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08/29/2005 02:39:29 AM · #1 |
| I am working on a study to precisely determine what qualities differentiate a casual snapshot versus a professional photograph. I think most people, even non-photographers, can easily tell the difference between the pictures on Flickr versus the best photos here. Ultimately, I want to quantify these qualities and come up with a metric to rate a photograph. Ideally, the metric should be simple, clear, and precise, for example could easily be followed by someone who has not studied photography. Even if the ratings are subjective and individual preferences may vary, it should still be possible to come up with a unified score, as is done for example on these challenges. If you have any thoughts on this, please post. |
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08/29/2005 02:53:22 AM · #2 |
I'm sure there is a good deal of gray area here, but one of the biggest things that says "snapshot" in my mind when viewing a photo would be on camera flash. I mean other then it being a Polaroid.
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08/29/2005 03:47:14 AM · #3 |
For Me it is when I get the feeling that the the photographer has thought about they want to show the image, and have taken steps to achieve this result
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08/29/2005 03:52:25 AM · #4 |
Originally posted by nsbca7:
I'm sure there is a good deal of gray area here, but one of the biggest things that says "snapshot" in my mind when viewing a photo would be on camera flash. I mean other then it being a Polaroid. |
Hey, a LOT of professional photographers have worked with polaroids, including me :-) Ansel was PAID by them to do fine art work with their materials and help with feedback in development of their emulsions. He did some FINE work in polaroid...
For whatever that's worth, which ain't much.
Robt.
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08/29/2005 03:57:13 AM · #5 |
composition, lighting, leading lines, negative space, good use of either color or B&W etc.
There is no such thing as a metric system for pro vs. snap. Most snaps you can just tell are snaps. but there are good snappers out there who, with the right material, get very high class photos. just like there are those who have great gear but no idea. it's easy to take a snapshot with a Canon 1Ds Mk II but not as easy to take a photograph with a single use USD 10 cardboard box. I've seen both and many things in between a lot.
Try old photography books, from times when not EVERYONE was able to take pictures of EVERYTHING and you're likely to stumble upon elements that make a classically defined good photo - give it a try.
Just my two cents.
Bruno |
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08/29/2005 04:00:17 AM · #6 |
Originally posted by yanke:
I am working on a study to precisely determine what qualities differentiate a casual snapshot versus a professional photograph. I think most people, even non-photographers, can easily tell the difference between the pictures on Flickr versus the best photos here. Ultimately, I want to quantify these qualities and come up with a metric to rate a photograph. Ideally, the metric should be simple, clear, and precise, for example could easily be followed by someone who has not studied photography. Even if the ratings are subjective and individual preferences may vary, it should still be possible to come up with a unified score, as is done for example on these challenges. If you have any thoughts on this, please post. |
It would help if you could define just what you mean by "professional". For most of us, "professional photography" is roughly synonymous with "commercial photography" and "photojournalism", I think, certainly if you consider wedding photographers and portrait photographers as being commercial, which I do. But there's a whole world of stunning imagery out there that is not done for any particular market, call it "art". Is that "professional"?
What I'm getting at is, it seems like you're using "professional" as an adjective to describe "accomplished work"?
In terms of how people react to images, it seems to me that clarity and precision are the keys to mass appeal, for the most part. Skillful use of DOF, accuracy of focusing, sharpness of delineation, all make a picture look "good" to most people I think. Throw in good color saturation (or good tonal range in B/W) and strong composition, and that probably covers the technical details of what makes an image stand out for most people.
Certainly, this seems to be true in DPC, as far as voting goes.
Robt.
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08/29/2005 04:08:58 AM · #7 |
Originally posted by bear_music:
Hey, a LOT of professional photographers have worked with polaroids, including me :-) Ansel was PAID by them to do fine art work with their materials and help with feedback in development of their emulsions. He did some FINE work in polaroid...
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I know. I did a bit of experimenting with it myself back in the day. But you know what I mean I think.
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08/29/2005 04:24:43 AM · #8 |
I probably do, yeah... :-)
R.
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08/30/2005 06:01:11 PM · #9 |
| A snapshot for me is to generally preserve a memory- family, friends, places we visit. A professional photograph is trying to sell something- a feeling, a product, or an idea. It wants to communicate with more people than those who are directly related to the snapshot. More thought goes into a professional photo. There are great ranges of quality within both categories and the line is often blury. I include "art" pictures with professional in this case, but they could easily be given their own class- a picture for the picture's sake. For some people professional means "good enough to be in a magazine." |
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08/30/2005 06:02:32 PM · #10 |
professional pictures are better pictures ;)
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08/30/2005 06:09:03 PM · #11 |
| the difference between a snapshot and a pro shot is the photographer. |
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08/30/2005 06:15:08 PM · #12 |
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08/30/2005 06:17:07 PM · #13 |
I would also separate artistry and professionalism. The latter mostly associates with technical skills and good learning, steady hand, guaranteed performance under any conditions. A good artistic photo does not necessarily have to be technically perfect, but it has the magic that has you coming back to view the photo again and again and again.
A snapshot has neither. |
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08/30/2005 06:17:59 PM · #14 |
pre-imaging. Snapshots are rarely planned more than 5 minutes ahead of time. "Professional" and "Art" are usually planned in advance, sometimes way in advance. There are images on both sides that cross over but, I think that has something to do with it.
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08/30/2005 06:20:31 PM · #15 |
To me the difference is that a snapshot is just a quick shot taken of something we want to remember. Candids at a party, Christmas morning, quick shots at a concert, etc. Professional photos are thought out artistically, the composition, framing, angle, view, etc. all matter so that ultimately someone may be proud to hang it on their wall.
Message edited by author 2005-08-30 18:24:06.
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08/30/2005 06:26:47 PM · #16 |
| It's like pornography: I can't define it for you, but I know it when I see it. |
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08/30/2005 06:44:18 PM · #17 |
I think you're falling into a trap here - the hope that you might be able to invent a rubric that defines 'art'. Many many people have tried, and all have failed - as will you, I'm afraid.
How would you differentiate this from a snapshot?
... but it's one of the greatest photographs I've seen
E
Message edited by author 2005-08-30 18:44:46. |
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08/30/2005 07:19:28 PM · #18 |
Originally posted by e301:
How would you differentiate this from a snapshot?
... but it's one of the greatest photographs I've seen
E |
attention to background ;) |
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09/21/2005 12:25:43 AM · #19 |
Hello here my first post,
The difference is that any person with a camera that may have been lucky enough to capture someting far greater than is primal perseptions could perceive.(Foud on the web).
I LOVE vintage snapshots or vernacular photographs. I am not a prof.photographer, just a snapatomaniac. I do not want to spam this forum with my website, but your comment are welcome if you are a photographer or...a prof.photographer.
Thanks all,
Frankie.
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09/21/2005 02:16:39 AM · #20 |
just my humble opinion:
example of a snapshot is when you have a photo of you and your buddies having a good time, a photo that brings back memories, ie. a candid of your friend pissing his pants after a long night clubbing.
example of a pro shot is when you see a photo that is technically so amazing but you tend to forget about it hours later because you dont really relate too much to it, ie. a photo of a flower or insect |
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09/21/2005 03:53:40 AM · #21 |
I think the defining aspect of an artistic or professional photo is that the subject is well isolated from its surroundings. A snapshot usually does not have an implied subject except for those who have a relationship with a subject matter. The purpose of a snapshot is to put a piece of a scene onto paper to remind the viewer of the rest of the scene.
Take this, a very early photo of mine, for example:
There is no sense of this being the entire scene nor is there any focus to direct the attention of the viewer to some integral part. A leg intrudes into the scene from the right, a bottle is being handed to someone outside the frame, and the guy on the left is looking to something way out of the frame in the other direction, leaving the viewer to wonder what's going on outside the frame. This picture is obviously a snapshot of a larger scene which draws the focus away from the picture itself and thus cannot stand on its own without prior knowledge or an expository caption.
(I'm not saying this is a bad picture (in fact, now that I've found it again, it brings back memories of my first night in Budapest when all I and my fellow expatriots had to eat was wine and cheese and it's quickly becoming one of my favorites), it just doesn't suffice as an art object.)
Here's an example of a photo I took much later (1,700 pictures later):
Here, the focus is completely on the two subjects with nothing to distract the viewer. The couple is not centered so attention isn't drawn to the frame of the picture, the background fades to black so the eye is drawn back to the subjects, and all else is snow, which provides setting to the main action. In a professional or artistic shot, all elements which distract from or fail to add to the picture are removed. (I've heard some people say that a black background is a major part of the "DPC Style". Indeed, a dark or monotone (i.e. boring) background is the easiest way to focus attention on the subject. A narrow DOF also achieves this effect.)
For an example from a real artist, here's Andre Kertesz's Broken Bench:
Here we have three subjects that are isolated by composition. The man in the foreground ostensibly looks at the broken bench; however, the top slat on the bench points directly to a couple in the background, implying that the man is actually contemplating the couple. Is he lonely? Jealous? The three subjects all interact with each other to create this dramatic tension and keep your focus within the frame. The upper right portion of the picture serves to indicate the setting and is paid little notice. Professional and artistic photographers tell the eye where to look.
Actually, I think isolation is the defining feature of any art, whatever the medium.
Of course, I'm just repeating what Gordon said, but in a long-winded and complicated way. |
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09/21/2005 09:02:44 AM · #22 |
Originally posted by yanke:
I am working on a study to precisely determine what qualities differentiate a casual snapshot versus a professional photograph. I think most people, even non-photographers, can easily tell the difference between the pictures on Flickr versus the best photos here. Ultimately, I want to quantify these qualities and come up with a metric to rate a photograph. Ideally, the metric should be simple, clear, and precise, for example could easily be followed by someone who has not studied photography. Even if the ratings are subjective and individual preferences may vary, it should still be possible to come up with a unified score, as is done for example on these challenges. If you have any thoughts on this, please post. |
When you get done with that, could you please work on telling us which came first between the chicken and the egg.
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09/21/2005 09:03:53 AM · #23 |
Originally posted by yanke:
I am working on a study to precisely determine what qualities differentiate a casual snapshot versus a professional photograph. I think most people, even non-photographers, can easily tell the difference between the pictures on Flickr versus the best photos here. Ultimately, I want to quantify these qualities and come up with a metric to rate a photograph. Ideally, the metric should be simple, clear, and precise, for example could easily be followed by someone who has not studied photography. Even if the ratings are subjective and individual preferences may vary, it should still be possible to come up with a unified score, as is done for example on these challenges. If you have any thoughts on this, please post. |
If you haven't seen this already, this article may interest you. (Reader beware - it's a very long article.)
Linda |
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09/21/2005 09:30:47 AM · #24 |
Funny thing, the "Broken Bench" above in IMHO is really a bad shot. I would have never given the shot above a 4. The man's head and feet are cut off and even part of the bench. I see no real artistic talent from the shot., kind of snappie to me. So, it shows you, that some pro-artists take snappies in the eyes of people. So snappies are just a way of calling someone's shot a rank amature, or like a four year olds. Its a put down. Just my thoughts.
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09/21/2005 10:52:56 AM · #25 |
| IMO, someone taking a 'snapshot' is only concerned with their subject, with no attention paid to the background or all the elements in the periphery and how they relate to each other. An accomplished photographer considers everything that will end up in the frame. |
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