OK, I don't know if anybody has "officially" stepped in to take over the critique posts jmsetzler was doing or not. If they have, and I'm stepping on toes, let me know and I'll politely back away. If they haven't... well, here goes...
Talk about your likes, dislikes, technical flaws -- but try to be specific -- "I don't care for this because..." or "The grain in this photo really works for me because..." Let's try to turn this into (keep this) an educational process for everybody and hope it bleeds over into the comments/critiques on the challenges.
Title: Carding Flywheel
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09/11/2002 05:39:09 PM · #2 |
overall, i really like this shot. i feel it's a good use of b&w, it goes well with machinery, and there's a nice range of tones in the photo. i enjoy that i have a focal point to look at, but lots of things leading off it (e.g., the chain, the other smaller wheels at the top). not knowing what else was surrounding this, there are two slight crop changes that i could imagine would make me like the image even more: a little less at the bottom (it's a tad dark, and not very interesting), maybe crop to just under the lower metal 'foot'. i'd also see a little more at the top. get those two levers (if that's what they are) all the way in, especially the one that's only clipped at the top, and possibly the wheel all the way to the right, too. that way, the 3rd wheel from the left would be a little more visible and not just barely in the photo, but still cropped.
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09/11/2002 05:39:40 PM · #3 |
Great image. I really like the geometric appeal of this image. the reapeating circles make it very interesting. Perfect choice for toning in my opinion. Great tonal range. Nicely composed. Can't say that i see any flaws or anything i would do differently. I do think you could get some other interesting cropping out of this. I think a square crop would look nice. I love this kind of subject matter.
I like the darkness at the bottom it balances out well with the lighter area at the top of the frame. I just did a square cropping of it with the main wheel exactly in the center and wow it seemed to have much more impact. i do like this version though i think it works very well.
* This message has been edited by the author on 9/11/2002 5:41:45 PM. |
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09/11/2002 06:02:47 PM · #4 |
Photos like this only provoke one emotion from me, envy.
This is about as close to perfect as I can imagine. Interesting subject, great exposure and focus, and the tone really adds to the aura of the image. There maybe variation that could be done, but.... 10.
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09/11/2002 06:14:57 PM · #5 |
| Exactly what Zeissman said. A wonderful shot where composition and tone truly match the material. |
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09/11/2002 06:19:52 PM · #6 |
IMHO, this is such a warm picture it's just so obviously wonderful that noone could say anything negative about it :oP
* This message has been edited by the author on 9/12/2002 1:37:31 AM. |
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09/11/2002 06:24:37 PM · #7 |
The Good:
Great swirling lines, good circles. I like the even lighting, how the swirly lines are bright on the front but dark on the sides to give depth. The tonal range is beautiful. I love shots of metal objects such as this one.
The Bad:
The only minor problem I have is that the circles at the top are cropped. I really would have liked to have seen full circles. If someone disagrees with me here I would really like to hear why.
Overall: still a great image. I would rate this an 8 or 9.
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09/11/2002 06:29:25 PM · #8 |
As you already know, I love 'cold' and this image works well in my current interest of "Form and Function". The detail is excellent in every way. I get lost in this image, but the spokes on the flywheel set the rest of the image in motion. The tonal range in this photo is exceptional... the details are not washed out in the highlights and the darker areas carry enough detail as well. The 1906 date underneath the wheel tells me that this is old machinery. The sepia toning just accents that beautifully. I would expect to see a photo like this on the cover of some industrial engineering magazine... I would also expect to see a dirty operator in denim overalls somewhere close by.
I also just noticed the wooden floor underneath this machine... This is an old factory of some sort... I really want to see that dirty guy in overalls :)
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09/11/2002 06:41:49 PM · #9 |
I like the repeating patterns a lot, and the tone range/coloring. It looks old, but not immobile or static.
For comparison with a less-perfect but similarly-conceived photo you can check out this recent "vacation photo".
* This message has been edited by the author on 9/11/2002 6:42:33 PM. |
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09/11/2002 07:05:13 PM · #10 |
Actually, this give me two other feelings, on whimsical, like a Harold Lloyd movie, and none more sinsister, and industrial - welcome to the machine.
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09/11/2002 07:08:27 PM · #11 |
| Beautiful image; toning is exquisite. Nothing "cold" about it; full of life. My problem with it is the cropping: show me more or show me less. And I would probably opt for less even though you loose the interesting repeating shapes then. Right now the partially shown repeating shapes at the top are a little distracting. |
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09/12/2002 04:59:03 PM · #12 |
OK, here's my (lengthy) critique of the photo -- and I intend to be extremely nitpicky, so if you don't like to read that kind of thing, skip over it. *grin*
The background at the top is a little bit blown out. There's something (carding brush?) behind the wheel on the upper right that looks to have lost some of the detail as have all the things crisscrossing in the background (that's partially due to depth of field as well). In fact, the upper right edge of the machine looks a little soft along the edge where something seems to be missing as well. Looks like some light bled around the edge and softened it.
The foreground at the bottom is a little too dark. It looks like there is some interesting detail down there, but it's getting lost. The equivalent of a split density filter (either in front of the lens, or a PS equivalent) might be useful to bring out some of that detail without losing the information at the top. Or, perhaps leaving that area dark and just dodging out the belt wheels and the things holding them to the floor to offer a bit of visual interest down there.
I think it's cropped just a little too tightly on the sides -- but that may depend on what you find to either side. If there's no other machinery, then it's too tight. If there is other machinery, then it's tough to crop this wider without including them and introducing other visual elements. The cropping at the top and bottom is OK, but might be worth playing with. Perhaps a little tighter at the top to introduce the same margin across the top as along the sides. This would also move the wheel a little closer to being in the upper third. Cropping higher would mean a trade off of more light tones (like we get glimpses of in the background) for less dark tones (as we see at the bottom of the shot). Can't say if that would be good or bad.
Others have mentioned the smaller flywheels. I think including them completely would create unwanted additional focal points that would detract attention from the main flywheel. However, I can't see a way to crop them out completely and leave the main flywheel itself whole. I can see how others might find them distracting, but they don't bother me. I can see how they carry on the theme of the main wheel and their partial inclusion leads me to wonder if there aren't other similar elements completely outside the frame of the picture. So, in my opinion they serve an additional purpose without being too intrusive.
OK, now for the positives. I love the duo/sepia tone. The warmth is entirely appropriate for a picture of a machine used for carding wool. The center flywheel makes me think of a stylized sun and the rays have a glow to them that complement that nicely (more warmth metaphors). I love that the text on the machine is visible, but unobtrusive so that I might be able to do some research and find out more about the machine and what it's supposed to do (I'm a sucker for old things). I enjoy the repetition throughout the piece, from the spokes of the flywheel to the pieces of the chain to the smaller flywheels to the "square" pieces bolted (?) around the outside of the main component. My eye is immediately drawn to the center of the wheel and then it travels out, along a spoke, to some other piece of interest, before being drawn back to the center and starting another visual trip. I think the way the two wheels (main flywheel and the one with the chain behind it) juxtapose their spokes adds to the feeling of this being a stylized sun. perfectly focused (earlier comment about depth of field aside). A couple of quick random thoughts -- it travels from light to dark and from more complex to less complex as you move from the top of the picture to the bottom. Don't know that those mean anything, or that I like/dislike them, just some thoughts.
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09/12/2002 08:09:50 PM · #13 |
| Thanks Patella. So, who made the image and when? |
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09/13/2002 05:51:34 AM · #14 |
A wonderful shot that is very reminiscent of Setz' own steam engine one. I can find no flaws technically. Without a context it's perhaps lacking meaning but as a form study it's close to perfect for me.
John |
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09/13/2002 06:05:25 AM · #15 |
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09/13/2002 01:39:24 PM · #16 |
The photo was taken at the Baron Woolen Mill in Brigham City, Utah, by me earlier this year (February-ish). It was shot on 35mm Ilford Delta Pro 400 B&W film using my Pentax camera. (I can never remember the model off the top of my head -- if you want to know, e-mail me.)
The Mill is a VERY popular photography site. Try doing a web search and you'll prolly find at least three or four photographers with images from the Mill on their site. At the state fair last night, I counted at least 4 photos that had been entered in various categories all from the Mill. This particular photo is FAR from unique, as much as I might wish otherwise.
Well, y'all have my earlier critique. Here are the photographer's takes on some of your (and my) comments:
First, I agree that the bottom is currently a tad dark and uninteresting. The "finished" photo was one I was in a "hurry" to get done so that I could send it to ezprints.com for some test prints. I don't however, want to crop that dark area out, just add some contrast -- probably by lightening up the floor and dodging in some points of interest on the belt wheels and the machinery holding them to the floor. I like the balance the relatively simple lower portion adds to the barrage of detail on top.
The cropped mini-flywheels at the top... After trying some different compositions before I actually made the shot, I realized that there really wasn't any way to crop them all completely out, and yet I didn't want them competing for attention with the main flywheel by including them completely. In my mind, whether it works for others or not, the way that they balance between being in the shot and out of the shot is a bridge that carries the thematic elements of the main flywheel (shown in the shot) to the world outside the bounds the photograph shows (ie the other machinery you can't see, but you assume is there). Cropping them out of the shot isolates the main flywheel. Including them in their entirety may add to the shot, but I feel it separates the machine from its context. (Wow... Any of that making sense -- whether or not you agree? *grin*)
For those interested in comparison, the straight, undoctored scan of the negative can be found here. (It's not entirely a prefectly straight scan -- I did do some minor cropping, I resampled/resized to get it to the size it now is, and I used PS's automatic levels.)
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09/13/2002 03:23:34 PM · #17 |
Excellent shot Patella.
I have to disagree with everyone that the bottom of the photo is too dark. It still holds quite a bit of detail. I was playing with it in Photoshop. I dogged the bottom a bit. I dont think it helped. the darkness at the bottom weighs it down which i think is appropriate. it anchors the machnery down giving it the heavy feel. It also leads your eye to the main flywheel which I assume you want to be the center of focus. Keep in mind I think the shot is great as is, but if the darkness bothers you at the bottom I would suggest maybe burning in some of the light areas at the top. This would also help the bring the focus to the flywheel even more.
Do you have any more shots from the mill? would like to see them.
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