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DPChallenge Forums >> Photography Discussion >> Paradox in photogaphy
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01/30/2006 08:48:04 PM · #1
If you know one, post it here! It can be about digital, or standard or both. Here are my two:

1. While the signals from every photocells in a RAW file contain only information about ONE color, and the converter needs information from the surrounding cells to complete the values and make an image, A JPEG file from wich every pixels contain the data from both RGB colors is known to contain much less infromation.

2. There are algorithm out there powerfull enough to take ONE BLUE, ONE RED and TWO GREEN information and make four RGB pixels very accurately, but there are none powerfull enough to take 4 complete pixels (with all RGB values) and correctly interpolate the one in between in order to upscale an image without losing quality.

...?

01/30/2006 10:24:45 PM · #2
not paradox but physics :
1) remember your computer is not showing you a single RGB pixel in a jpg
your color monitor is combining the RGB ito a dot(s) to represent the color you are looking at

2) you can't invent information
(which is what the guess of the pixel in the center would be)
you can always try the thought experiment where you can get that pixel from invented information - then get the pixel between the invented one & the real one, then the pixel between two invented ones ..
is the data real at that point ? only about ~1/8 of the image has real data ... & suddenly you are part of an episode of CSI...

oh and to stay on topic (incase the thought police delete my post) :P

if the average DPC'er rates a image 5.3'ish, why do the average DPCer still feel bad when our images are highly scored ? (above average)



01/31/2006 09:52:29 AM · #3
Originally posted by nicklevy:

If you know one, post it here! It can be about digital, or standard or both. Here are my two:

1. While the signals from every photocells in a RAW file contain only information about ONE color, and the converter needs information from the surrounding cells to complete the values and make an image, A JPEG file from wich every pixels contain the data from both RGB colors is known to contain much less infromation.


JPEG files don't contain every pixel. They contain an approximation of the contents of those pixels. This is why a JPEG file is smaller and also why when you compress them too much, you can see problems.

Originally posted by nicklevy:


2. There are algorithm out there powerfull enough to take ONE BLUE, ONE RED and TWO GREEN information and make four RGB pixels very accurately, but there are none powerfull enough to take 4 complete pixels (with all RGB values) and correctly interpolate the one in between in order to upscale an image without losing quality.


Again, not actually true. Look at the edges of tree branches against a sky for example. The purple fringing you see is due to the bayer pattern conversion to RGB pixel values. The purple comes from the increased amount of green photo sites on the sensor, (magenta being the comp colour of green)

The bayer demosaicing has a lot of problems and certainly doesn't give an accurate one to one relationship with an RGB sensor. It just happens to be good enough - though you aren't creating something from nothing.

As for upsampling - you can't create information from nothing - you can just approximate it. That's one of the fundamental laws of physics, not a paradox. cf. with entropy or read anything by Shannon.
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