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08/07/2006 06:45:55 PM · #26 |
Didn't read all the posts so sorry if this is a dupe.
First off, memory is really cheap these days. You can get 1gb's for $30. Just buy some. It won't go to waste.
Or, if you're tight on cash and if you've told her you're doing her wedding for free let her know you don't have enough memory. Tell/Ask her if she's willing to toss you some money so you can get some. Tell her you'll do the CD and pics for free but you'll need help getting the memory.
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08/07/2006 07:49:51 PM · #27 |
Lessee...
slow consumer glass
newly purchased underpowered (for weddings) flash
not enough memory
DON'T shoot the wedding!
I don't care what a bride to be tells you, since the day she met barbie she has been dreaming of her wedding day - and EVERY image she has seen, and there ahve been millions of them, have 98% been pro and 95% of them idealized set up magazine ads and similar ( for gowns, hair, recetions detials, etc). Anything you provide that falls short, and that will be 99/100 pics (sorry, but even the best wedding photog can't do much better than 80/100 cause we don't light and pose and have all day for one or two shots, or professional beauty support and a staff of dozens).
basically, she'll like the pics cause she's in them, but will most likely be disappointed overall.
I'm just suggesting you are not equipped to do a first class job.
I usually shoot 800 shots at a wedding/reception. All RAW.
My first wedding, for practice, I too was limited on memory - 2.5Gb and I shot all JPG to save space and still ran out of space.
Med JPG should work for all but the formals - the one's she'll want printed big. No one's gonna want the toast by uncle charley as an 8x10, but the formal of the bride, yes.
the biggest advantages of RAW at a wedding are to CYA for exposure issues (they do happen) and most importantly for white balance - canon's auto is good, but not perfect. there is no time to cust WB - perhaps for a room or two, but most churches are dark, many reception halls have a wall of windows so you get mixed light that changes as you move throughout the room. I've seen daylight, stainded glass, incandescent and something else (halogen? flourescent? sodium?) and then toss in my flash...ugly WB issues. Perhaps you or the bride don't care if the cake or dress is a different shade of white ffrom image to image, but they shouldn't be - and don't need to be.
A wedding is a one-time event, there are no do-overs, and the only thing the bride has around a week later is the new husband and the photographs.
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08/07/2006 07:57:34 PM · #28 |
I agree with the Prof...unless she wouldn't have pictures otherwise and you are doing it for more or less free. I have shot one wedding, a friend. They would not have been able to have a photographer otherwise. I explained very clearly that these shots are going to be nothing like a profession and I'll try my best, but what you get is what you get.
I had two bodies, one for B&W and one for color. I used a large foamcore board for a reflector. It was shot on a boat in close quarters. I pretty well documented the wedding in candid form and tried my best doing formal poses from what I'd seen at our wedding (photographer sucked, but what did I know back then) and in pictures. They were greatful, but I think, in part, because I had worked so hard to set their expectations low. ;)
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08/07/2006 08:05:47 PM · #29 |
Wow, way to lift a guy up. He asked about RAW vs. JPEG, not whether or not anyone else felt he was capable of shooting the wedding in the first place, or a critique of whether or not his equipment is good enough.
Drew, shoot the wedding for your coworker. If you wind up with even a few shots that are memorable and important to the bride, you've done a good thing. I am assuming (and you know how that can be) that this isn't a paid gig and that she's not expecting magazine-style images to begin with, so don't let the pressure get to you.
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08/07/2006 08:08:22 PM · #30 |
Sorry Prof_Fate, but entirely uncalled for.
Especially since, given the work from you I've seen, You're one of the last people to talk about Pro Magazine quality wedding shoots.
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08/07/2006 08:12:18 PM · #31 |
Originally posted by DrAchoo:
... in part, because I had worked so hard to set their expectations low. ;) |
edited for brevity.
Undersell and Overperform :)
I think the strategy of RAW for the important stuff and HQ jpgs for the others is good advice if you have limited memory. I have used 100% RAW for three weddings this summer and i found myself with a LOT of post processing computer work on my hands. That said, it sure was nice to have a safety net for the shots that needed a little "work" (even those unimportant ones of uncle charlie). Even shooting some RAW and some jpeg you will still likely need more memory. It sucks to try and delete on the fly just to make space for the last hour of the reception...
Try to get the extra memory if possible... Have fun!
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08/07/2006 08:12:56 PM · #32 |
Originally posted by Artyste:
Sorry Prof_Fate, but entirely uncalled for.
Especially since, given the work from you I've seen, You're one of the last people to talk about Pro Magazine quality wedding shoots. |
Can you say 'personal attack'? That's what I read, whether you meant it or not.
As to my opinion of your work....it is not as high as it once was.
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08/07/2006 08:16:03 PM · #33 |
Originally posted by laurielblack:
Wow, way to lift a guy up. He asked about RAW vs. JPEG, not whether or not anyone else felt he was capable of shooting the wedding in the first place, or a critique of whether or not his equipment is good enough.
Drew, shoot the wedding for your coworker. If you wind up with even a few shots that are memorable and important to the bride, you've done a good thing. I am assuming (and you know how that can be) that this isn't a paid gig and that she's not expecting magazine-style images to begin with, so don't let the pressure get to you. |
OK - Great photog there guy!
You can do better than bambi cantrell and all the rest. 1.5Gb? Hell, that 3 times what you need. Sure, JPG for all weddings, everone does it.
No sorry, I;m gonna call it like I see it. there is a reason pros doun tuse 1mp point and shoots for weddings and do use fast glass, big flash and carry backup equipment. Sorry i pointed it out.
you may now return to your regulaarly scheduled back slapping head in the sand rose colored glass world.
be happy, don't worry.
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08/07/2006 08:18:18 PM · #34 |
EXCUSE ME ?? you bashed the equipment of the OP and was rude while doing it... you get called out on the rug and you start screaming personal attack...UNCALLED for! both the rudeness towards the OP and the attack on Artyste...
Originally posted by Prof_Fate:
Originally posted by Artyste:
Sorry Prof_Fate, but entirely uncalled for.
Especially since, given the work from you I've seen, You're one of the last people to talk about Pro Magazine quality wedding shoots. |
Can you say 'personal attack'? That's what I read, whether you meant it or not.
As to my opinion of your work....it is not as high as it once was. |
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08/07/2006 08:20:52 PM · #35 |
Originally posted by Prof_Fate:
Originally posted by Artyste:
Sorry Prof_Fate, but entirely uncalled for.
Especially since, given the work from you I've seen, You're one of the last people to talk about Pro Magazine quality wedding shoots. |
Can you say 'personal attack'? That's what I read, whether you meant it or not.
As to my opinion of your work....it is not as high as it once was. |
I agree with Arty...and I dont think he's attacking, just stating the obvious.
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08/07/2006 08:26:37 PM · #36 |
Originally posted by Prof_Fate:
OK - Great photog there guy!
You can do better than bambi cantrell and all the rest. 1.5Gb? Hell, that 3 times what you need. Sure, JPG for all weddings, everone does it.
No sorry, I;m gonna call it like I see it. there is a reason pros doun tuse 1mp point and shoots for weddings and do use fast glass, big flash and carry backup equipment. Sorry i pointed it out.
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You don't have to be a jerk...I was trying to point out that you can at least support the man's efforts and not be so rude.
1.5Gb is enough (when shooting JPEG) in many cases. Maybe not in yours. Does that make it a bad thing?
Interesting that Gary Fong shot all of his weddings in JPEG and made a buck or three at it.
By the way...the OP doesn't have a 1MP camera, and did not state he was a pro. Why even say those things??
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08/07/2006 08:28:12 PM · #37 |
I suggest getting the additional memory cards--perhaps the bride will pay for it. Shoot in RAW only, you don't need to shoot RAW+JPEG because with the right tools, it's easy to convert RAW > JPEG en masse. And in the right tool, you can convert en masse while still covering white balance and other issues.
Download the free RSE (Raw Shooter Essentials) and it will let you quickly custom set the settings for all the RAW images, and then save them all to JPEG. Just set one of each lighting on a case by case basis, and then copy/paste the settings to all similar images.
RSE will also let you rank the images while viewing them in a slide show--then you can choose to only convert the ones that ranked 1 and 2 to cull the set.
Highly recommended software, even if it's "abandonware". You can also use Bibble.
PS can do similar things in it's browser mode, but not as easily!
Note also that all Canon RAW images have a low but usable resolution image (2-3 MP I think) JPEG embedded even if you just shoot in RAW mode. Some software like Breezebrowser can take a folder full of RAW and quickly extract all the embedded JPEGs to a subfolder, giving you a "free" RAW + JPEG without using the higher storage hungry form of it.
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08/07/2006 08:30:49 PM · #38 |
Originally posted by ButterflySis:
Didn't read all the posts so sorry if this is a dupe.
First off, memory is really cheap these days. You can get 1gb's for $30. Just buy some. It won't go to waste.
Or, if you're tight on cash and if you've told her you're doing her wedding for free let her know you don't have enough memory. Tell/Ask her if she's willing to toss you some money so you can get some. Tell her you'll do the CD and pics for free but you'll need help getting the memory. |
Agreed. |
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08/07/2006 08:32:06 PM · #39 |
If you are just doing this as a favor, shoot in .jpeg, you can work with it, they can work with it and everyone will be happy.
Evidently you must be doing something right if people keep referring you, maybe it's time to start charging? :)
Deannda
Then you can get all the extras you need |
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08/07/2006 08:33:09 PM · #40 |
Highly recommend extra cards, last wedding I shot the final take was over 2200 images and 16 gb of drive space. Most other wedding photogs I deal with personally end up that much or more (3500+ shots 20+ gb).
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08/07/2006 08:33:14 PM · #41 |
OK, Artyste, you are a great guy, but my eyes did goggle out of my head when I read that post.
I have seen lots and lots of photography forums where you may as well cut and paste the answer to "what do I need to shoot my friend's wedding" as "DON'T DO IT!". Prof was just supplying that pat answer. It's very reasonable and if his method was abrupt, his heart was, I'm sure, in the right place.
So let's get back to the question at hand. Frankly we are all talking a lot and the OP hasn't said anything yet, so maybe he's long gone. I'd like to know what the expectations are. I assumed they were low because all she was getting was pictures on a CD. That doesn't sound like "professional expectations" to me and does sound like "we don't have any money and I'm really glad my friend is willing to take some time to shoot it for me". Is this the case?
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08/07/2006 08:35:22 PM · #42 |
Originally posted by erschmitt:
Highly recommend extra cards, last wedding I shot the final take was over 2200 images and 16 gb of drive space. Most other wedding photogs I deal with personally end up that much or more (3500+ shots 20+ gb). |
Holy cow! You know that camera can be turned off burst mode right? How do you even organize 3000 pictures to separate the wheat from the chaff?
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08/07/2006 08:36:58 PM · #43 |
Originally posted by DrAchoo:
OK, Artyste, you are a great guy, but my eyes did goggle out of my head when I read that post.
I have seen lots and lots of photography forums where you may as well cut and paste the answer to "what do I need to shoot my friend's wedding" as "DON'T DO IT!". Prof was just supplying that pat answer. It's very reasonable and if his method was abrupt, his heart was, I'm sure, in the right place.
So let's get back to the question at hand. Frankly we are all talking a lot and the OP hasn't said anything yet, so maybe he's long gone. I'd like to know what the expectations are. I assumed they were low because all she was getting was pictures on a CD. That doesn't sound like "professional expectations" to me and does sound like "we don't have any money and I'm really glad my friend is willing to take some time to shoot it for me". Is this the case? |
From all sounds of it, it is indeed the case. Prof_Fate has a history of responding the way he did in many, many, many threads.. and I'm sorry if I snapped for a second, but quite frankly, it gets tiring.
Do I think his "heart is in the right place"? Not for one second.
He's an elitist that can rarely back it up, and I don't feel bad for one second for calling him on it.
If it gets me in trouble, so be it. But enough is enough.
Had he actually taken the time to read the thread, and realized exactly what the OP was talking about.. who knows.
I don't hold my breath though.
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08/07/2006 08:37:28 PM · #44 |
| What's the intinery? Wedding , reception, dinner? I shot for fun at a friends wedding many years ago and didn't have much memory I had time in between to go home and upload to my computer then moved on. |
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08/07/2006 08:39:36 PM · #45 |
Originally posted by DrAchoo:
Holy cow! You know that camera can be turned off burst mode right? How do you even organize 3000 pictures to separate the wheat from the chaff? |
Don't use burst mode when shooting weddings, that's just for sports. However I get a lot of great moments and my brides/grooms are very happy with my work. As you start shooting that much you get used to being able to quickly sort through the shots... just practice over time I guess.
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08/07/2006 08:39:40 PM · #46 |
| I think you should be fine with a 2gb card if you can spare it. That get you enough to fill a dvd-R. |
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08/07/2006 08:43:04 PM · #47 |
Originally posted by DrAchoo:
Originally posted by erschmitt:
Highly recommend extra cards, last wedding I shot the final take was over 2200 images and 16 gb of drive space. Most other wedding photogs I deal with personally end up that much or more (3500+ shots 20+ gb). |
Holy cow! You know that camera can be turned off burst mode right? How do you even organize 3000 pictures to separate the wheat from the chaff? |
I thought that too. I've not gone over 1000...i hope i don't! I started with 250 or so and seem to average 800, even at a shorter wedding/reception.
Workflow for 800 is not bad. (2 hours to get to proofs, and that includes culling, cropping, WB, exposure). DL to the computer is kinda in there and the RAW to JPG is not (automated...)
I keep wondering my so many...and rarely do i use drive mode.
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08/07/2006 08:46:16 PM · #48 |
Originally posted by DrAchoo:
Originally posted by erschmitt:
Highly recommend extra cards, last wedding I shot the final take was over 2200 images and 16 gb of drive space. Most other wedding photogs I deal with personally end up that much or more (3500+ shots 20+ gb). |
Holy cow! You know that camera can be turned off burst mode right? How do you even organize 3000 pictures to separate the wheat from the chaff? |
That's actually pretty common with most of the wedding photogs I work with. They get several thousand shots, then cull out the bad ones. Kinda like the guys who shoot film for National Geo and shoot 100+ rolls for 10 shots in a feature. |
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08/07/2006 08:47:13 PM · #49 |
Originally posted by blemt:
Originally posted by DrAchoo:
Originally posted by erschmitt:
Highly recommend extra cards, last wedding I shot the final take was over 2200 images and 16 gb of drive space. Most other wedding photogs I deal with personally end up that much or more (3500+ shots 20+ gb). |
Holy cow! You know that camera can be turned off burst mode right? How do you even organize 3000 pictures to separate the wheat from the chaff? |
That's actually pretty common with most of the wedding photogs I work with. They get several thousand shots, then cull out the bad ones. Kinda like the guys who shoot film for National Geo and shoot 100+ rolls for 10 shots in a feature. |
Spray and Pray. |
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08/07/2006 08:50:11 PM · #50 |
I was mostly kidding with my comment. I don't shoot weddings (see above) and so I have nothing to say about it. Still, 3000 shots at 3 seconds a shot is 2.5 hours of doing nothing but looking at a picture for 3 seconds and going to the next one. I'm not saying it's wrong, but I'd have to up my medication to do that on a regular basis...
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