Negative use of Redneck stereotype in forums

01/13/2006 05:03:34 AM · #1

This thread is to redirect the meta-discussion from Madman2k's thread so we can keep that one on topic.

Originally posted by ClubJuggle:

Hey guys,

This is a great discussion, in the interest of keeping it on the real core issue here, I've adjusted the subject line and edited/removed a couple posts that made negative use of the "redneck" stereotype.

Yeah, I know all about Jeff Foxworthy, and I love his material. That said, some users have commented that they are bothered by the fact that we allow users to make broad negative stereotypes of rednecks that we would not allow to be made of other identifiable groups/ethnicities/religions/nationalities, etc. I don't believe it was anyone's intention to be offensive, but if you substitute, for example, 'blacks,' 'Jews," or 'Mexicans' into the subject line posts that were removed, I suspect you'll see where the users that were concerned were coming from.

Let's do our best to keep this thread on topic, so If anyone has any questions about why this was locked, please feel free to PM me directly or to ask those questions in a new thread.

Once again, this is a great topic and a great discussion. Please ignore me cleaning up here in the corner and carry on. ;-)

~Terry

01/13/2006 05:04:17 AM · #2

Originally posted by ubique:

It's hard for someone not from USA to properly understand this issue I guess. I had no idea, Terry, that rednecks were a categorical group in the same sense as Jewish, black and Mexican people. Presumably rednecks have their own churches, music and cultural festivals? Is there a 'redneck pride' movement? Do they proudly acknowledge their 'redneckedness"? Probably they now take the politically correct option and insist on referring to themselves as 'Redneck-Americans'?

01/13/2006 05:05:23 AM · #3

Originally posted by mycelium:

I see where you're coming from, but if, on the one hand, you replace "Redneck" in your post with another derogatory name (e.g., "spic," "wop") then perhaps you'll understand. On the other hand, if you replace "Redneck" with "Southern," then the answer to all your question is "Yes."

-- note: this is not meant to suggest that there is an equation between "redneck" and "southern"; just that those identified by others derogatorily as "rednecks" would probably self-identify as "southern."

01/13/2006 05:06:14 AM · #4

Originally posted by ubique:

Originally posted by mycelium:

Originally posted by ubique:
It's hard for someone not from USA to properly understand this issue I guess. I had no idea, Terry, that rednecks were a categorical group in the same sense as Jewish, black and Mexican people. Presumably rednecks have their own churches, music and cultural festivals? Is there a 'redneck pride' movement? Do they proudly acknowledge their 'redneckedness"? Probably they now take the politically correct option and insist on referring to themselves as 'Redneck-Americans'?

I see where you're coming from, but if, on the one hand, you replace "Redneck" in your post with another derogatory name (e.g., "spic," "wop") then perhaps you'll understand. On the other hand, if you replace "Redneck" with "Southern," then the answer to all your question is "Yes."

-- note: this is not meant to suggest that there is an equation between "redneck" and "southern"; just that those identified by others derogatorily as "rednecks" would probably self-identify as "southern."

Ah! Thanks. I see. I had not realised that 'redneck' was a specifically racist epithet like 'spic', 'wop' and so forth. Which race is the 'redneck' race?

01/13/2006 05:07:04 AM · #5

Originally posted by ShutterPug:

it's not actually a race - it's kind of a certain way of living. When folks hear redneck - they suually think southern (though there are northern rednecks too) who are less intelligent, sitting around on the porch drinking beer, with a yard full of broken down cars, parked in front of the run down home/trailer, spitting chewing tobacco......I could go on and on but you probably get the picture now.

01/13/2006 05:07:49 AM · #6

Originally posted by mycelium:

Originally posted by ubique:
Ah! Thanks. I see. I had not realised that 'redneck' was a specifically racist epithet like 'spic', 'wop' and so forth. Which race is the 'redneck' race?

Given the obvious sensitivity of this issue, I'll try not to step on any toes here-

ok, I think this is the easiest way to do it-

//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Redneck

a bit of Googling will probably fill in any blanks you might be curious about.

01/13/2006 05:12:05 AM · #7

I want a type of stereo that plays the old stuff like Cash and Jones 8~}
and yes, I am a redneck and proud of it..

Mattel Barbie Photo Designer Digital Camera

01/13/2006 05:12:25 AM · #8

Originally posted by ubique:

Originally posted by ShutterPug:
it's not actually a race - it's kind of a certain way of living. When folks hear redneck - they suually think southern (though there are northern rednecks too) who are less intelligent, sitting around on the porch drinking beer, with a yard full of broken down cars, parked in front of the run down home/trailer, spitting chewing tobacco......I could go on and on but you probably get the picture now.

Good Lord! In that case, we have rednecks in Australia, too. I might even be 'bout a quarter redneck myself (beer, I'm afraid).

nsbca7

01/13/2006 05:15:36 AM · #9

I hunt hogs with dogs on occasion. I drive a pick-up truck. Every now and again I ride dirt roads at night drinking beer. I live in south Alabama. But to me the word Redneck, leaving Foxworthy's broadened definitions out of it, has always meant ignorant.

Canon EF 24-105mm f/4.0L IS

01/13/2006 05:21:03 AM · #10

Originally posted by nsbca7:

then I am ignorant and proud of it...8~B but to me is just livin' a simple life... if everyone would just get over be offended by every little thing in life ..imagine how much better and fun life would be..

ShutterPug

Canon EOS-6D

01/13/2006 05:23:00 AM · #11

personally - I like rednecks

nsbca7

Mattel Barbie Photo Designer Digital Camera

01/13/2006 05:28:24 AM · #12

Originally posted by jsas:

Originally posted by nsbca7:
I hunt hogs with dogs on occasion. I drive a pick-up truck. Every now and again I ride dirt roads at night drinking beer. I live in south Alabama. But to me the word Redneck, leaving Foxworthy's broadened definitions out of it, has always meant ignorant.

then I am ignorant and proud of it...8~B but to me is just livin' a simple life... if everyone would just get over be offended by every little thing in life ..imagine how much better and fun life would be..

I'm not calling you ignorant, but if you called someone a redneck back in the day before Foxworthy made a living off the word, you were more then likely looking for a fight. Jeff has sorta made the word cute and cuddly and expanded it to anyone who drives a pick-up or lives in a mobile home.

Message edited by author 2006-01-13 05:28:54.

ubique

Olympus PEN-F

Olympus 17mm f/1.8 M.Zuiko

01/13/2006 05:28:36 AM · #13

Originally posted by jsas:

then I am ignorant and proud of it...

Sorry Jeff - but I've read your poetry. I'm afraid you definitely do not qualify as ignorant.

01/13/2006 05:30:31 AM · #14

Originally posted by ubique:

Originally posted by jsas:
then I am ignorant and proud of it...

Sorry Jeff - but I've read your poetry. I'm afraid you definitely do not qualify as ignorant.

LOL thanks I try.8~}

Nikon AF Nikkor 50mm f/1.4D

01/13/2006 05:34:44 AM · #15

Originally posted by nsbca7:

Originally posted by jsas:

Originally posted by nsbca7:
I hunt hogs with dogs on occasion. I drive a pick-up truck. Every now and again I ride dirt roads at night drinking beer. I live in south Alabama. But to me the word Redneck, leaving Foxworthy's broadened definitions out of it, has always meant ignorant.

then I am ignorant and proud of it...8~B but to me is just livin' a simple life... if everyone would just get over be offended by every little thing in life ..imagine how much better and fun life would be..

I'm not calling you ignorant, but if you called someone a redneck back in the day before Foxworthy made a living off the word, you were more then likely looking for a fight. Jeff has sorta made the word cute and cuddly and expanded it to anyone who drives a pick-up or lives in a mobile home.

Oh I know I am just playing around. He totally has changed the preception of a redneck, I mean look at Larry the Cable Guy he is huge because of it. LOL

taterbug

Nikon D300

01/13/2006 05:55:34 AM · #16

Since Jeff Foxworthy and the Blue Collar Comedy Tour, I think a lot of folks might consider it rather cool and 'with it' to be a 'redneck'. Pretty trendy these days :-)

Canon EOS-60D

Canon EF-S 55-250mm f/4-5.6 IS

01/13/2006 06:43:01 AM · #17

Originally posted by taterbug:

Since Jeff Foxworthy and the Blue Collar Comedy Tour, I think a lot of folks might consider it rather cool and 'with it' to be a 'redneck'. Pretty trendy these days :-)

In the beautiful and immortal words of Barbara Mandrell..."I was country when country wasn't cool." ;)

bacchus

Nikon D70s

Nikon AF Zoom-Nikkor 70-300mm f/4.0-5.6G

01/13/2006 06:52:40 AM · #18

Indeed, one does not have to go much farther than 'Larry the Cable Guy' to find grotesque stereotyping and the misrepresentation of class beneath the yoke "redneck". Of course, one can say that Larry the Cable Guy is parodying that. I suppose so.

I've always thought of the term more as a class-bash than of anything else. Typically, poor, rural, southern, etc... All the other stuff ("stupid" "ignorant" etc) is the stereotypical baggage that comes with such an association. Of course, "smart" here doesn't take into account rural literacies, such as farming, hunting, cooking, etc. Just because one isn't "formally educated" doesn't mean one is either stupid or ignorant.

Anyhow, I've always thought of it as a class attack more than anything else.

In Florida, the old term for "poor white trash" is the "Florida Cracker". Same drill: rural, typically poor, not heavily educated in the system, etc... But the assumption that country folk, the old southern working class, is either stupid or ignorant is, itself, quite stupid and ignorant.

These reversals in meaning are interesting. We've seen the rancid n-word, "nigger," stripped from it's strictly hateful context by many in urban, African American contexts. The meaning has been twisted and reversed ~ thus, the power of the insult by the would-be haters has been dimininished. But, for many, it depends on who says it, who uses it, and in what context.

I think "redneck" has undergone a similiar transition, though white people have never been as disenfranchised in the United States as African Americans ~ therefore, the political reversal of the term (to me) really isn't as big of a deal as of the term "nigger".

But still ~ it all comes down to who says it, what context it's said, and how it's interpreted. Kind of like the word "liberal" (a word that seems to be becoming a perjorative label in recent years, with many thanks to certain right-wing driven media outlets).

I'll admit it right here: I am a cracker. And... I am... a liberal.

With a slice of redneck and a dash of nigger.

Mostly though, I like saying that I'm "human".

~ bacchus, with respect and thanks for your tolerance.