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DPChallenge Forums >> Challenge Results >> Inconsistant voting, please explain.
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Showing posts 1 - 25 of 136, (reverse)
AuthorThread
 12/01/2004 05:51:08 AM · #1

This was my entry for Authority, entitled "The highest Authority" I was hoping for a 6 as I felt this was my best entry so far. This isn't a moan about my overall total, but can somebody please explain how this photo scored seven 10's and ten 9's as well as seven 1's and seven 2's. Like it or loathe it, I don't think this photo is a 1. (Sorry, end of winge)
 12/01/2004 05:54:24 AM · #2
welcome to the club. something is really not ok if you got anything low on that pic. i feel for you. but don't give up, don't give some people the pleasure of getting to you. do it for you. better luck next time.

Message edited by author 2004-12-01 08:30:38.
 12/01/2004 05:56:17 AM · #3
You were placed 29th and you are upset????. The subject matter is a very contentious issue that many people don,t see as authority. Sorry but when you submit subjects involving politics or religion don,t expect a ribbon, and be happy with your high placing.
 12/01/2004 05:59:28 AM · #4
Different viewers have different taste. Welcome to DPC, and to the art world in general.

-Terry
 12/01/2004 06:00:40 AM · #5
Look a) you are in the top 20% of the challenge, something you should pay more attention to than your particular score - a score of 6 in this challenge would have put you in exactly 7th place in the challenge, and while it's not a bad image it definately wasn't the 7th best there (IMHO).

And b) as I, and some others commented, the overexposed candle at the top of the image really is distracting. Overall a good image, but I really do think it finished where it should have.

Message edited by author 2004-12-01 06:01:09.
 12/01/2004 06:34:27 AM · #6
Thanks for your comments, but for those of you who think I'm complaining, I am relativly new to photography and this site, but I know enough to be aware that my image was not the best in the challenge and I am delighted to have come 29th. I was only asking if anyone thought this photo genuinely deserved the 1's it attracted.
 12/01/2004 06:48:09 AM · #7
I gave it a 6. Part of your potential problem is subject choice. At any time you choose a religious or political subject matter (crosses, American flags, etc) expect you will get more outlier votes. For those who do not practice Christian based religions, the cross is not a sign of authority. Therefore, those people may, and I stress may have decided to vote it as not meeting the challenge.

It happens. Solid shot in my book. Welcome to DPC. :)

Clara
 12/01/2004 08:44:50 AM · #8
Hi Russ,
I have viewed your photograph and even with the few flaws I do not see where a 1 or 2 should be given out on your picture. I believe there are two factors that caused the 1 and 2.
1. The biggest factor is the subject matter. Now I disagree with this totally. I believe a voter should be able to judge a photo even though they may not have the same beliefs as presented in the photograph. I submitted one of the Bible during the ‘hope’ challenge and experience the same thing. But my picture was nowhere as good as yours so some of my low scores were because of setup and technique.
2. and the second factor is I don̢۪t care how good your photograph is or what the subject matter is, there are going to be voters voting all over the 1-10 scale. Some low, some high, and some in the middle.

See the chart below and you will see just how differently users vote on the same picture. Each red dot with a line from the average represents what vote or vote average [if more than 1 vote was received during update]. As you can see votes fell all over the place.



Message edited by author 2004-12-04 04:30:06.
 12/01/2004 08:54:09 AM · #9
Wow and I thought I followed my vote closely.

Almost every photo in a challenge (Including the ribbon photos) will have 1s and 2s as well as 9s and 10s thats just the way it happens here. Like it or not.
 12/01/2004 09:04:56 AM · #10
My Heroes shot was of a cross and i got about the same 1 and 2 count as you, proportionally to the total votes cast. Your pic is better, but then I see 1 and 2 on EVERY picture, even winners.

I wish it was a coded part of the site that to leave a 1,2 or 3 you HAVE to leave a comment. A) it might encourage some feedback as to why and or who is giving 1s and 2s. B)it might reduce hte number of 1s and 2s as the hassle of leaving htem, having your name attached to the low vote, etc. Perhaps, just maybe, it might make a voter think a bit and cause them to vote higher.

I start voting at 5. Average. A decent pic but nothing technically bad, not emotionally moving. I add or subt 1 often. To get less than 4 from me you have to have some major flaw or be off topic. Occasionally I give a very low score and that is usually to too small pics or things that are just plain ridiculous/can't make them out. 90% of the time i comment on them as to why. I wish all would!
12/01/2004 09:31:49 AM · #11
giving 1's and 2's should be accompanied by feedback.... or disregarded for counting towards the average. bet you will see more responsible scoring or, due to the feedback, improved contributions. i for one has so much to learn that constructive, yip, constructive critisicm will benefit me greatly. thanks to members such as colda, whatdewuc, nordicgirl and blemt who can tell you why they score you low... from you i learn.

Message edited by author 2004-12-01 09:35:49.
 12/01/2004 09:34:33 AM · #12
Originally posted by gibun:
giving 1's and 2's should be accompanied by feedback.... or disregarded for counting towards the average.

My only question is why? Surely 10's and 9's distort the average just as much as 1's and 2's? Everyone has their own voting technique, and they have a right to use the entire voting scale should they decide to do so...
 12/01/2004 09:38:05 AM · #13
Originally posted by Manic:
Originally posted by gibun:
giving 1's and 2's should be accompanied by feedback.... or disregarded for counting towards the average.

My only question is why? Surely 10's and 9's distort the average just as much as 1's and 2's? Everyone has their own voting technique, and they have a right to use the entire voting scale should they decide to do so...


the idea is not to disregard, it's to force feedback to those who obviously need it. 9 and 10 scores by inference already got feedback. nope, not discard but for growing awareness.

12/01/2004 09:41:01 AM · #14
Originally posted by gibun:
the idea is not to disregard, it's to force feedback to those who obviously need it. 9 and 10 scores by inference already got feedback. nope, not discard but for growing awareness.

OK, but how do you figure that 9's and 10's infer feedback? I'm equally interested in why someone liked my shot as I am in why someone didn't like my shot...
 12/01/2004 09:44:26 AM · #15
how do you go about seeing where people have voted for your own submission?
 12/01/2004 09:44:36 AM · #16
Originally posted by Manic:
...how do you figure that 9's and 10's infer feedback?


People enthusiastic enough to give your shot a 9 or 10 tend to leave feedback voluntarily.
 12/01/2004 09:47:22 AM · #17
Originally posted by gusto:
how do you go about seeing where people have voted for your own submission?


After the challenge ends, you can click the photo to see the scoring breakdown in a chart. During the challenge, some members will click the update button incessantly and figure out each vote with a calculator as it comes it. This is not healthy behavior. ;-)
 12/01/2004 09:48:54 AM · #18
Originally posted by Manic:
Originally posted by gibun:
the idea is not to disregard, it's to force feedback to those who obviously need it. 9 and 10 scores by inference already got feedback. nope, not discard but for growing awareness.

OK, but how do you figure that 9's and 10's infer feedback? I'm equally interested in why someone liked my shot as I am in why someone didn't like my shot...


good point, i agree feedback is important at all levels. but by the time i get a nine, ten.... it's easier to infer the member liked my pic enough to not have any feedback. a 1, 2... well, i really want to know what's to improve.

whatever we do, we must consider squeezing more feedback from our members, (I'm guilty too) even if it means, like in some sports, ignoring both the higest and the lowest scores not accompanied by feedback.

12/01/2004 10:13:09 AM · #19
Originally posted by gibun:
the idea is not to disregard, it's to force feedback to those who obviously need it.


this has been discussed in length so many many many times before, and i must agree with those who believe that this "forced feedback" is no good - people vote the way they see fit and comment on pictures that they want to comment on... i like it like this... i also really liked how Kavey once said something to this effect - that if the comment for 1, 2, 3, or whatever score was indeed required, she would have a prepared comment for these purposes which would be that she is giving this score because she feels that this is the score that this picture deserves... that's all! don't remember the exact quote, unfortunately...

for this particular shot i must admit that photographs of a printed text almost always leave me cold, no matter what the subject is... it just doesn't go well with my feeling that each photograph should speak for itself in its own "words", without the help of text... this picture does have some additional elements, but not enough to interest me... didn't get to vote on it in this challenge, otherwise i might not or might not have mentioned it in a comment...
12/01/2004 10:27:12 AM · #20
Just as Christian images or American political images will almost always receive several 1's and 2's, so will images which show nudity or disturbing images which show blood or are considered 'too real'.

It's a fact on this site...

The only solution is for everybody to be fair when critiquing the photo. Some of my least favourite photos (as far as subject matter goes) are Gil P's 'sensual' photos because I think male hormones are too easy to manipulate resulting in an automatically greater appeal towards photos of nekkid girls...but guess what?

They're incredible photos and he does a really good job so I have to reward those photos accordingly! We need to judge the photographs, not the photographer's motives...
 12/01/2004 10:33:48 AM · #21
I know I am startled to see my images receive ones. I have quite a bit of experience and background in art and its elements. I don't have experience with all the technical aspects of digital photography, but I truly won't accept that my images are a 1.

I view it as someone else's garbage and I refuse to let crap stick to me. It's their problem, not mine. I do smirk at their cowardly slinking away without a comment after giving a one. It speaks volumes about who they are and what they are all about.

I have done a lot of reading of the forums on this site the last few weeks, and there are some very angry, bitter, vindictive people. What a horrendous burden to bear. Ah, well, I choose not to own it.
 12/01/2004 11:06:05 AM · #22
Originally posted by thatcloudthere:
We need to judge the photographs, not the photographer's motives...


Doesn't the content have a huge part to play on how you judge a photograph though ? If it personally disgusts you I'd like to know. If it inspires you, makes you have a relgious moment or makes you fall over laughing, then I'd like to know.

I hopefully don't put pictures up for dispassionate, disconnected, emotionless review. If I wanted to produce stuff like that, I'd post some powerpoint slides from my last talk.

For me at least, good photography should have some emotional connection with the viewer - if it is so bland they don't care and only want to talk about sharpening or focus then mostly I think I've failed utterly.
 12/01/2004 11:13:20 AM · #23
You got a normal distribution curve...like most people, some are more skewed to the right, some to the left and some bang in the midlle...the laws of statistics being demonstrated in each challenge every week. Even the Blue ribbons get ones and twos...so...

Message edited by author 2004-12-01 11:13:53.
 12/01/2004 11:15:19 AM · #24
Well, I think there are several issues at work in this image. First of all, I'm not christian, so I would not suggest that is authority. Secondly, The Artist did not actually say it was authority, but asked. So, having a subject I don't see as fitting the challenge, and then having the title ask me if it was in the challenge, it didn't meet the challenge for me.

Now, I didn't get to voting on that one, but I would have given it a three. The text is captured well, but the flare from the votive is distracting, and the crucifix looks soft, blown-out, and completely lacking in detail.
 12/01/2004 11:38:14 AM · #25
Originally posted by Gordon:
Originally posted by thatcloudthere:
We need to judge the photographs, not the photographer's motives...


Doesn't the content have a huge part to play on how you judge a photograph though ? If it personally disgusts you I'd like to know. If it inspires you, makes you have a relgious moment or makes you fall over laughing, then I'd like to know.

I hopefully don't put pictures up for dispassionate, disconnected, emotionless review. If I wanted to produce stuff like that, I'd post some powerpoint slides from my last talk.

For me at least, good photography should have some emotional connection with the viewer - if it is so bland they don't care and only want to talk about sharpening or focus then mostly I think I've failed utterly.


Um...yeah, exactly. All I'm saying is that if it disgusts you it shouldn't automatically be scored low.

It's not a glee-o-meter...it's a vote whether the photo is 'good' or 'bad'...
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