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09/01/2005 11:41:51 AM · #26 |
Part of the problem is that whether you make $10,000 or $100,000 or $1 million or $10 million...
MOST OF US live a bit beyond our means or pretty much at our means. So the amount of immediately free income we have is sometimes very low.
For instance, I may make three times what someone else on DPC makes. So one may say "I live on $1,000/month you live on $3,000/month....you should be able to easily donate a $1,000 to the crisis."
However, what that doesn't take into account is that said individual (a) might pay $700/month in rent where as I am paying $2,400/month in mortgage, insurance and other fees in order to provide two rental units at $700/month in addition to mine.
So my free money may be slightly more but not much than individual (a).
Correspondingly, someone may make a $1 million/year. But they bought a nice large house and between mortgage, taxes, upkeep, etc. they pay $60,000/month. Sure, it might be wrong for them to have a mansion. But then again a lot of that tax money pays for the local school system's budget. Meanwhile, they might have $20,000/month in their budget for day to day expenses. Quite a bit to us...but probably for their lifestyle it's standard. But say they do feel charitable so they in fact skip going out for a couple of week and they donate $5,000 or $10,000. Seemingly, not a lot to us because we think...what is $10,000 when you make $1,000,000.
Well, for their lifestyle it's equivalent to someone who makes $50,000 donating $500. Or someone who makes a mere $10,000 donating a $100.
Not saying anything with regards to right or wrong. Just trying to break it down and give an understanding why some who make proportionately more than us may not be able to immediately donating hundreds of thousands.
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09/01/2005 11:45:22 AM · #27 |
Another little fact to consider is that most people that have that kind of money don't just have it sitting around in the living room or stuffed into a mattress. It's probably tied up in various investments.
Not to mention that a person that earns a million dollars doesn't get a million dollars. Uncle Sam usually takes the biggest share to pay the saleries of all those politicians and to fund countless other welfare programs and other boondoggles.
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09/01/2005 11:45:28 AM · #28 |
| theSaj....Excellent post..Thanks for putting things into perspective.. |
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09/01/2005 11:51:30 AM · #29 |
| Because it would be silly to budget charitable givings as part of your lifestyle... |
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09/01/2005 11:53:16 AM · #30 |
Originally posted by ldowse:
Originally posted by RonB:
You are economically confused. The NFL has no business telling it's players how to spend their money ( other than fines levied by the league , of course ). Their payroll is not money that belongs to the NFL, so the NFL has no right to spend it. The million dollars that is being contributed to the Red Cross is money that the NFL does exercise control over, and is far, far smaller than the sum of all player salaries. From that money, a million dollars is significant. |
No you're missing the point.... I'm not saying the NFL should contribute the money, nor am I saying they should tell the players how to spend their money... Please read the entire post.... I'm talking INDIVIDUAL effort (implies effort made by the INDIVIDUAL). I was just using the payroll of the NFL as an example of how much these INDIVIDUALS are making.
I think thatcloudthere there provides a very accurate illustration of my point. |
If I "missed your point" it's because you didn't make a clear one. In a single paragraph, you directly connected the NFL payroll to the $1 million donation of the NFL organization itself. To wit:
Originally posted by ldowse:
"For example according to last year's NFL payroll, 21 players were paid in excess of $10M. Peyton Manning... $35,037,700!!!! (source USA Today). Now for an organization that has this kind of payroll, does "in excess of $1M" seem like a lot? I don't think so." |
Message edited by author 2005-09-01 11:53:55. |
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09/01/2005 12:02:07 PM · #31 |
Originally posted by RonB:
If I "missed your point" it's because you didn't make a clear one. In a single paragraph, you directly connected the NFL payroll to the $1 million donation of the NFL organization itself... |
Perhaps you're right... I wasn't very clear. I hope my previous post helps clear up my argument.
theSaj does bring up an interesting point and a very real one. HOWEVER, what about the HUGE shopping sprees these individuals go on? Do you think they would be willing to give up purchasing a few designer clothes and jewelry for a few months in order to be able to give more? I honestly do not have the answer to that question, but my gut instinct is NO, they won't.
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09/01/2005 12:06:20 PM · #32 |
I have a question. How many of us actually set aside a portion of our payroll to giving? I do, and I also give to other things above and beyound that when I have the extra income. If the "rich" are like most of us, they probably do set aside a portion of their income and then go over that if they have the extra amount available.
Why would we want to discuss something we have no control over and no first hand knowledge of? Are any of us the accountant for any of these "greedy rich" people? I don't understand the point of taking sides in an argument when the main players are not present to state their side of the story. It's sort of like gossiping and serves the same purpose. |
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09/01/2005 12:09:33 PM · #33 |
Originally posted by pcody:
...Why would we want to discuss something we have no control over and no first hand knowledge of? Are any of us the accountant for any of these "greedy rich" people? I don't understand the point of taking sides in an argument when the main players are not present to state their side of the story. It's sort of like gossiping and serves the same purpose.
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See original post.
Originally posted by ldowse:
... I would encourage anyone who may have some connection to put out a call to these people. I'm not talking about a fundraiser where Hollywood collectively raises a few million dollars or the NFL contributes enough to rebuild the superdome, I'm talking about INDIVIDUAL effort from EVERY major sport star, corporate mogul, movie star, etc etc etc. The money is THERE people... Our rich and fortunate just need to come off of it and stop being so friggin greedy. I realize this borders on a rant, and I refuse to go down that road. Just look at this as a call to arms. If there are any of you who can pull even the smallest string to get this message out, you never know... It may be enough to start a ball rolling... Send messages to the NFL, NBA, NHL, PGA, Paramount, Disney MGM, the list goes on and on.
Now is a time for our nation to pull together. |
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09/01/2005 12:11:03 PM · #34 |
Originally posted by thatcloudthere:
Because it would be silly to budget charitable givings as part of your lifestyle... |
If it would, then just call my family silly. We, and many of our friends, have always budgeted 10% of gross income for charitable giving. But that's just what we budget. We always seem to end up giving much more than that, as unanticipated needs, like those in the areas just devastated by Katrina, become known. It's one of the foundations of our lifestyle. |
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09/01/2005 12:13:38 PM · #35 |
Originally posted by RonB:
If it would, then just call my family silly. We, and many of our friends, have always budgeted 10% of gross income for charitable giving. But that's just what we budget. We always seem to end up giving much more than that, as unanticipated needs, like those in the areas just devastated by Katrina, become known. It's one of the foundations of our lifestyle. |
Good for you!!! !!!!
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09/01/2005 12:17:10 PM · #36 |
[quote=ldowse] Why is it when there is a national catastrophe, it seems that the people who can afford to give the most, proportionately give the LEAST???
The events that have happened in the Gulf Coast of the United States has given me a chance to reflect on this. Why are there people in our nation that make bazillions of dollars that give so very little to the nation that has helped them rich and famous?
We as a nation are VERY prosperous, but it sickens me that the people who have millions and millions of dollars give so very little... If EVERY major athlete and movie star gave 1-2 million dollars of TAX DEDUCTIBLE money, imagine the relief funds that would be available. I unfortunately have no way of really getting this message out, but I would encourage anyone who may have some connection to put out a call to these people. I'm not talking about a fundraiser where Hollywood collectively raises a few million dollars or the NFL contributes enough to rebuild the superdome, I'm talking about INDIVIDUAL effort from EVERY major sport star, corporate mogul, movie star, etc etc etc. The money is THERE people... Our rich and fortunate just need to come off of it and stop being so friggin greedy. I realize this borders on a rant, and I refuse to go down that road. Just look at this as a call to arms. If there are any of you who can pull even the smallest string to get this message out, you never know... It may be enough to start a ball rolling... Send messages to the NFL, NBA, NHL, PGA, Paramount, Disney MGM, the list goes on and on.
Now is a time for our nation to pull together. [/quote
Your whole post states that you know "for a fact" that these individuals do not give in situations like this. So. How do you know? |
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09/01/2005 12:21:45 PM · #37 |
Originally posted by ldowse:
Originally posted by mk:
Do we have any ridiculously wealthy individuals on DPC? Hook me up! |
Not to my knowledge... that's why I thought we could talk about this without getting off onto a rant.... Guess I was wrong. ;-) |
Think for a moment..Most of us have a roof over our heads,fresh food,good water...To anyone stranded on a roof for 3 days with nothing',it would appear that,yes,we are ridiculously wealthy..So here's a different open challenge to DPCr's: My wife and I don't have any expendable cash,but we do have a nice home with a spare bedroom...Our hearts were wrenched yesterday when a CNN reporter showed a young mother and child walking on the Interstate,because they had nothing and nowhere to go...Here's the challenge:..if any of you have the resources to get a bus ticket to ANYONE in that area with a similar situation,we will provide a loving home for them here in the Greenville,SC area for as long as they need it.. |
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09/01/2005 12:24:43 PM · #38 |
Just read this article on what our nations sport figures are doing to help out...
Katrina Relief
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09/01/2005 12:43:50 PM · #39 |
Originally posted by pcody:
Your whole post states that you know "for a fact" that these individuals do not give in situations like this. So. How do you know? |
Geesh people! Please stop taking things out of context.
Originally posted by ldowse:
....
theSaj does bring up an interesting point and a very real one. HOWEVER, what about the HUGE shopping sprees these individuals go on? Do you think they would be willing to give up purchasing a few designer clothes and jewelry for a few months in order to be able to give more? I honestly do not have the answer to that question, but my gut instinct is NO, they won't. |
Message edited by author 2005-09-01 12:45:19.
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09/01/2005 12:49:30 PM · #40 |
I understand the point ldowse was making, I fear his "tone" in the initial post kinda set people on the defensive.
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09/01/2005 12:53:29 PM · #41 |
Originally posted by elderell:
Originally posted by ldowse:
Originally posted by mk:
Do we have any ridiculously wealthy individuals on DPC? Hook me up! |
Not to my knowledge... that's why I thought we could talk about this without getting off onto a rant.... Guess I was wrong. ;-) |
Think for a moment..Most of us have a roof over our heads,fresh food,good water...To anyone stranded on a roof for 3 days with nothing',it would appear that,yes,we are ridiculously wealthy..So here's a different open challenge to DPCr's: My wife and I don't have any expendable cash,but we do have a nice home with a spare bedroom...Our hearts were wrenched yesterday when a CNN reporter showed a young mother and child walking on the Interstate,because they had nothing and nowhere to go...Here's the challenge:..if any of you have the resources to get a bus ticket to ANYONE in that area with a similar situation,we will provide a loving home for them here in the Greenville,SC area for as long as they need it.. |
Excellent offer Gary.
My wife and I, even though we live in the Orlando area, started working with our local church to provide shelters in private homes for victims of the hurricane - especially families, so they don't have to be separated. The problem is not in finding homes ( we've found several already ) but in making the connections with those in need and finding a way to transport them from the impacted areas to Orlando. Right now, it's nearly impossible to get transportation into / out of most of those areas.
I've noticed several postings here at DPC, in addition to yours, of folks offering to make their homes available, but it's a logistical problem right now to get those willing to help connected to those needing help. The only thing we can do right now is donate money to the relief agencies and hope that the logistical issues get resolved soon. These folks need more than a blanket, a cot, an MRE, and a bottle of water.
I would urge anyone within a day's drive of the Gulf Coast to consider, if they can, housing an individual or even a family who have no place to go back to, or can't go back for a great while. May I suggest contacting one of your local churches, synagogues, temples, mosques, or whatever. Ask around and you will find that some are already actively pursuing ways to get involved. It will change their lives, and yours. |
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09/01/2005 12:56:26 PM · #42 |
Originally posted by Jaimeson:
Just read this article on what our nations sport figures are doing to help out...
Katrina Relief |
Fundraisers, fundraisers, fundraisers.... Granted... a VERY good start.
Individual monetary contributions:
Originally posted by USA Today:
Houston Texans owner Bob McNair will contribute up to $1 million to the disaster relief to match all contributions from the Houston community.
...Golden State Warriors guard Baron Davis, who played for the New Orleans Hornets for three years, donated $50,000 to the Red Cross. |
Only two were listed IMHO, there are more that could follow that example.
It's one thing to help raise money (I applaud them for doing that)... It's entirely another to GIVE. I just personally feel that they could GIVE more...
Besides, that was not even the point of this thread. The point was to see if anyone could help prompt them to GIVE more.
Why did this have to derail into a political rant?!?
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09/01/2005 12:57:41 PM · #43 |
Originally posted by karmat:
I understand the point ldowse was making, I fear his "tone" in the initial post kinda set people on the defensive. |
Thank you for pointing that out... Admittedly I was teetering on the verge of a rant in the initial post... I also stated that I didn't want to go down that path.
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09/01/2005 12:58:58 PM · #44 |
Originally posted by ldowse:
Besides, that was not even the point of this thread. The point was to see if anyone could help prompt them to GIVE more.
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Perhaps a more specific proposed course of action would be helpful. |
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09/01/2005 01:02:09 PM · #45 |
Originally posted by mk:
Originally posted by ldowse:
Besides, that was not even the point of this thread. The point was to see if anyone could help prompt them to GIVE more.
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Perhaps a more specific proposed course of action would be helpful. |
(last sentence of original post)
Originally posted by ldowse:
Send messages to the NFL, NBA, NHL, PGA, Paramount, Disney MGM, the list goes on and on.
Now is a time for our nation to pull together.
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Kinda got buried in the political turmoil! ;-)
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09/01/2005 01:03:49 PM · #46 |
Originally posted by ldowse:
Originally posted by Jaimeson:
Just read this article on what our nations sport figures are doing to help out...
Katrina Relief |
Fundraisers, fundraisers, fundraisers.... Granted... a VERY good start.
Individual monetary contributions:
Originally posted by USA Today:
Houston Texans owner Bob McNair will contribute up to $1 million to the disaster relief to match all contributions from the Houston community.
...Golden State Warriors guard Baron Davis, who played for the New Orleans Hornets for three years, donated $50,000 to the Red Cross. |
Only two were listed IMHO, there are more that could follow that example.
It's one thing to help raise money (I applaud them for doing that)... It's entirely another to GIVE. I just personally feel that they could GIVE more...
Besides, that was not even the point of this thread. The point was to see if anyone could help prompt them to GIVE more.
Why did this have to derail into a political rant?!? |
It's hard for conversations like this to NOT become political. But it is a valiant effort to try to get people who are in a better financial state to help those less fortunate. I know that I plan on going to the store and buying as much as I can to donate to the NC Food Bank here.
If we all do what we can, within our own means, it will add up.
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09/01/2005 01:05:10 PM · #47 |
| I saw that but I'm not sure I'd consider that specific. If you really want to encourage people to do something, you need to help them along. What are you doing? Post examples of the letters you're sending and the addresses you're sending them to. Suggesting vaguely that people should send letters to a bunch of big corporations and demand that the individuals donate money doesn't strike me as a very effective course of action. |
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09/01/2005 01:07:21 PM · #48 |
What was the point? Shouldn't we encourage everyone to help? Why only the rich? Wouldn't we have more success if we contacted our own circle of influence? HOW does he know that they don't give? He must know something because it sickens him that they don't give.
Sorry. I'm not usually this determined on subjects like this, but the way he expressed himself sorta makes me want to stick to it.
And before I go to work, here's two things to ponder. I think they can be found in the bible. The first says that before you try to get the moat out of someone else's eye you should take care to get the log out of your own eye. The second says before you throw the first stone, make sure you are without sin. Well, here's another one, give as the spirit moves YOU. All of them speak to me of controling your own destiny and not of trying to control what other people do. We each will be rewarded at the end for our own actions. |
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09/01/2005 01:09:38 PM · #49 |
Originally posted by mk:
I saw that but I'm not sure I'd consider that specific. If you really want to encourage people to do something, you need to help them along. What are you doing? Post examples of the letters you're sending and the addresses you're sending them to. Suggesting vaguely that people should send letters to a bunch of big corporations and demand that the individuals donate money doesn't strike me as a very effective course of action. |
Actually I'm not too sure HOW to go about doing it... that was the original intent of this post. :-(
I was checking websites for contact information before I got bogged down in this forum post. :-(
Anyone have any suggestions?
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09/01/2005 01:11:28 PM · #50 |
Originally posted by pcody:
What was the point? Shouldn't we encourage everyone to help? Why only the rich? Wouldn't we have more success if we contacted our own circle of influence? HOW does he know that they don't give? He must know something because it sickens him that they don't give.
Sorry. I'm not usually this determined on subjects like this, but the way he expressed himself sorta makes me want to stick to it.
And before I go to work, here's two things to ponder. I think they can be found in the bible. The first says that before you try to get the moat out of someone else's eye you should take care to get the log out of your own eye. The second says before you throw the first stone, make sure you are without sin. Well, here's another one, give as the spirit moves YOU. All of them speak to me of controling your own destiny and not of trying to control what other people do. We each will be rewarded at the end for our own actions. |
Actually I plan on giving all I can.... I also felt "moved" to help motivate others to give. Where's the harm in that?
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