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DPChallenge Forums >> Web Site Suggestions >> We really really really need more than 25M
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 03/11/2006 04:16:49 PM · #1
I really don't want to go through and delete my portfolio pictures so all I can really do is keep posting pictures from my own website.

Unfortunately, those pictures generally don't get comments and really don't feel like they are "part of" the DPC family.

Come on ... disk space is dirt cheap these days!

03/11/2006 04:23:11 PM · #2
I think 25mb is reasonable... at 150kb per image you can fit 166 images in the portfolio. And a lot of images are less than 150kb.

It looks like there's over 2600 members, that's over 60GB of space that could potentially be used, and has to be free on the server. And I don't think that includes challenge photos.
 03/11/2006 04:24:58 PM · #3
Originally posted by MadMan2k:
I think 25mb is reasonable... at 150kb per image you can fit 166 images in the portfolio. And a lot of images are less than 150kb.

It looks like there's over 2600 members, that's over 60GB of space that could potentially be used, and has to be free on the server. And I don't think that includes challenge photos.


Wow... 60GB? I bought a 300G drive for a $180 last year. I wonder, with 2600 members, if they could afford it?
03/11/2006 04:29:38 PM · #4
Another fotog site I frequent gives 10mb for free then $10 for another 10mb (one time fee) I'd be happy to pay an additional $10 to continue adding to my portfolio if I reach the current (generous) 25mb limit.
 03/11/2006 04:29:58 PM · #5
The point is... if you've been here long enough, you will have uploaded a good number of pictures (challenges or otherwise).

Many of those images are linked to DPC threads. Those threads become unusable when you start deleting the images that were part of them. And there goes the value of the DPC threads.

03/11/2006 04:31:53 PM · #6
Originally posted by dwterry:
Wow... 60GB? I bought a 300G drive for a $180 last year. I wonder, with 2600 members, if they could afford it?


This doesn't include 800-1000 shots/week from challenges... Also, they are using server quality hard drives and probably have everything at least duplicated in case of crashes...
 03/11/2006 04:34:51 PM · #7
Originally posted by TooCool:
Originally posted by dwterry:
Wow... 60GB? I bought a 300G drive for a $180 last year. I wonder, with 2600 members, if they could afford it?


This doesn't include 800-1000 shots/week from challenges... Also, they are using server quality hard drives and probably have everything at least duplicated in case of crashes...


Even if 300G were to cost $1000 it's still not too expensive when spread across the membership pool.

And I'm not against Ecce's idea of paying extra for extra storage...
 03/11/2006 04:40:01 PM · #8
I'm positive that they do not have the server(s) in one of their homes.

It/they are most likely in a hosting company's data center, and I don't think it's as simple as buying a new hard drive for it and having someone put it in.

Ever look at the cost for dedicated servers on a pipe big enough to serve hundreds of users at once, for a photography site? Ever look at the cost of upgrading them?
 03/11/2006 05:01:46 PM · #9
Originally posted by MadMan2k:
I'm positive that they do not have the server(s) in one of their homes.

It/they are most likely in a hosting company's data center, and I don't think it's as simple as buying a new hard drive for it and having someone put it in.

Ever look at the cost for dedicated servers on a pipe big enough to serve hundreds of users at once, for a photography site? Ever look at the cost of upgrading them?


Yup, I've worked at a data center for 10 years (I'm a computer programmer by trade) and so, yes, I realize it's a bit more complicated than I made it sound in my reply to you. But my reply was rather tongue-in-cheek as well. I figured you would relate to 300G storage more easily than to server storage. And the point remained the same. Today's cost of hard disk storage is dirt cheap, even in giant server farms.

But just to make a comparison:

I have an account at smugmug.com ... paying $99/year. I currently have over 26G of pictures uploaded to that site. That's one THOUSAND times as much storage at only 4 times the annual cost. (actually, smugmug says "unlimited storage" but so far I have used 26G of that "unlimited" amount)

And AGAIN: I'm not against paying extra for extra storage.

Message edited by author 2006-03-11 17:02:53.
 03/11/2006 05:28:13 PM · #10
Regarding server storage...

IBM (synonymous with expensive) has a 300G hot-swappable SCSI drive running at 10,000 RPM for $919.

If you buy THREE of these, and put them into a RAID 5 array, the cost of the drives (minus the cost of the array, which I would assume would already exist) would be $2757.

Amortize $2757 across 2600 members and you'll see it costs a little over $1 per member to put 300G of high performance storage online.

Again, the point is... storage, today, is dirt cheap.

Even still... I'm willing to pay extra for the storage. An extra $10/year is certainly affordable and at that rate, you'd only need about 260 members to sign up for the extra storage in order to afford the aforementioned 300G. Then you could give each of those 260 members a 1G limit!

03/11/2006 05:39:18 PM · #11
Point taken.

Then the only problem is getting people to actually look at all those portfolio images of yours ;p
 03/11/2006 05:40:31 PM · #12
In addition to, or even instead of increasing the space allotted, here is an idea: Allow us to link images to our portfolio from another site and all DPC has to do is catalog them in the database and create a thumbnail for them and display the full image (from the external source) in the normal image page and allow comments to be associated with them.
 03/11/2006 06:01:24 PM · #13
If we end up going to 800 pixels from the current 64 pixels imagine what that will do to the storage ceiling. If we go with the larger size, we will need more storage, IMHO.
 03/11/2006 06:05:03 PM · #14
Originally posted by Art Roflmao:
In addition to, or even instead of increasing the space allotted, here is an idea: Allow us to link images to our portfolio from another site and all DPC has to do is catalog them in the database and create a thumbnail for them and display the full image (from the external source) in the normal image page and allow comments to be associated with them.


I like that idea ... except for one little problem. It would make it easy for the user to change the image out from under the site. Then the comments left won't necessarily pertain to the image being commented on.

But otherwise, the idea does accomplish what I was hoping for - and that is the ability to post more images that feel like they "belong" to the DPC family. (right now I can't upload any more images, so the only images I can post have to come from the outside)
03/11/2006 06:06:58 PM · #15
Originally posted by dwterry:
I like that idea ... except for one little problem. It would make it easy for the user to change the image out from under the site. Then the comments left won't necessarily pertain to the image being commented on.

You can do that now on DPC stored images. Except for Challenge entries, which I would exclude from this anyway obviously.
 03/11/2006 06:15:29 PM · #16
Originally posted by MadMan2k:
And I don't think that includes challenge photos.


I think it does include challenge photos since they are added to your portfolio (unviewable by others) during the challenge.

25 MB is kind of a low value for paid user storage. Especially since you are limited on file sizes to upload.

How about charge a buck (or 2) per GB per user? Still make money off it and there is tons of space. If a user wants to upload a 50 MB file, let them; I just won't view it. I bet i'd keep them about <250kb, except for the hidden files for DCPrints.

-Rick
 03/11/2006 06:21:23 PM · #17
Originally posted by CarpeNoctem:

How about charge a buck (or 2) per GB per user? Still make money off it and there is tons of space. If a user wants to upload a 50 MB file, let them; I just won't view it. I bet i'd keep them about <250kb, except for the hidden files for DCPrints.

-Rick


Something like that would be perfect. Let those who want more, pay for it. I think I have about 10 pics in my portfolio. The expence should not be passed on to everyone.
 03/11/2006 07:05:42 PM · #18
If you research some of the other "300 or so" threads on this topic, you'll probably find a remark from the admins that it's one of the things "on the list" but not yet implimented. So far, repeated requests have not accelerated the addition of this feature.

There are issues beyond hooking up more/bigger drives, like a complicated billing system needed to treat each member individually, instead of the current two categories of payment ($5/month or $25/year), as well as parceling out storage space in uneven chunks.

I don't know what fraction of your $25 membership fee is apportioned to portfolio storage, but I don't think it's 100%. I think your price comparisons to dedicated storage sites is a somewhat false analogy.

Also, it costs more to maintain backups if there's more data ...

Message edited by author 2006-03-11 19:07:05.
 03/11/2006 08:26:06 PM · #19
Originally posted by GeneralE:
I don't know what fraction of your $25 membership fee is apportioned to portfolio storage, but I don't think it's 100%. I think your price comparisons to dedicated storage sites is a somewhat false analogy.


I'm not sure what you mean by that... Does smugmug fall into that category?

I'm guessing that you mean that a site like DPC would cost more to "manage" than a "dedicated storage site", but I'm having trouble imagining why... I mean, if the members of the site council were paid, then I could see it. Both otherwise, it seems like it's mostly a matter of maintaining the site.

I understand about the cost of backups going up as the storage requirements go up... of course, smugmug is maintaining backups of my 26 gigs worth of pictures as well so that cost must be factored in their pricing somewhere.

Message edited by author 2006-03-11 20:26:51.
 03/11/2006 09:56:22 PM · #20
Originally posted by Art Roflmao:
In addition to, or even instead of increasing the space allotted, here is an idea: Allow us to link images to our portfolio from another site and all DPC has to do is catalog them in the database and create a thumbnail for them and display the full image (from the external source) in the normal image page and allow comments to be associated with them.

I like that idea! :D

David
 03/11/2006 10:06:38 PM · #21
Originally posted by GeneralE misquote because I read quickly:
So far, repeated requests has accelerated the addition of features.

DPCPRINTS2!!
 03/11/2006 10:15:42 PM · #22
i've been thinking about bandwidth issue, the main "point" for hosting accounts ... the storage is minor problem, the bandwidth can be "sucky" :-)
 03/11/2006 10:28:59 PM · #23
Originally posted by dwterry:
Originally posted by GeneralE:
I don't know what fraction of your $25 membership fee is apportioned to portfolio storage, but I don't think it's 100%. I think your price comparisons to dedicated storage sites is a somewhat false analogy.


I'm not sure what you mean by that... Does smugmug fall into that category?

I mean that most of what you're paying for is the rest of the maintenance and management of the site -- the challenges, the bandwidth, the forums, the DQs ... this is an educational community which uses themed contests as its lesson plan; it's not primarily an image hosting site.

That said, I don't think there's any disagreement over whether increased storage, with or without incremental purchasing, is a good idea. I'm simply reporting that the admins are aware of this desire on the part of the membership, largely agree too, and have yet to impliment it.

While there's considerable support for the tactics of the "squeaky wheel," I'm aware that there exists in some circles a countervailing philosophy, perhaps best summarized as "you nag, we lag," which might recommend a more moderate approach.
 03/11/2006 10:30:48 PM · #24
Over at pbase i get 300Mb for $25/year. There are things i like about it,but those pics are 'outside' the DPC family.
If i could thumbnail those into threads that'd be nice.
 03/11/2006 10:39:05 PM · #25
Originally posted by Prof_Fate:
Over at pbase i get 300Mb for $25/year. There are things i like about it,but those pics are 'outside' the DPC family.
If i could thumbnail those into threads that'd be nice.

I post from pBase all the time -- they make it really easy by generating the thumbnail for you.

Do it like this -- use square brackets where I have curly braces and you'll be set.

In the DPC forum Post Reply dialog, use the Insert Link button. For the link use:

//pbase.com/username/image/photonumber (get all this from the URL of the pBase page for the photo)

For the "text field" put:

{img}//pbase.com/username/image/photonumber/small.jpg{/img}

You can also put text in the link, outside of the IMG tags. Make sure you append the "/small.jpg" to the image URL so that you post the thumbnail only. Here's an example:

Isaac's Orange Fungus
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