

Sigma 2x EX APO Tele-Converter for Canon <-- can these be stacked if I ever wanted, for example, Camera->2x->2x->400mm ? or can it only be once?

Sigma EF-500 ST Flash Gun for EOS <-- its not much more for the super.. whats the advantage for the super over the ST ?

Sigma AF 170-500mm f5-6.3 Aspherical RF APO Lens for Canon <-- not sure if its what I want.
using a 2x converter, and using my "dumb" mentalizy of zoom x ... thats only 50x
how can I practically get more than that, going much bigger the lens will be too hard to handle, mirror lens are fized zoom, and stacking 2x is not only expensive, but putting it through a lot of unessesary glass (that is, if its possible).

I'm thinking I should just get the camera and tripod, then go for a few hours drive to a place that haves these lenses in stock and try them out.

Sound like the best way of tackling it?

10/05/2003 06:52:41 AM · #10

I've decided that I really do not understand enough about the lenses to go and buy any now.

I've ordered my camera.
in the meantime I'm going to read up on how these lenses work, and so on, so I got an idea of what I'm on about, and then go into a store and try them, before throwing my money at anyone.

Thanks..

10/05/2003 08:53:02 AM · #11

i think the lense that comes with it - will be a good start
and fun to mess around with...

as stated above - invest in the lenses - you'll have them longer than the camera itself.
so choose wisely - based onthe type of photos you take.

soup

lionelm

Canon EF 24-105mm f/4.0L IS

10/05/2003 09:46:35 AM · #12

Do not expect to stack 2x converters. Even one 2x converter degrade the quality already in a significant way. Quality wise, people recognize that one 1.4x converter is ok and do not degrade the quality too much if the lens you use with it is good.

Below 5.6 aperture your autofocus will not work. so if you start with a 5.6 and add a 1.4x teleconverter you will probably lose autofocus.

Something you need to know ... ;-) ...it would be too nice if you could get very long focal with quality and convenience at a low price ;-) .... the forever graal of all lens customer !!
300 is already a lot (450 with the crop factor) .. basically you do not handheld those except with good light so you reach at least 1/500s if you're good and 1/1000 and above if you drink too much cofee.

Check this thread for the sigma 70-300 dpreview and search in their forums.

I do not know the sigma flash. Is it E-TTL compatible ? This is the system used maily on the recent EOS camera. I personnally went for the canon 420EX and I am happy with it. I cannot explain you much about E-TTL andother flash exposure system, you would need to search on the internet.

Hope this help, search other threads here. Looks for 10D threads as well.

For the 300D ... do not question the basic kit , for 100$ it definitely a no brainer.
Do not rush your lens purchases.

Lionel
300D and 10D are both excellent choices.

Gordon

RIM BlackBerry Curve

Canon EF 85mm f/1.8 USM

10/05/2003 11:30:24 AM · #13

Originally posted by jimmythefish:

There's a 16-35mm f2.8 and a 20-35mm from canon too at the wide end. Although the 17-40 is probably the most affordable of the really wide angles.

jimmythefish

10/05/2003 12:48:11 PM · #14

Ah yes, the 16-35 has been erased from my conscience as it's simply too much money...but yes, there's that option too. Forgot about it...

10/19/2003 08:52:32 AM · #15

Camera's not here yet :'(

But I will be needing a lens about 2 days after the camera arrives as I'm going to the nats.

I will be wanting zooms of (equiv of 35mm) 40mm (or close to) or 200-400mm (with fast AF)

From all that I've seen, the included lens is perfect for the wide angle jobs.

but for the telephoto..
I was looking at the cheaper and EX sigma lens, but everyones told me EX sigma or L canon are the only good ones.
//www.sigmaphoto.com/html/pages/50_500_ex.htm That lens by sigma looks extremely nice for the price.. but actually, it looks too cheap compared to the rest...

has anyone had any experience with this lens?

Would I be better hiring a canon 100-300mm lens (a local shop will loan one out for $500 for the weekend, which 1/4 pays for the sigma), or is this lens ok? and I'm not going to regret it?

what concerns me is the lack of quality at either end of the focal length being such a huge zoom range....

ddmckinney1954

Canon EOS-300D Rebel

12/23/2003 08:09:26 PM · #16

I bought the 300D October 15th. I have bought a few lenses in addition to the one that came with the camera. I bought a Sigma 28-200mm af lens; and a Canon 70-300mm lens. The Sigma is an awesome lens. I had also bought the Tamron 28-200 but took it back because I liked the Sigma better. I do a fair amount of wildlife photography so the 70-300 will get a pretty good workout; however the 28-200 tends to be my basic all around lens. If I had it to do over, I would not bought the lens with the 300D.

TechnoShroom

Canon EF 100mm f/2.8 USM Macro

12/23/2003 09:59:41 PM · #17

Originally posted by cvt_:

but for the telephoto..
I was looking at the cheaper and EX sigma lens, but everyones told me EX sigma or L canon are the only good ones.
//www.sigmaphoto.com/html/pages/50_500_ex.htm That lens by sigma looks extremely nice for the price.. but actually, it looks too cheap compared to the rest...

has anyone had any experience with this lens?

Would I be better hiring a canon 100-300mm lens (a local shop will loan one out for $500 for the weekend, which 1/4 pays for the sigma), or is this lens ok? and I'm not going to regret it?

what concerns me is the lack of quality at either end of the focal length being such a huge zoom range....

The people over at Belgium Digital have a high opinion of the 50-500. Here is a direct link to their sample photos taken with a D60 and the 50-500 but you're probably better off going to the first link because the site is framed. I've never used it so I can't comment directly on the quality.

The $500 you mentioned for the 100-300 sounds really high. Weekend rental around here for a 300 or 400mm L prime would be ~$85. I wouldn't think that particular zoom should be much more. Of course I don't know your particular market but I would haggle with them to bring that down some if you do go the rental route.

Brent_Ward

Canon EOS-5D

Canon EF 85mm f/1.2L USM

12/23/2003 11:19:14 PM · #18

Get the Canon flash. You want to make sure the flash communicates correctly with your camera.

Sigma lenses are sharp. Especially the 70-200 2.8

I wouldn't put a tele-converter on anything with an aperture more than f4. and stacking usually requires an extension tube. Plus you'll lose focusing to infinity. NEVER stack two 2x, but you can squeeze decent images out of the 2x stacked with the 1.4x canons...

hortopth

Canon EOS-D60

12/23/2003 11:42:33 PM · #19

Not only is a Canon flash reccommended, but a Canon EX flash is what is required with digital (as opposed to those with the EZ after the number). For long term preservation of the sensor, these have been reccomended. A google search will reveal a better explanation than the one I would give.

As for the lens, don't pay so much for a rental. The sigma 70-200 EX IF HSF is a good investment for a high quality telephoto..

By the way, what currency are those $$$ in??

Canon EF 24-70mm f/2.8L USM

12/24/2003 02:50:01 AM · #20

This was some time ago.
I now own the following.

EOS300D
included lens with skylight and polariser
sigma 50-500mm (f4-5.6) + skylight
Canon 440EX Flash

I never hired the lens because I felt it was a ripoff.

currency is AU$

I am extremely happy with the zoom lens.
extremely sharp all the way from one end to the other on focal length, and also very nice at at maximum apature (5.6 at 500mm)

the autofocus is extremely accurate and fairly fast, out of about 250 photo's I took one weekend (all action shots, all on ai-servo) there was only 1 photo that was not perfectly crisp. the lens is really perfect for the 5 - 100 meter range.
I tried taking a shot about 400 meters away, but was soft.

I've got heaps of photo's taken with it, there mint when on a tripod.
I only have one in my portfolio atm.

the vignetting is only really obvious at the 450-500mm (I took a few test/comparison shots after that to check for it)

Message edited by author 2003-12-24 02:51:50.

garrywhite2

Canon EOS-7D

01/23/2004 07:11:13 PM · #21

Originally posted by Konador:

To get the amount of zoom, you take the mm, times it by 1.6 (crop factor on the 300D), then divide by 32.

eg

75mm-300mm lens = 300mm x 1.6 / 32mm = 15x zoom.

When talking to Canon tech's about the focal length conversion factor I've been given several explanations but I believe the last one was the more precise.

What was conveyed was that the conversion factor in no uncertain terms added to the optical zoom capability of the lens. I understand the conversion factor to be related to the size of the Imaging Sensor as compared to standard 35mm format. Another way of saying that if you took a picture on the digital camera at 18mm you would see the same image area that a standard 35mm film camera would take at 29mm. Not because of additional zoom, but because of the size of the image sensor.
My interpretation is that you still have an 18mm photo that's cropped to look as if it was taken at 29mm.

This explanation my be incorrect but from the overall tone of the conversation, I thought this person to know the most about the product.

01/23/2004 07:19:26 PM · #22

from what i have read that is correct

but the image coming from a negative would not be able to print nearly as large - the prints available with a 1.6x crop would seemingly simulate the extra zoom on paper

Message edited by author 2004-01-23 19:19:46.

terje

Apple iPhone

01/23/2004 07:54:20 PM · #23

I've got the 300D with a 17-40mm L4 lens and a 70-300mm Canon IS USM lens.. I'm very happy with the camera, but I miss the "wideangel"... :-)

pitsaman