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DPChallenge Forums >> Hardware and Software >> Sharpest Lens Forum Challenge
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 05/11/2005 01:33:32 PM · #76
I believe it is next to impossible to quantify sharpness results in the way presented in this post. (In fact, I believe its rather a stretch to try and quantify them at all.) Using RAW only is a nice idea, but there are too many different cameras that all work a little differnt to make anything more than a blanket comparison.

I use the Sigma SD9 in addition to the 300D, so using examples from my raw files whould show us what? That the SD9 produces darn sharp full-sized images compared to the 300D beacuse there is no AA filter?

And if that wasn't bad enough, each lens differs a bit from one another due to sample to sample variation, so the only thing you can hope to glean from such data is a "tendency" for one lens to be sharper than another.

Just my two cents. Still watching this thread to see if it gets anywhere.

05/11/2005 01:47:06 PM · #77
I think my S602 does a good job for a non-DSLR
(thanks to the 'Super EBC Fujinon' lens).


(no adjustments, straight from camera)

----------------------------------------------


Here is a 100% crop from same image.
(no editing other than crop)
 05/11/2005 01:54:54 PM · #78
I guess I should explain again "why" I started this thread. Just like Michael says, there are a lot of differences in sensors, so comparing sensor data across cameras is not a scientific comparison of lenses.

Likewise, there are many ways to sharpen, and cameras apply different algorthms with different degrees of success.

Similarly, programs and people apply sharpening differently, and to different degrees. There's USM, edge sharpen, sharpening actions, and now Adobe "smart sharpen".

My own goal was to see what other people started with for given lenses before they added their own sharpening. How sharp should I expect my 70-200/F4L to be, out of the box? Is mine as sharp as others? I certainly realize not everyone "starts" with RAW. But I do, many others do, and hey, it was my thread, so I can ask for whatever I want. No one has to comply, but I had hoped some would. Then I could compare their results with my own lenses (which I have done), and hopefully those that chose to participate would be able to as well.

There were no prizes offered, nor was I planning to pick a winner. My enforcement of the rules was to keep this thread focused (and people with "soft" RAW images not feeling they have to "compete" with "mines better than yours" images captured in JPEG. It is obviously starting to get unfocused as several posts seemed to try to turn it into a JPEG versus RAW discussion. I don't mind discussing these things, they are interesting themselves, but that wasn't the purpose here.

I hope that explains my simple motivation and rationale. I don't expect everyone to benefit from the thread (it's just a thread started by a user after all). But I have, and hopefully some others have as well.
05/11/2005 02:03:06 PM · #79
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Message edited by author 2005-05-11 15:23:24.
 05/11/2005 02:09:50 PM · #80
Originally posted by ovenbird:
If you really want to know about your 70-200 f/4 maybe you could ask for people to take some shots with theirs using some particular settings.


Neil, I see your point, and I admit I was a little fuzzy (no pun intended) on exactly what the goal was. I think I have a pretty good idea now, and this idea of Toms seems like the best way to get really useful comparisons.

-Michael
 05/11/2005 02:14:16 PM · #81
Tom,

My feelings were'nt hurt by the arguments, but I was getting frustrated by the need to defend starting a thread. A thread is no more than a public discussion. It can be on any topic.

I did appear to hurt your feelings, and I'm sorry for that. I started this thread as a place to post RAWs, per the spec, and I didn't see that I was required to comment on whatever people post (I still don't). You posted what you wanted to carry on the debate about JPEG versus RAW, and that's not something I was interested in debating here.

This thread is no different than one which says "Post you bird photos here". I simply asked for RAW 100% crops. Perhaps I should have titled it that way.

I am not trying to keep an argument going; this too is off topic here; I am mainly responding to your posts, again, so as not to ignore you, which before, you took offense to (and again, my apologies for that).

Edit: (Actually, I didn't ignore your posts; I looked at your shots, but simply didn't respond, at least so as not to argue the JPEG/RAW issue).

Edit2: And thanks for the offer on the 70-200. That was an example; I can already use this thread to compare the 50mm/F1.8, and I'm still hoping to see some more lenses here. The Tamon 28-75(which I don't have) looks pretty impressive, so that's something I'll keep in mind. These are just ways I planned to, and am using this thread.

Message edited by author 2005-05-11 14:19:48.
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